(09-23-2014, 12:59 PM)Berrod Armstrong Wrote: [ -> ]There's a specific process for tempering/drowning/touching/etc, so it's possible for a primal fight to be narrated without the 'tempering' occuring! For Titan-egi it's the easiest to avoid, he doesn't 'temper' at all! It's not so hard after all 
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This is actually a good point, because I can't argue that there is any lore and proves that the first move a Primal does is Temper. In fact, there is lore to the contrary (Ramuh, Garuda, Titan) and Ifrit may not temper all the time, just that specific fight. If people want to argue that the Primals didn't TRY to Temper their character then I can't argue back.
I'm fine with that though. That's what lore discussion is for!
(09-23-2014, 01:02 PM)Warren Castille Wrote: [ -> ] (09-23-2014, 12:59 PM)Berrod Armstrong Wrote: [ -> ] (09-23-2014, 12:56 PM)ArmachiA Wrote: [ -> ]Honestly, the only source of contention is White Mage. You can even be a Dragoon pretty easily as long as you don't run around calling yourself The Slayer The Azure Dragoon.
Summoner looks difficult but it's actually easy enough to bypass, the HARDEST is actually fighting a Primal and not get tempered if your character doesn't have the Echo.
There's a specific process for tempering/drowning/touching/etc, so it's possible for a primal fight to be narrated without the 'tempering' occuring! For Titan-egi it's the easiest to avoid, he doesn't 'temper' at all! It's not so hard after all .
But then you're stuck with Chicken Nuggets for an avatar. And the first thing Ifrit does is try to temper you when he's summoned! It's certainly possible, but don't expect the Faceless RP Public Strawman to accept it.
Well, the first thing Ifrit does in the MSQ is try to temper the people brought before him -- because they were brought for that specific purpose!
When constructing a narrative -- especially if someone wants to have an Ifrit-Egi, one must be prepared to go beyond that cookie cutter encounter. Perhaps, "WE STORMED TEH_MAJRALAA BAES AND AMBUSH AN' CHUCKED A PEBL AT IFRIT B4 HE COULD TEMPR." It may seem far-fetched, but it isn't impossible, and a valid course of action if a player wants Ifrit-Egi as part of their character's
pokemon team.
I took a similar path with Berrod and his memory loss. I had to decide HOW he would discover that he had a few open chakras without the knowledge of what they even were. I made it happen during a thunderstorm in Upper La Noscea when lightning struck him during his training and he didn't die.
It can be a lot of fun crafting unique circumstances to give our characters what we wish for them to have, as long as it isn't ridiculous ("GO, HYDAELYN-EGI!").Â
And sometimes? You just gotta bullshit.
...also I don't like chicken nuggets. My friends call me crazy. PISTOLS AT DAWN, WARREN
(09-23-2014, 01:08 PM)Zyrusticae Wrote: [ -> ] (09-23-2014, 12:56 PM)ArmachiA Wrote: [ -> ]Summoner looks difficult but it's actually easy enough to bypass, the HARDEST is actually fighting a Primal and not get tempered if your character doesn't have the Echo.
Trying to play an Echo-less summoner would be silly right from the get-go.
In fact, trying to play as anyone who canonically fought a primal without the Echo is silly. The game gives you the option for a reason, just go ahead and take it. You don't win any points just for refusing to be a Warrior of Light, you know?
Some people don't want to be, though. Thats fine, there are ways around it.
Warrior of Light is people with the Echo? I thought WoL was the ones at Carteneau (Who may or may not have the Echo based on how confused his team looks at Derplander whenever he jumps into an Echo memory yet were still skipped ahead)
(09-23-2014, 01:08 PM)Zyrusticae Wrote: [ -> ] (09-23-2014, 12:56 PM)ArmachiA Wrote: [ -> ]Summoner looks difficult but it's actually easy enough to bypass, the HARDEST is actually fighting a Primal and not get tempered if your character doesn't have the Echo.
Trying to play an Echo-less summoner would be silly right from the get-go.
In fact, trying to play as anyone who canonically fought a primal without the Echo is silly. The game gives you the option for a reason, just go ahead and take it. You don't win any points just for refusing to be a Warrior of Light, you know?
Don't forget the Company of Heros defeated Titan. Without Echo. It's certainly doable. Maybe not to a small group of average adventurers, but if the primal isn't going to temper, it's feasible to say a mob would take them down. Eventually.
(09-23-2014, 01:12 PM)ArmachiA Wrote: [ -> ] (09-23-2014, 01:08 PM)Zyrusticae Wrote: [ -> ] (09-23-2014, 12:56 PM)ArmachiA Wrote: [ -> ]Summoner looks difficult but it's actually easy enough to bypass, the HARDEST is actually fighting a Primal and not get tempered if your character doesn't have the Echo.
Trying to play an Echo-less summoner would be silly right from the get-go.
In fact, trying to play as anyone who canonically fought a primal without the Echo is silly. The game gives you the option for a reason, just go ahead and take it. You don't win any points just for refusing to be a Warrior of Light, you know?
Some people don't want to be, though. Thats fine, there are ways around it.
Warrior of Light is people with the Echo? I thought WoL was the ones at Carteneau (Who may or may not have the Echo based on how confused his team looks at Derplander whenever he jumps into an Echo memory yet were still skipped ahead)
A person with the echo is not necessarily a Warrior of Light. You were correct regarding the tag being given to the adventuring participants at Carteneau, however! So it's perfectly easy to play a character with the echo and not be a super special MSQ hero. In the end, it's your choice!
(09-23-2014, 01:15 PM)Unnamed Mercenary Wrote: [ -> ] (09-23-2014, 01:08 PM)Zyrusticae Wrote: [ -> ] (09-23-2014, 12:56 PM)ArmachiA Wrote: [ -> ]Summoner looks difficult but it's actually easy enough to bypass, the HARDEST is actually fighting a Primal and not get tempered if your character doesn't have the Echo.
Trying to play an Echo-less summoner would be silly right from the get-go.
In fact, trying to play as anyone who canonically fought a primal without the Echo is silly. The game gives you the option for a reason, just go ahead and take it. You don't win any points just for refusing to be a Warrior of Light, you know?
Don't forget the Company of Heros defeated Titan. Without Echo. It's certainly doable. Maybe not to a small group of average adventurers, but if the primal isn't going to temper, it's feasible to say a mob would take them down. Eventually.
*Tidus.
(09-23-2014, 01:15 PM)Unnamed Mercenary Wrote: [ -> ] (09-23-2014, 01:08 PM)Zyrusticae Wrote: [ -> ] (09-23-2014, 12:56 PM)ArmachiA Wrote: [ -> ]Summoner looks difficult but it's actually easy enough to bypass, the HARDEST is actually fighting a Primal and not get tempered if your character doesn't have the Echo.
Trying to play an Echo-less summoner would be silly right from the get-go.
In fact, trying to play as anyone who canonically fought a primal without the Echo is silly. The game gives you the option for a reason, just go ahead and take it. You don't win any points just for refusing to be a Warrior of Light, you know?
Don't forget the Company of Heros defeated Titan. Without Echo. It's certainly doable. Maybe not to a small group of average adventurers, but if the primal isn't going to temper, it's feasible to say a mob would take them down. Eventually.
That's right! Titan actually DOESN'T temper. All he wants to do is protect his children. The other primals, as I said before, have specific processes of converting folks -- which a player can choose to have them fail to do.
It gets tricky. Safe to think ALL Warriors of Light had the Echo, but not all Echo users might be Warriors of Light; Everyone in the Scions has the Echo but the Echo manifests in different ways for everyone. We're not even sure if everyone with the Echo is immune to Tempering, we just have good reasons to suspect it - Specifically that it's a gift from Hydaelyn.
So that leads to a new potential issue: We know the Scions are looking for people with that sort of specific aetheric frequency; It's why you just so happened to keep running into your guiding NPC during the opening MSQ. Those Sharlayan goggles make it easy to find out who's force sensi- er, endowed with the Echo. So if you've got it, you've got Important Named People looking for you, too. Sure, they might have just never found you, but it's just one more "hey, wait a minute..." thing that the No Fun Allowed squads will frown upon.
Enh. It's fun to antagonize those sorts.
I think the main unwritten rule on roleplaying jobs is the same of roleplaying the main scenario: you can do it, just don't brag about it.
I am a black mage IC, and plan on each of my other characters to eventually unlock and RP their respective jobs. And Twelve know how many will want to RP Ninja soon.
Just do it but don't bring it up in chat, and let those you're RPing with decide by themselves if they want to see you as a job RPer or a class RPer. I have not been calling myself a BLM, but used terms such as "I've been practicing the dark arts for many cycles now." or "I exploit thaumaturgy, and the power of black magic within." etc., and surprisingly enough had people call me a Black Mage themselves.
I also have a Lancer alt who is simply obsessed with becoming a Dragoon (he isn't one yet). He's still all too green to down a dragon himself (or even... find one.), but whenever he has expressed his burning desire to become one, I've never received an hairy eye OOC, only very skeptical IC comments due to his awful low experience XD.
(09-23-2014, 01:08 PM)Zyrusticae Wrote: [ -> ] (09-23-2014, 12:56 PM)ArmachiA Wrote: [ -> ]Summoner looks difficult but it's actually easy enough to bypass, the HARDEST is actually fighting a Primal and not get tempered if your character doesn't have the Echo.
Trying to play an Echo-less summoner would be silly right from the get-go.
In fact, trying to play as anyone who canonically fought a primal without the Echo is silly. The game gives you the option for a reason, just go ahead and take it. You don't win any points just for refusing to be a Warrior of Light, you know?
Company of the Heroes is there show up that it is possible, since they beat titan!
Also, when the warrior of the light goes to fight some of the primals (ramuh, levi, and mog) the npcs normally tell him to gather a group to fight them. Maybe it is a bit of a plot hole, but since the game itself tells that it is possible, then...!
For my part, I stick to the classes for reference and pretty much do not consider the jobs to be something accessible to roleplay with the exception of the ones that have the very obvious loopholes. it's a lot less confusing and honestly, I don't see the point in having a character that is so powerful that they're basically up there in a league of heroes. Give a character some thraumaturgy powers and I'm positively sure they'd be able to kill a bandit or whatever they feel like throwing stuff at. In Sastra's case though, she doesn't even have a class. Her combat experiences consists of occasionally punching her way through a brawl, and beyond that she can use a bow for hunting purposes (Not so efficient against people).Â
I guess what I'm trying to say is that sure, there's some jobs you can play and some jobs that would make my character look at you a little weirdly (not to be confused with not wanting to RP with this person, generally speaking I'll always reserve the right for my character to think people are weird, in order to keep the RP flowing), but you don't HAVE to be a very powerful job class thingy in order to have fun, the regular classes do the same thing just as well. So why put yourself up for the hassle?Â
But you know, everyone has their preferred cup of tea.
I think we can all agree that certain things are Subjective and certain things are objective.
Subjective: Primals Always Temper, All Warriors of Light have the Echo, etc
Objective: There is only but one Slayer Azure Dragoon born into a generation, Elementals told people who weren't the Padjal to eff off.
I think anything in the subjective pile is interesting to discuss but on an RP stand point your free to play it as fast and loose as you want. Anything Objective is locked behind a lore gate.
This is actually why I like discussing lore, it's my favorite subject after all - player and game lore - , because discussions warrant what is and what is not subjective. As a player you can't possibly know everything and someone else may know something you don't.
I was under the impression that anyone with the Echo is a Warrior of Light by default simply because the Echo IS Hydaelyn's blessing under a different name, and anything blessed by Hydaelyn is in fact blessed under The Light of the Goddess.
As for the problem of being scouted by the Scions, my solution to that was very simple: she doesn't answer to them. They can't force her to join or to take their orders, only encourage her and pressure her to do so. And that can only go so far, especially with certain personality types that aren't prone or obliged towards feats of heroism. She'll still help occasionally, but only when doing so is convenient to her in some way. Pretty simple, really.
Not really a plothole, it's pretty clear that there are more than a few "Warriors of Light".
(09-23-2014, 01:33 PM)ArmachiA Wrote: [ -> ]This is actually why I like discussing lore, it's my favorite subject after all - player and game lore - , because discussions warrant what is and what is not subjective. As a player you can't possibly know everything and someone else may know something you don't.
This is mainly why I made this question~
Also I think the game makes it clear that there's like... hundreds if not thousands Warriors of Light.