The upcoming machinists is making me a little worried about how they may be used; or mis-used in RP.
As we know, machinists thing - as a class - is they have both guns, and various gadgets, not least drones and turrets. The lore (as seen in the crafting classes) establishes that both the ceruleum distribution systems used by the gun, and the clockwork, mammot-esque tech that runs the drones are both very complex bits of technology (indeed, the clockwork components used in Mammots are 2 and 3 star GSM projects)
What has me worried, is that we'll have a new generation of "soldier" and "special-ops" characters, who are all armed with guns and drones/gadgets that they just got "off the shelf" as part of their wargear, which'll detract from established characters who have a genuine aptitude for machinery..
Machinists finally give technically adept characters a chance to formally weaponise their engineering skills. But I fear that those characters will be buried in the deluge.
It seems to me the "answer" is personal restraint - in the same way some 'scholars' may have barrier spells ICly, but no fairy. Thus many styled as soldiers will have guns, but not drones and gadgets ICly. But obviously that comes down to how far the individual chooses to handicap their skills at an IC level, and I'm just worried for the engineers out there their IC achievements will be lost if it becomes entirely normal for the "next generation soldiers" to have guns and drones anyway.
Certainly from my discussions with people, a lot if not the majority of people want to play machinists because they have guns, not because they're engineers.
Just something that'd been niggling at me lately :p
I'm not terribly worried about Machinist, if only because I've already met so many gun-wielding roleplayers pre-announcement and I'm 99% sure they aren't adapting the class, just the imagery of it.
There will always be a few people that RP as being something out of Metal Gear in the environment of XIV. But, at the same hand, there will be good RPers who know which boundaries to stay into.
From what Madda knows so far about the Machinists, they do have their guns and such, but they'll still be several disadvantages.
First, guns, technology, stuff. The majority of the people in the three city states have almost no clue of the technology. There are a few RPCs that have a history with it, but unless they know how to fix whatever issue themselves, damaged widgets and such are going to remain broke with having very limited options of repairing it.
Second, unless stated otherwise somewhere, they are going to have to reload at some point. Archers and such can get another arrow, but Machinists are going to have a tough time counting ammo, keeping stock, reloading, and being on the defensive while doing so.
Adding partially to the third, with many RPCs having loved ones dying to Garleans, your character may appear sympathetic to their cause. While interesting for RP, it's going to be awkward explaining yourself when asked about the stuff.
But the main answer will just be to keep digging through the rough. There will always be a few diamonds.
Madda's machinist will have a small hoverbot she can ride on for short periods of time, and usually will spend her time in Limsa, shooting fireworks and stuff. Possibly illegal.
I just wanted a class that could use guns. I never asked for the drones. I was originally hoping they were tied to the Limsa Lominsa musketeer guild that seems to already exist in the game, but that doesn't look like it will be the case.
However, my character has made a pretty good living salvaging and selling magitek gear taken from Garleans. He's surrounded by it, and it makes sense for him to learn how to use it himself. If these new magitek weapons can also help him in battle, he will use them. I plan on using the time leveling Machinist to 60 as my character spending serious time learning how to tinker with magitek. I feel that it's an appropriate path for him to go from being somewhat of a layman to an expert. Kind of like a montage where he obtains the technology, learns how it works, and then learns how to fight with it.
Kinda with Dogberry, in that I was hoping for the machinist to be tied to Limsa Lominsa's Musketeer Guild. However, not likely going to be the case. But Sounsyy has been a Knight of the Barricuda for nearly 7 years now, so she knows how to use a gun, but I've never been able to portray that ICly. She's a crap shot at best, but still would be cool to be able to use a gun like the Lominsan Musketeer she's supposed to be.
As for magitek and drones, those probably won't end up being IC for her. She hates magitek. If the drones end up being clockwork though, or of goblin make... maybe. It all depends on the lore for the machinist class, but the Lominsans have been using guns for decades, maybe even a hundred years, and for the last 5 years, Privateers have been paid to knock over Garlean vessels and steal their magitek to give to Limsa's researchers and the Garlond Ironworks. So if the Machinist class ends up having some connection with Limsa, it wouldn't be very surprising to me.
(03-19-2015, 12:09 PM)Sounsyy Wrote: [ -> ]So if the Machinist class ends up having some connection with Limsa, it wouldn't be very surprising to me.
Based on the screenshots we've seen, there is a clip of what appears to be a machine shop with the machinist class icon in the background, and the architecture of the building is distinctly Coerthan, I highly suspect the machinists guild will actually be in Coerthas.
Be interesting to see the lore behind it; the Coerthas don't seem to be strangers to invention though looking at their huge anti-dragon harpoon cannons.
I know Kurt'll be more machinist than marksman. Simply put he has no significant firearm training thus far. He might know how a gun works, he might think of 'improvements' to it but at the end of the day he's no crack shot with the rifle. Maybe over time Though. I could totally see him tinkering and fabricating drones that could help him out. For better or worse he's more on the technical side of the Machinist class rather than the cowboy side.Â
Like Dogberry, Kurt's rise to Machinist 60 will be him getting better with a rifle and being a little more creative or if the skillset allows it, more explosive with what he could do to the drones and the guns. That and I hope people like miss Cliodhna and Nako would play a part in this as well.
Bri is going machinist but she is going to be more focused on gadgets and tech rather then guns. She will have one obviously but won't be holding anymore then that. She finds them to be a cheap way of fighting. She is going to be self taught and well..I expect several of her gadgets to explode on her during use since she is blind and having to learn. By then she should have her aether sensing maxed but colored wires are going to own her.
The main thing is that I think someone focusing on all tech could be refreshing if done right. I already see plenty of people being mercs and whatnot. I don't see it getting worse?
(03-19-2015, 11:58 AM)Madda Wrote: [ -> ]Second, unless stated otherwise somewhere, they are going to have to reload at some point. Archers and such can get another arrow, but Machinists are going to have a tough time counting ammo, keeping stock, reloading, and being on the defensive while doing so.
Ammo and then the powder, or whatever is used to ignite and fire said ammo. The rounds themselves could be forged from out of like a bullet mold. Reloading would be pretty tough, definitely, especially if there's a huge monster snapping at you. I suppose a machinist could ICly use a blade for CQC? xD
I was hoping to make Makyn an IC gun wielder at some point, him taking forever because he'd be so bad at it at first, probably falling on his ass his first firing attempt. /snrk
It'll be no better or worse then the million "Brooding Anti-Heroes" or "Fortunetellers".
None of my three gun-users will have any drones. They're all soldier-esque types first with just the guns. Chao will play around with autonomous drones, but that's a different field because she is an engineer and not a proper gunner, so she'll have the drones but not the guns.
I've been playing Sophia as a Machinist/Gadgeteer for long time now. She owns several firearms, but the excuse has always been that it would easily red flag her as Garlean, and that Eorzean firearms are too unwieldy to use (comparatively). For me, the only thing Machinist will do is give her a bit of wiggle room in deciding what she can or can't use in public. Hell, I may not even use the job for RP at all; the Magitek Bit minion and the Ninja job serves pretty well for the aesthetic I'm going for anyway.
(03-19-2015, 12:32 PM)Erik Mynhier Wrote: [ -> ]It'll be no better or worse then the million "Brooding Anti-Heroes" or "Fortunetellers".
One of those takes creativity to weave. The other requires you to have played FF8 or watched Advent Children.
I don't see this as becoming any more of a problem than the sudden influx of infighters that supposedly exploded onto the scene with the release of ROG/NIN. You'll notice that plenty of roleplayers have shown restraint in that regard, merely adding (or, in the case of characters who already had these skills, merely visualizing) knives and daggers to their repertoire instead of going full-blown ninjutsu-wielding ninjaaaaaaaaa. I suspect we'll see something similar with Machinist.
Case in point, I'll be adding a small pistol to Osric's "ace-up-my-sleeve" deck. He's an awful shot under pressure... but it takes zero to no skill to draw a pistol, place it against someone's temple or chest, and pull the trigger. I might be throwing a musket his way, as well... but that'll be sharpshooting, which again he's awful at, it'll rarely happen anyway, and when it does he's going to take so much time aiming down the sights that the occasional hit might come off as justified.
Those are my only IC uses for MCH, and I won't be surprised if we'll see more shenanigans like those. Am I worried we'll see adept engineers come out of the woodwork to crowd out those who are already roleplaying as experts in that field? Not really.
(03-19-2015, 12:12 PM)K Wrote: [ -> ]Based on the screenshots we've seen, there is a clip of what appears to be a machine shop with the machinist class icon in the background, and the architecture of the building is distinctly Coerthan, I highly suspect the machinists guild will actually be in Coerthas.
That shot was actually a part of the video showing off Foundation, the lower class sector of Ishgard. So most definitely Coerthan.