Hydaelyn Role-Players

I've been RPing for a little while as my main Junè, however once Heavensward releases, my WIP alt Chris who will be a Machinist will emerge from the land of OOC. The issue is, I find he might be a little OP for heavy RP.

Quick background, I wrote Junè and Chris for a massive story a long time ago (like 8 years ago), I reuse them for RPGs and MMOs because they were my favorite and most detailed characters I've written about.

Therefore I know Christopher's personality, in fact Chris was the main protagonist in my story while Junè oft took a secondary roll, however after I matured I realized he's a bit of a Gary Sue and OP (I actually made Junè to counter this). 

So before I RP with Chris I want to tweak things to make him more interesting.

Here's his usual background in my story:

• Brilliant human (Hyur) with a knack for building things using both his skills in engineering, physics, and understanding of magic (or in this case Aether).
  
• He decent knowledge and some minor skill in most magical fields though usually prefers to manipulate a situation to his desire or use traps to avoid combat at all.
  
• His history is basic, parents tried to take advantage of his skills in building things when he was a teen, he had enough and walked out to make his own life, he's become quite wealthy on his designs.
  

(In my story I wrote revolving him more things happen making him even more powerful, like if you take the MSQ literally ICly with full lvl50 jobs across the board OP... So granted that level wont be applied here )


To summarize ICly: 

• He has basic skills in both Thaumaturge and Clergy jobs and he's a skilled machinist (once it comes out). 
  
• Jack of all trades yet master of known in crafting classes. 
  
• Quite brilliant in most sciences and philosophy, wealthy, and has a simplistic background though does come from wealth so can read and write. 
  
• Personality, he prefers to let others fight and can manipulate them via words to do so.
  

So any tips or advice? Any criticisms on lore or anything else?
Naturally there may be further discrepancies depending on the background of machinist job once more details are released about the job.

Thank you.

The basic idea sounds good to me!  However, one comment I would make is that neither Thaumaturgy nor Conjury are really based upon intelligence.  Arcanist, is, however, and conveniently covers both healing and destructive magic.  That might be worth considering as an alternative

I was considering Arcanist but I'm not fond of Chris having a familiar, though reading the rest of the lore on the wikia makes it seem more interesting. Maybe ICly he doesn't use a familiar since he's primarily a machinist anyway. 
Thanks for the advice Aya

(03-26-2015, 02:09 AM)Meoix Wrote: [ -> ]I was considering Arcanist but I'm not fond of Chris having a familiar, though reading the rest of the lore on the wikia makes it seem more interesting. Maybe ICly he doesn't use a familiar since he's primarily a machinist anyway. 
Thanks for the advice Aya

Then don't have one!  Some arcanists RP having one, but many do not!

You're welcome!

(03-26-2015, 01:49 AM)Meoix Wrote: [ -> ]

• Brilliant human.... with a knack... skills in....
  
• Decent knowledge and some minor skill in...
  
• ...skills in building things when he was a teen... quite wealthy...
  

• ...skills in both Thaumaturge and Clergy jobs and he's a skilled machinist...
  
• Jack of all trades yet master of known in crafting classes. 
  
• Quite brilliant in most sciences and philosophy, wealthy... a simplistic background... can read and write. 
  
• ...he prefers to let others fight and can manipulate them via words to do so.
  

I'm going to be brutally honest with you, so please prepare yourself.

Flaws.

Where are his flaws? Does he have any? You can do all the tweaking you want with this concept, yet so long as the character is flawless, to my eyes, it is still a Gary Stu.

Take a moment to step back and look at what you've written. He is brilliant, was a child prodigy, he's wealthy, jack of all trades AND a master? Skilled thaum, conj, machinist.... he can read and write... and you can opt out of any life-threatening situation at will because he's also a master manipulator. And yet, for all these advantages, you've not listed a single flaw to balance him out.

Let's take a look at my main character for a contrast. For all his advantages, Osric still has his fair share of flaws which round him out as a character and make him seem more real and alive than the average Super McAwesome Cool Dude the Thirteenth. Osric might seem eloquent and well-spoken at times, but his language is rough and coarse, which some find distasteful. Furthermore, behind his somewhat-false humility he hides a confidence that reeks of arrogance, and that really rubs a lot of people the wrong way. He can read and write, but he is not well-read; he is more street-smart than book-smart. He knows very little of most fields of craft or trade, and magitek engineering is so far beyond him as to seem almost alien. Though he is a trained pugilist and fledling monk, his true proficiency is with knives, daggers, and other small-arms... yet focusing too much on one or the other frequently leads to his skills with the other growing rusty and unreliable, so it's a constant balancing act. And while he knows his way around an axe, he is so abysmal with one that he's better off not even picking one up.

A character needs to be bad at things, if you're looking to make them someone worth reading about and playing alongside. If you're looking to fulfill a power fantasy, though, by all means, go ahead with what you have.

To build off of what Melkire said, I also don't see very many flaws. I'm not gonna really bother explaining why, because I think Melk does a good job of it, so I'm just gonna hop straight to the point. You want my brutal, honest advice?

Axe his combat/magical prowess. A lot of the times in real life, the highly skilled crafters and artisans are not very good at using the things they create. It's like the saying, "God only gives with one hand." I think all his skills outside of crafting and building should be subpar at best. Prodigy at something or not, it still would take a great deal of time to hone all of the crafts and skills. Having a natural talent for something doesn't negate the years of training needed to hone those skills. Where would he fit in the rest?

Also, wording. This one is more minor, but 'can manipulate others', I would just completely replace as manipulative and 'will try to weasel his way out of a fight and make others do the swinging for him.' This is speaking as the player of a character who is nigh impossible to swindle into a fight. I always feel it's better to make statements like that more open ended so it doesn't come off too OP, I guess? (It's late, words are hard right now.)

I'll echo Osric in that flaws make the character. Having proficiency in a handful of trades and skills is fantastic. However, having negatives to balance them out are what makes your character real. Taking their personality, and being real with it is important.

When I was building Endemerrin, I gave him a positive, and then thought of the negatives that would accompany it. I'll throw down a few examples of some of my thought processes~


Pro: He has a magitek prosthetic arm. It's made from cermet and other strong metals. Lots of positives there.
Con: It's prone to failure. Causes him significant stress or pain under certain circumstances. Easily disabled. I've a myriad of other negatives with this subject in particular, but, they're things I only let people find out about through RP~

Pro: Very selfless. Puts others before himself.
Con: Acts without thinking ahead. Takes on more than he can handle, and some times winds up not helping the situation at all. Prone to injury. Hell, right now he's actually recovering from a nasty wound he received rushing to the aid of some friends.

Pro: Possessed of a keen mind for mechanics and magitek.
Con: Absolutely abysmal with magic and the "arcane". Couldn't really cast a spell to save his life. Riding with a bit of Domri's post, Merri is an adventurer at heart. Because of this, his engineering often gets shelved in favor of adventure. His prosthetic, however, keeps him tied to a life of some engineering. He'd probably have given up on it long ago in favor of adventuring, otherwise.


Basically, you need to give your character something to weigh him down. Things that are consistent. They don't have to be apparent, though. For every flaw I'm willing to openly talk about with my character, he has two more hidden underneath that only really come out through RP. Your character certainly doesn't have to be an open book, but those flaws need to be there, and they need to come out at some point~

Even if a character looks sharp on the outside, they might very well be a mess on the inside.

All that being a personal opinion as well, of course. Take it with a grain of salt. :>

I'll chime in what the others have.

Weaknesses and flaws are a rgeat way to find ways in how he interacts with people.

Is he afraid of anything?

is there anything he wishes he could do better?

Does he regret anything in his life?

Is he purposefully arrogant based on his skills with other things?

Are there any sorts of people he just doesnt like? Why?

Thank for the brutal honesty, I prefer that and it is exactly what I wanted (Being sensitive for a critique is pointless and and nothing is gained or learned).
All accurate points and I did neglect to point out his flaws which he has I assure you, sorry. I partially assumed some of the flaws were assumed which I shouldn't have done.
He's what he already has in that regard (I've never listed them so I have to recall)

He's the antithesis of Juné more or less.

His personality was based on an actual person when I designed him initially years ago, even his skill in engineering and the sciences (assuming you classify magic as a subset of magic) is based on said person. Also I forgot to add this detail, he has a mild case of Asperger's (technically only implied) in my story, I'm not sure how well that translates into FFXIV lore. His personality flaws circle around that.

Personality wise:

• He's often naive when it comes to relationships with himself and others 
  
• He's mildly arrogant which blinds him to his flaws. (This also comes with a pinch of stubbornness).
  
• Hard time keeping his thoughts to himself (may correct or argue with people in a conversation not involving him).
  
• Melkire mentioned more street smarts than book smart, in Chris's case lets reverse that and push it, he has very limited street smarts but good book smarts.
  
• I also forgot one of his most noticeable trait, his anxiety ticks, he flicks his fingers back and forth with his thumb on the same hand.
  

I'll tone down the manipulation bit by stating "He's been known on occasion to trick people into getting what he wants." as weaseling out've fights would be a subset of that and I did intend for a broader interpretation of that anyway.

Physically:

• Overall low physical skills, though I'll point out that due to his skill at reading people he is okay at predicting opponents.
  

Now combat/magical skills, he only has basic skill in healing and basic offensive magic due to his magical studies. Again since we don't know the lore behind machinist I can only speculate, however skill with engineering machinations would naturally come with skill using them. He's 29 in FFXIV so he's had sometime to build up his skills (and I did say master of none), though don't get me wrong I understand your point of the whole child prodigy thing.
So if I were to analyze him stat wise:

• Strength: much below average
  
• Vitality: slightly below average
  
• Dexterity: average
  
• Intelligence: above average
  
• Mind: slightly above average
  
• Piety: average
  

I will also point out that none of his pros and cons venture into the extreme, so none rule his personality.

Is he afraid of anything?
Not being able to solve a problem, (Not being able to rely on his mind, so also like losing in a strategic game) 

Is there anything he wishes he could do better?
He wishes for a better purpose in life, he feels like he's just floating in a cloud aimlessly. He's dissatisfied with a simple life of occasional crafting commissions, he wants to study nature and advance society via technology. Perhaps in FFXIV he enjoys studying Garlean tech and wishes for everyone to take queues (That was a quick suggestion I don't know if that'll stick).

Does he regret anything in his life?
His family relationships which are in tatters, his father is dead and he didn't fix the relationship prior to.

Is he purposefully arrogant based on his skills with other things?
He acknowledges his lack in other skills well enough.
 
Are there any sorts of people he just doesn't like? Why?
People he feels are ignorant overall or especially choosing to be ignorant.

I tend to believe that 'Mary Sue' lies in how you play a character more than how you plan them. I doubt that there will be much issue with your concept, as long as you are willing to allow him to loose, fail, and make mistakes on a regular bases. 

You seem to have given a fair bit of thought to his weaknesses already, which is certainly a step in the right direction. Now you just need to make sure that those weaknesses will actually cause grief to the character in practice.

One thing that I would caution you on is the manipulation point. While it is fine to say your character will try to manipulate, this is a collaborative RP environment and his success will always depend on who he is trying to manipulate. It's a cool strategy to have, but other writers may see through it and you should be prepared for that.

I also have one suggestion, on the subject of multiple classes. I have a character, who is quite book smart (much like yours seems to be) and has studied arcanima. However she is terrible at the physical spell casting. I RP her understanding and even being able to explain the concepts of ruin, physic, bio, aetherflow, and the carbuncle, but she has only ever succeeded in casting the first two and ruin is especially unreliable for her.

You may want to consider a skill set like this, since your character seems to be primarily a mechanist, with magic as a side study. You could have him understand multiple schools theoretically and reference that knowlage,while inventing, but let him fail miserably if he actually tries to cast spells? That would also solve the problem of not wanting a Carby. Maybe he just can't handle summoning it?

There's my two gil anyways.

(03-26-2015, 05:34 AM)Meoix Wrote: [ -> ]Physically:

• Overall low physical skills, though I'll point out that due to his skill at reading people he is okay at predicting opponents.
  

It looks like you have a good base, and like Klinzar says, it's all about how you RP him. The only thing that really stuck out to me is what I quoted specifically. What is he good at predicting because of reading?

I'm going to preface this by saying I'm known to be a stickler about anything fighting oriented because of my IRL background, so anything I say is just a dose of advice and not something you have to feel pressured to adhere to.

Is it what his opponent will do next? The thing about fighting is that while it is a huge portion mental, the only real way to get on the same level as someone is having the ability to physically respond. It's a very fine balance between the mind and the body and being able to quickly try and assume what your opponent will do generally falls into two categories.

If you already have fought or know the opponent you are fighting well, then it makes sense that you would try to predict what he/she is going to do next. But just know that that isn't what makes someone good. I don't want to completely derail, so I'm not going to go into the full 'what makes a good fighter a good fighter' speech.

My point, in the end, is maybe instead use his reading for preemptive knowledge. For example, instead of prediction, he knows that Opponent A is in super weighed down armor and has an axe, he knows one of the best ways to handle them is to keep moving quickly and out of reach to try and tire out his opponent rather than trade punches. That kind of pre-knowledge would be more valuable to him in the event of a fight than being able to predict something, because prediction is not actually a huge component in fighting at all.

Thanks again for your input, I love you guys for how eager you are to give good advice to new players, +1s.

Christopher's ability of manipulation would not revolve around my GM others of course, I personally would have to be creative enough to manipulate the the opponent. So his ability to control others is directly linked into my own ability to do so and my own actual intelligence making it more interesting. (I'm a good person in RL I swear :p).

What I could do for his magical abilities is limit them entirely to non-combat rolls. "Oh need your camp fire lit, no probs.", "Oh the wine is warm? Here I'll cool it a bit." and healing wise only simple to mild wounds outside of combat when he can concentrate on it, otherwise, he'd resort to potions or classic bandages and etc. This should balance his combat abilities a bit, especially because RP wise he really shouldn't be in combat too often, in my FC (that Juné is a merc in) he would take a supporting roll.

I think that makes him and Juné great complements to each other as well.

(03-26-2015, 05:24 PM)Meoix Wrote: [ -> ]Christopher's ability of manipulation would not revolve around my GM others of course, I personally would have to be creative enough to manipulate the the opponent. So his ability to control others is directly linked into my own ability to do so and my own actual intelligence making it more interesting.

It makes me happy inside to see people take this approach and I wish you luck!