+- Hydaelyn Role-Players (https://ffxiv-roleplayers.com/mybb18)
+-- Forum: Off-Topic (https://ffxiv-roleplayers.com/mybb18/forumdisplay.php?fid=42)
+--- Forum: Off-Topic Discussion (https://ffxiv-roleplayers.com/mybb18/forumdisplay.php?fid=14)
+--- Thread: Complaint/Rant/Thing: What's with all the aggression lately? (/showthread.php?tid=11216)
RE: Complaint/Rant/Thing: What's with all the aggression lately? - Cliodhna Eoghan - 04-22-2015
(04-22-2015, 03:38 PM)Warren Castille Wrote: My concern with that: There's already an existing attitude towards anyone with a certain number of reputation bumps. I won't invoke the off-topic "P" word but a week won't change any single person's opinion that's already on this board: The red names and green numbers are already noted by the people who will take umbrage with them.if people are staring to suggest removing the rep mods or hiding them, then maybe they should hide the red text on names too. sure it started as a great idea; let's all help fund the rpc because we love this site...but now even something done with the best intentions is possibly under fire of being "toxic" to newer players or those that haven't donated for one reason or another.
.....i'm sure a few of you noticed my sig is in a spoiler tag. shortly after i changed it to it's current one i was asked polity to change it or hide it due to the content being possibly considered "unsafe" for work computers and there was comment of it possibly causing crashes with some peoples phones even though i was told it wasn't too mature or out of bounds content for the rpc's tos itself.
i'm sure i could have raised hell over it and started pointing fingers about other sigs that are past the size guidelines or other art posted that has a risque look to them, but nope. stuffed it in a spoiler and carried on without an issue. why? because where as i like my sig and i dont think it's a problem....it made some people feel uncomfortable while trying to browse the rpc at work or on their phone. both were valid reasons to me and it didn't hurt for me to be a little accommodating for them overall if it was just a minor change i had to make.
my point (i have one i promise) is this is quickly heading into everyone talking about various ways to censer posts, comments, likes rep mods and people wanting to show that they support this site with a red flavor to their text. yes things have gotten a bit crazy in here and yeah i did post earlier that i did notice it myself in regards to new players not getting as much attention but as it was also pointed out; that's a bit of a two way street and some connections don't work out while others do. the point is that both need to make an effort. (as i can attest i have one i'm working with through pm to get some sort of connection and another i plan to meet up with later tonight....once i finish making dinner actually, this is also how i met a few of you in game was posting here either in your thread when you started or mine i posted shortly after joining.)
..but getting back to the topic of removing or censoring the rep mods; why do we need to hide them for new members to feel more at ease? if the community is open and welcoming (which i know it can be and has been many many times in and off game) why should they feel that it's intimidating? a lot of these were handed out for good posts that were helpful to one person or another.
as i mentioned earlier, warren helped me with my initial planning on my shots contest ("rolz....what's that? .__." i believe was the reply when he suggested it) i had no idea how to go about it and when i first found his profile on here, i looked at the post count and the amount of rep mods...both are pretty fricken big numbers, but i shot of a pm saying hi, i was new, had an idea for an event and was wondering if i could get some help figuring it out. got a reply shortly after and we were on our way. he was open, nice and giving suggestions for me to gnaw on and work with. shortly after i forgot the big numbers and instead of them being viewed as "better than me" they looked like points proving how dedicated he was to this site and rp.
yes i realize that some rep mods given to users were gained through hostile means but if you look at mine and i'm sure a whole ton of others; you'll see a lot were given for saying nice, thoughtful, funny and encouraging things. not every plus1 is given over something negative....but as warren also stated in his post; i don't always have time to stop and say "hey that gif really made me lul" or "i agree" and i'll be honest it does make me smile when i get one because i know it made that person happy for a minute. please don't take away things that were meant to be good and encouraging in attempts to cut out the bad parts that are starting to form.
as far as hostile posts go; proofreading is a wonderful thing....i think if people take a moment to really read their replies and think how it sounds to others and not just how it sounds to themselves could really make a change in some of the more heated debates. the lack of body language and verbal tone/inflection does make things a bit more difficult (not to mention some having english as their second language that can sometimes cause miscommunications) i feel are valid enough reasons to be a bit more careful when posting your reply in a more "touchy" thread.
everyone should be able to discuses their feels on something even if it's conflicting to someone else. but if we take the time to make sure it's presented while trying to keep our cool; we don't need the mods to clean up spill after spill...or at least quite as much. i'm sure there will still be a flair up here and there, but if you try to talk to someone as you would in person instead of not...i think it goes a bit better. even if both parties decide to agree to disagree in the end. (as stated before; we all pay our own sub and have our own ideas about our rp and best way to do things.) sometimes the opinions mesh sometimes they don't. but instead of trying to force the other party; its okay to say "i tried and they're really set but i still don't agree" and take a step back.
i've seen more than one say that their posting as of late and everyone being hyper aware of it lately has been making them self conscious to post and are debating on posting less now....the ones that feel they're in the wrong i'm sure are going to make an effort to change for the better...and if overall tension can go down...i'm sure this will help everyone feel more at ease when loggin in.
i really do love this site and consider it an online home. i have right now five tabs open and i check it on my phone most times when im out,though i don't post in all of them, i read a lot of the threads across most the boards. (even if the more gif heavy threads cause it to crash sometimes....
) but i worry if so many are feeling the need to post less for fear of either enforced censorship or self censorship to avoid the former; how open and welcoming will a barely used forum be? i know we as a community can get over this bump, we just gotta work together....old and new members. how's the song go? look to those who walked before to lead those who walk after
RE: Complaint/Rant/Thing: What's with all the aggression lately? - OttoVann - 04-22-2015
Whats a red name mean / do? I wasn't quite sure what it was.
RE: Complaint/Rant/Thing: What's with all the aggression lately? - SicketySix - 04-22-2015
(04-22-2015, 07:05 PM)OttoVann Wrote: Whats a red name mean / do? I wasn't quite sure what it was.
It's just a small monthly sub we pay to help keep the RPC going. It just means you are one of those people who donated.
RE: Complaint/Rant/Thing: What's with all the aggression lately? - Aya - 04-22-2015
It means I'm out painting the town red!
RE: Complaint/Rant/Thing: What's with all the aggression lately? - OttoVann - 04-22-2015
(04-22-2015, 07:09 PM)Casden Reeves Wrote:(04-22-2015, 07:05 PM)OttoVann Wrote: Whats a red name mean / do? I wasn't quite sure what it was.
It's just a small monthly sub we pay to help keep the RPC going. It just means you are one of those people who donated.
Oh word. Where is that advertised?
RE: Complaint/Rant/Thing: What's with all the aggression lately? - Cliodhna Eoghan - 04-22-2015
(04-22-2015, 07:05 PM)OttoVann Wrote: Whats a red name mean / do? I wasn't quite sure what it was.
it means you kicked in cash to help keep the rpc going or put towards them trying to get new features like a chat box (which in light of the current topic, i'm sure would be even harder to watch over) private teamspeak type chat and some other stuff iirc....i believe there's still a thread in the headlines about it. yep right here :3
RE: Complaint/Rant/Thing: What's with all the aggression lately? - No Longer Exists - 04-22-2015
*Peeks out from under his hat*
Actually, the red names indicate members that have DONATED to enhance the RPC website because we love it and appreciate it. It is not payment or subscription at all and grants no grandiose privileges. Everything is illustrated in FreelanceWizard's Patreon page about the donation system.
Cheers!
-Black Hat
RE: Complaint/Rant/Thing: What's with all the aggression lately? - ArmachiA - 04-22-2015
Red name just means you support the RPC via Patreon. It's in the Headline section on this very forum ;o
I don't think reputation is inherently bad, either. It's pretty common on lots of sites now thanks to Reddit. Take away Rep, it's post count. Take away post count, it's join date. The idea that some people may be more important than others is something that will forever be prevalent on forums.
RE: Complaint/Rant/Thing: What's with all the aggression lately? - McBeefâ„¢ - 04-22-2015
I think rep points and post counts should go away.
There is no benefit to having them, you can always just give someone a PM if you like their post.
As much as I like a big number next to my name, I don't think they really add anything positive.
RE: Complaint/Rant/Thing: What's with all the aggression lately? - OttoVann - 04-22-2015
(04-22-2015, 07:12 PM)ArmachiA Wrote: Red name just means you support the RPC via Patreon. It's in the Headline section on this very forum ;o
I don't think reputation is inherently bad, either. It's pretty common on lots of sites now thanks to Reddit. Take away Rep, it's post count. Take away post count, it's join date. The idea that some people may be more important than others is something that will forever be prevalent on forums.
Consider if you remove those three things, was harm done, and was there benefit to be gained? More harm than good, vice versa, etc.
If it doesn't hurt, but has upside, why not? Thats all.
RE: Complaint/Rant/Thing: What's with all the aggression lately? - Celsius - 04-22-2015
I'm just going to go ahead and throw my two cents in here, though I suspect my particular view is very much only my own.
I also want to preface this by saying I'm not saying anyone is at fault, or that anything is wrong either - just my own experience, and that maybe, as mostly a lurker, myself, it may not just be me that feels this way, but I'm just one of the first to put it to words.
I do definitely think people here get ignored. Just go through any thread, and see who gets responded to, quoted, and such. It's even happened several times in this thread, where someone mentions they are used to getting ignored, and then that post just floats away into obscurity.
Do I think anyone is at fault? Naw, not at all. It's not unusual for new people in a group to be mostly (or entirely even) ignored, despite others having good intentions. Its just that a friend or acquaintance of theirs said something they feel the need to respond to, and then the other posts get buried. It's an unfortunate and heavily embedded function of the way a forum operates.
Now, as for a more personal experience, I can honestly say that I've gotten next to no RP from posting here myself. Its happened occasionally, sure, but my posts tend to fall away and honestly, I don't mind. I don't go out of my way to attract people, I don't bump my posts, etc, so I know I am just as much to blame. However, when I watch my post in the connections forum get upward of 100 views and 2 replies, it's disheartening for sure. That is basically as far as ignoring gets.Â
However, this isn't me saying I'm hurting for RP. I have regular partners in the game, and get to RP plenty. It's just pointing out that finding RP here isn't as easy as some make it sound, without going out of your way to sell yourself - which tons of people aren't comfortable doing.Â
BUT! It is worth noting that many people who mostly lurk DO get ignored on the off chance they post - and then after some time they stop coming. I know I did.Â
And that brings me to the topic at hand. The biggest reason I've stopped coming recently is the lack of actual discussion in the lore threads. I enjoy debates as much as anyone, and reading through some of them have been immensely enjoyable here. But as of late, I have no doubt that the discussions recently just get circular and go no where. It's no longer fun to read, and I learn nothing, with the exception of an occasional post in a thread contributing something, but they get IGNORED because, guess what? They CONTRIBUTED.
I don't know. I've become dissillusioned with the RPC recently, and it may just as well be me. But still, this:
And that brings me to the topic at hand. The biggest reason I've stopped coming recently is the lack of actual discussion in the lore threads. I enjoy debates as much as anyone, and reading through some of them have been immensely enjoyable here. But as of late, I have no doubt that the discussions recently just get circular and go no where. It's no longer fun to read, and I learn nothing, with the exception of an occasional post in a thread contributing something, but they get IGNORED because, guess what? They CONTRIBUTED.
is my main point.
Oh, and a quick edit: I don't think the post count or rep system really needs to be changed. It can lead to intimidation on some occasion I'm sure, but as long as those people with high rep and post counts remain friendly, welcoming, polite and fun...it really shouldn't make a lick of difference.
RE: Complaint/Rant/Thing: What's with all the aggression lately? - Flashhelix - 04-22-2015
Even if rep counts served NO purpose whatsoever, they shouldn't be removed. Something shouldn't be removed just because it doesn't serve a purpose, only if it has a negative impact, and from what I've seen, the claims that rep somehow has a large enough negative impact to warrant removing it are pretty overblown. I don't mean to barnacle anybody's bricks, but it'd be like me saying that people with better avatars are given all the attention over people without them.
RE: Complaint/Rant/Thing: What's with all the aggression lately? - Kellach Woods - 04-22-2015
(04-22-2015, 06:54 PM)Aya Wrote:(04-22-2015, 06:53 PM)Kellach Woods Wrote:I think most of the regular users know who the other regular uses are and recognize a new person without any reference to a post count, yes :-X(04-22-2015, 06:43 PM)Aya Wrote: Really? Our community is so small that everyone knows everyone else, who is hiding those post counts supposed to fool?Everyone knows everyone else, really?
That I have to question. Same with the assumption that everyone's friends here.
I personally think we're barking up the wrong tree when it comes to post count/join date/rep. There's maybe a correlation between these things and being ignored, but there's no real causation, I've found. Many have a lower post count than I, but you can bet dollars to donuts that they'd easily get people to comment/interact/whatever else with their stuff compared to me.
And while that's an anecdote, I'd wager there's other such anecdotes out there to that completely blow this theory out of the water. Could probably even dig up another example using the Introduction forum but I don't have it in me to quantify it so I won't, but look at the disparity between received posts to each new person.
However, my question was more onto actually knowing each other rather than just saying we'd recognize a new person. Let's be real here - how many people actually know each other here? As in, interact fairly often on the forum and out of forum (in-game suffices)? I'd wager not as much as advertised. I can safely say I don't interact with around... 80% of the most well-known posters here. Could be because their characters don't grip me, our storylines never intertwine, etc. (at least for in-game), could be for any sorts of reason. Arguably, apparently some people avoid me like the plague as I've been told (but to quote gmcfosho - "AND I STILL GO HARD.")
I'd go right ahead and say that's a far bigger contributor to why there's been increased hostility around the forums and why people out there are hating on 'em. People just don't know each other, don't make an effort to remedy that either, putting the onus on the other person at all times. New, old, same difference. Someone quantified that the amount of posts in the new people forums has dwindled into essentially recruitment posts and scarcely anything, with the worst of it being in the summer of 2014 (coincidentally, around the time I joined - I remember my own thread having a grand total of 4 posts and 2 of them me). That's a problem we can actually do something about. Actually welcoming new people makes it so that, y'know, they know the forum is not only active but wants to see them around.
The biggest hurdle is that this problem is a conscious problem - It's not something you can just say "oh let's hide this, show that, be more strict and all will be fine." It's something that has to be worked on every day by every member of this community and the behavior exhibited recently, and I'd even go as far as to say since I joined, shows that this is nigh-impossible.
To finish this long-ass rant with a drama-filled, over-sensitive phrase because I totes can : Instead of "being excellent to one another", we have collectively said "fuck you I got mine".
RE: Complaint/Rant/Thing: What's with all the aggression lately? - Melkire - 04-22-2015
(04-22-2015, 07:16 PM)Rinslet Wrote: I do definitely think people here get ignored. Just go through any thread, and see who gets responded to, quoted, and such. It's even happened several times in this thread, where someone mentions they are used to getting ignored, and then that post just floats away into obscurity.
In my opinion, the biggest contributing factor to this problem is that, after a while, a lot of these posts start to sound the same, and when so many people starting sounding the same, it just becomes noise. Noise is easier to filter and tune out than to sift through. Case in point, after posting this I glanced upward to see that Kellach had posted while I was typing my own post out. I glanced through it just now and what I see (being honest here, not offensive) is more of the same "nobody wants to help the little guy find more RP" argument that, to me, has become noise that I have to tune out.
Why am I tuning it out? Because I don't have the time to dedicate to helping a bunch of new people out with roleplay. I've got one new contact I picked up recently who I'm helping to ease into the game and into RP, and that's already a stretch in that I have trouble getting to them. Copious free time, I do not have (most of my posting and moderating on the RPC is done from work).
(04-22-2015, 07:16 PM)Rinslet Wrote: It's just pointing out that finding RP here isn't as easy as some make it sound, without going out of your way to sell yourself - which tons of people aren't comfortable doing.
Which is perfectly fine! If someone isn't comfortable selling themselves, they shouldn't feel obligated to do so.
But expecting to find RP here without selling yourself, the way many of us have had to do, is a little like having your cake and eating it too.
RE: Complaint/Rant/Thing: What's with all the aggression lately? - Flickering Ember - 04-22-2015
WoW community forums did not have post counts below the avatar and it did not have a reputation system. (Although nowadays you can like individual posts) There were still forum celebrities and circle jerks.
Also can we get a new topic for this specifically?