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+--- Thread: Elementals, Carbuncle, and Egi (Oh My!) (/showthread.php?tid=10249)
Elementals, Carbuncle, and Egi (Oh My!) - Gwenneth - 02-22-2015
Good day!
I've been giving a lot of thought to my character's short-term goals as I prepare to shimmy her into the RP community and (finally) type up her background, and in doing so found myself wondering about any possible connections between Hydaelyn's Elementals, the Fae, Carbuncle, and summoned Primal Egi.
I'm hoping that our resident "Lorekeepers" can both correct me if I'm wrong and offer some explanation while I work on siphoning all of that lore myself. Forgive me if this post is poorly presented, as well. Trying my best not to be confusing, so here goes:
- Conjurers are able to draw forth borrowed power from the Aether of the world around them; gifted by the Elementals (which--according to the 1.0 Lore--really cover all six basic elements).
- Arcananima allows for the manipulation of Aether to summon forth a carbuncle from that Aether.
- Scholars will form a bond with one of the Fae that--from what I understand so far--are summoned in much the same way as a carbuncle. I've seen it mentioned somewhere on the forum (though I wish I can remember where) that the Faeries are potentially similar to Elementals, even if only vaguely.
- Summoners are able to call forth an Egi of some Primals in locations where the element of that Primal is known to be strongest. This one struck me, because the "ritual" for doing so seemed to be very much a combination of Arcanima and borrowing power from the Elementals or external Aether--or at least that it could be done that way from a roleplaying standpoint, instead of just using internal aether.
These are the burning questions I've been mulling over this weekend, huzzah!
RE: Elementals, Carbuncle, and Egi (Oh My!) - Sounsyy - 02-22-2015
Yar, so at the Las Vegas Lore Panel, a similar question was brought up and Fernehalwes confirmed that Elementals, Sprites, Carbuncles, and Fae are all kin. The latter three, (Sprites, Fae, Carbuncles) are Lesser Elementals. But they are all beings made entirely out of aether.
No mention was made of Egis, though I believe this is because Egis aren't technically sentient beings in their own rite. When a Primal... or any being really is slain, their soul and aether is violently separated from their corporeal being. It's this jarring separation that washes a Summoner in the slain Primal's essence or aether. (It's also how we get Soul Crystals and Aetherially-enhanced gear from dungeons.) From this, a Summoner can re-concentrate this aether to form the essence of the Primal, conquer that essence, and bend it to the user's will. Very much like enthralling the Primal, as Primals so often try to do with Men.
(02-22-2015, 12:01 PM)Reima Wrote: Can a Conjurer who has earned the trust of the Elementals utilize the "external" Aether of Hydaelyn to call out a Carbuncle?Â
Well, Conjury (despite the routes of the name Conjury) is not really a summoning art. It's more a discourse with nature. Conjurers meditate on their spells, feel the nature around them, then focus that connection to bend and shape nature to their desire. In 1.0, this included all six elements. (Because Elementals were of all elements of the world, not just three. >< ) So while I don't believe a Conjurer would be able to call a Carbuncle or Sprite... I do think that a Conjurer would be able to communicate with one.
The summoning aspect of Arcanima may lie completely within the mechanics of the magic itself. Ancient glyphs, enchanted ink to enhance potency... we don't know for sure. What we can surmise is that modern day Arcanists and the Scholars of 1,600 year old Nym were likely descendant from the Summoners of Allag, 5000 years ago. These ancient Summoners fought Elder Primals and bent them to their will with ease. This expert command over aether manipulation in previously-living entities (Primals) may have since evolved into a communion and control over still living aetherial beings, like the Fae.
Some thousand years in the future, the descendants of modern day Arcanima may be able to commune and summon actual Elementals to their will. (That will be a scary day.)
But hope this helps! ^^ Sorry most of it is guesswork. Lemme know if you have more questions!
RE: Elementals, Carbuncle, and Egi (Oh My!) - ChewableMorphine - 02-22-2015
(02-22-2015, 12:01 PM)Reima Wrote: Good day!
I've been giving a lot of thought to my character's short-term goals as I prepare to shimmy her into the RP community and (finally) type up her background, and in doing so found myself wondering about any possible connections between Hydaelyn's Elementals, the Fae, Carbuncle, and summoned Primal Egi.
I'm hoping that our resident "Lorekeepers" can both correct me if I'm wrong and offer some explanation while I work on siphoning all of that lore myself. Forgive me if this post is poorly presented, as well. Trying my best not to be confusing, so here goes:
So, for the sake of trying to hash out pieces of my character's Self (and just plain having something neat to think about because I like to know these weird things), is there some connection between all of the above when you peer past the curtain and into the Aether that's coursing through the world? Can a Conjurer who has earned the trust of the Elementals utilize the "external" Aether of Hydaelyn to call out a Carbuncle? Can Faeries, Carbuncle, and Egi all be potential manifestation of the Elementals in their own way, if not Elementals themselves? Is there a connection there at all? Can there be one?
- Conjurers are able to draw forth borrowed power from the Aether of the world around them; gifted by the Elementals (which--according to the 1.0 Lore--really cover all six basic elements).
- Arcananima allows for the manipulation of Aether to summon forth a carbuncle from that Aether.
- Scholars will form a bond with one of the Fae that--from what I understand so far--are summoned in much the same way as a carbuncle. I've seen it mentioned somewhere on the forum (though I wish I can remember where) that the Faeries are potentially similar to Elementals, even if only vaguely.
- Summoners are able to call forth an Egi of some Primals in locations where the element of that Primal is known to be strongest. This one struck me, because the "ritual" for doing so seemed to be very much a combination of Arcanima and borrowing power from the Elementals or external Aether--or at least that it could be done that way from a roleplaying standpoint, instead of just using internal aether.
These are the burning questions I've been mulling over this weekend, huzzah!
You're right on the ball. From what I understand, anything to do with summoning is essentially clumping up a bunch of aether to make a thing. Black mages take aether from themselves to throw shit through a stick and white mages do... things. But yeah, Summoners go about taking a bit of a primal's power (a la primal summoning) to make a babby incarnation. Carbuncles are like a non-aspected version of an egi, and fae are... things.
RE: Elementals, Carbuncle, and Egi (Oh My!) - Gwenneth - 02-22-2015
Thank you both so much for the swift replies (and Sounsyy, I was hoping you would appear!). This not only answers my questions and clarifies things, but provides what I needed to fill in the lines for my character, as well as leaving some doors slightly ajar for her future.
I adore the idea of everything being interconnected in one way or another behind the scenes, and OOCly figuring out how all of the mumbo-jumbo works is a...ah...hobby, so thank you again!
(02-22-2015, 12:23 PM)Sounsyy Wrote:(02-22-2015, 12:01 PM)Reima Wrote: Can a Conjurer who has earned the trust of the Elementals utilize the "external" Aether of Hydaelyn to call out a Carbuncle?Â
Well, Conjury (despite the routes of the name Conjury) is not really a summoning art. It's more a discourse with nature. Conjurers meditate on their spells, feel the nature around them, then focus that connection to bend and shape nature to their desire. In 1.0, this included all six elements. (Because Elementals were of all elements of the world, not just three. >< ) So while I don't believe a Conjurer would be able to call a Carbuncle or Sprite... I do think that a Conjurer would be able to communicate with one.
I realized that I worded my question totally wrong like a silly-face! I was moreso wondering--hypothetically--if an Arcanist would be be able to utilize "external" aether for their summoning instead of their "internal" aether, since there's a known difference. Communing with nature and Elementals and asking to "borrow" the aether for that purpose.
Say if as a Conjurer I am able to hear and communicate with the lesser elementals (like Carbuncle, etc) as you mentioned may be possible: Could, through that discourse and meditation used in Conjury, permission be granted to use some of the techniques of Arcanima? It seems a nice idea and now I'm wondering if it's plausible. My character is a Conjurer, but dipping into Arcanima ICly while trying to maintain as much of a connection to the elementals as she can (in short).Â
Apologies if I'm being confusing--I think I may need more coffee, but I enjoy the discussion!
RE: Elementals, Carbuncle, and Egi (Oh My!) - Sounsyy - 02-22-2015
That kind of dips into the whole "can one mage learn multiple forms of magic" quandary. Theoretically, it's possible, but we have absolutely no lore (yet) of any one mage being able to work multiple forms of magic. So you can really proceed however you see fit.
What presents the difficulty, is that the way the magicks work is so notably different from one another, that the mix-match may be very taxing to the individual. Arcanists channel their own aether through ancient glyphs and geometric shapes that seem to focus or even dictate the type of spell cast. Their potency is enhanced through the aetherially enhanced ink on the grimoire's page. There's an Alchemist quest that suggests without this ink, their spells lack potency or their glyphs could potentially fail.
On the other hand, a Conjurer draws aether from the nature surrounding her and uses her mind to amplify the potency and her wand (made of un-worked wood) to focus the spell. So it's almost the reverse of Arcanima in that respect. The Conjurer's body amplifies the magic, while the tool focuses. Whereas in Arcanima the tool both amplifies and focuses, while the body is merely the source, since they are (seemingly) unable to draw from nature into their grimoire.
Theoretically, a Conjurer could become an Arcanist and draw from her surroundings and focus it through her tool to cast a spell. But at that point... you've really created a new magic that isn't entirely Arcanima and not entirely Conjury. So it's really difficult to speculate how that would work out.
You'll find that there are plenty of roleplayers out there who study and control multiple forms of magic though, so if it's what you want to do I say go for it and play with it! As your character grows as an Arcanist, she may find that when she attempts to summon a Carbuncle, a Sprite answers her call instead, as that is a Lesser elemental Elemental, which relates more to Conjury. She might not be able to escape that nature aspect of her roots, despite her working geometry and glyphs that do not emulate that nature. Could definitely be something very fun to play with! ^^