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+--- Thread: Do's and Don'ts (/showthread.php?tid=11894)
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RE: Do's and Don'ts - Lilia Lia - 06-05-2015
(06-05-2015, 12:05 AM)Reth Wrote: Thanks for the great responses all, both for the words of encouragement and the honest answers, it has given me a lot to think about and the talk about flaws helped me flesh out a whole new depth to my character's backstory that I have in mind.
I was toying with the idea of having a Miqo'te male, who was raised by Hyur (for reasons I'll save as my character's secret for now), who has potential to explore some self identity development. His adoptive parents are alive and well, but he was left behind as a babe by his genetic parents for a very miqo'te-culture specific reason, so I'm going to try my best to be accurate to his miqo'te genetics and lore while embracing some awkwardly adopted Hyur mannerisms, including a Hyur-given name. I'm hoping I can pull this off without appearing cringe-worthy, and as per all of your advice, subtlety. Beyond his backstory, I think I will let his personality develop naturally as I meet new people.
This thread has given me a lot of motivation, so I will hopefully see some of you in game on Balmung soon. I've leveled myself up high enough to wear an in-character appropriate outfit.
I like how this discussion has developed, so any more input is welcome.
At the risk of upsetting you (since you're at this early stage), I should point out that "miqo'te adopted by hyur parents" is actually really common in the RP community for some bizarre reason. It seems to be a way of escaping the practical difficulty of wanting to play a miqo'te character while paying some minimal lipservice to the lore limitations of their race (and maybe also of naming them Steve Johnson instead of whatever weird lore name). But seriously, "miqo'te adopted by hyur parents" are like, everywhere... so that might raise some eyebrows.
Though in defense of the "adopted by Hyurs" trope, we do have at least one Hyur in the MSQ lore who adopted a lalafell.
I'm not trying to rain on your parade, I just know that I'd want someone to bring it to my attention if I was developing a concept and it ended up being really commonplace. The natural inclination in developing your character is to give them distinctive qualities that deepen them or make them interesting, but when the distinctive traits you give them are overplayed, then that takes a bit of the intrigue out of it.
Anyways, I feel like I'm saying too much at this point. Do whatever your heart tells you to.
If you want to create a miqo'te and avoid cliches, then this thread might be a good read:
http://ffxiv-roleplayers.com/showthread.php?tid=5887
RE: Do's and Don'ts - Reth - 06-05-2015
Lilia Lia, (Sorry I'm having some real problems with the formatting of this forum, quotes are working really strangely for me)
This is -exactly- the kind of thing I wanted to know before I made a fool out of myself, and I can easily adjust my character accordingly - since that factor of the character was not overly important and I can work out something else.
Thank you very much for your honesty.
RE: Do's and Don'ts - Lilia Lia - 06-05-2015
(06-05-2015, 01:05 AM)Reth Wrote: Lilia Lia, (Sorry I'm having some real problems with the formatting of this forum, quotes are working really strangely for me)
This is -exactly- the kind of thing I wanted to know before I made a fool out of myself, and I can easily adjust my character accordingly - since that factor of the character was not overly important and I can work out something else.
Thank you very much for your honesty.
My pleasure. I'm glad it was well received and helpful.
RE: Do's and Don'ts - V'aleera - 06-05-2015
Given the examples we have in lore, I don't see cross race adoption as being terribly problematic or exceptionally uncommon.
RE: Do's and Don'ts - Melkire - 06-05-2015
(06-05-2015, 02:33 PM)Intaki Wrote: Given the examples we have in lore, I don't see cross race adoption as being terribly problematic or exceptionally uncommon.
There are also quite a few noticeable adoptions present in the Gold Saucer. Off the top of my head, there's at least one case of a Roegadyn father adopting Hyuran children.
RE: Do's and Don'ts - OttoVann - 06-05-2015
DO NOT get overly concerned about Mary Sue status. I have seen people, myself included, twist themselves into pieces over this. The RPC has a deeply ingrained obsession with no one being too terribly special or interesting - and theres nothing wrong with it - but you can go too far with it as well. Do not forget the RPC is by no means a large, or majority population for Balmung. What is said here can not be assumed to just apply to the server at large, not even close. Don't worry about fitting in here nearly as much as writing up shit you and your rp partners enjoy.
Don't be afraid to go off the beaten path, don't be afraid to ignore lore either if it makes for way more interesting RP. This games lore is objectively bad, and sometimes tossing it do to your own thing or do bend something makes things so much more enjoyable. You learn by doing, so go ahead and start rping and make your mistakes. I make mistakes everyday, even an hour ago I did with a writing project I'm working on with Ottos IC wives. Learn by doing.
RE: Do's and Don'ts - Merri - 06-05-2015
Adoption isn't at all a stretch in Eorzea. Their views on a lot of subjects are actually very modern. Adoption isn't taboo. Gay relationships aren't frowned upon. Inter-racial relationships are, for the most part, accepted (there are some exceptions to this). As has been stated, it's also very evident in-game that adoption happens quite often.
I personally think going the Hyur route is absolutely fine. Even if it's been done before, that doesn't mean you can't, or you shouldn't if you actually want to. Make it your own, give it a unique spin. Do what you want to do, ultimately. There are some things that are taboo in the community, but honestly, something like that is so benign that I have a hard time believing people would actually give you grief for it.
No matter what type of character you make, there's going to be some person that doesn't like it, or doesn't agree with it, but the best you can do is agree to disagree with those people and simply avoid roleplaying with them. It doesn't have to be a bad experience. However, you shouldn't let those people dictate where you take your character or what you do with them, because for as many people that might not like an idea, there could be just as many that do like it.
As Otto has mentioned, the people here on the RPC are also just a small fraction of what exists in-game. From my experience, most people won't really care about the specifics of your character so long as you play them well, appropriately, and the experience is enjoyable. There's some obvious exceptions, but those are, well, obvious. (The "I'm a demon fairy princess who's the best at everything" kind of obvious.)
Another thing to keep in mind is your character will grow. They'll change, either by your own hand or events that unfold in-character. The character I play now is honestly pretty different from the man he was when I started playing him five years ago. Backstory only goes so far with your character, and getting hung up on perfecting it can stunt their growth. It should simply be there as a reference to why they might act the way they do, and not something that dictates 100% of their actions 100% of the time. :>
RE: Do's and Don'ts - Lilia Lia - 06-05-2015
Just to clarify, I wasn't saying "miqo'te adopted by hyurs" was implausible from a lore perspective, I was just saying it's a bit tired. Having a destroyed hometown and swearing revenge isn't implausible either.
RE: Do's and Don'ts - OttoVann - 06-05-2015
Otto adopted Ridley, his orphaned/exiled 18 year old battle-secretary. After she worked for him for a long time they got close in a father/daughter sort of way so he eventually asked her if she would like to be legally adopted and keep her name but become an heiress with all the rights, privileges, and authorities that would be implied from joining a Monetarist's family. She's got a signet ring and can speak in Otto's place should he need it and stuff.
Its way different from what everyone else is talking about adoption though because Ridley is now 20, and Otto is only 30. So yeah...definitely unusual but it was and is a good story. She's also a midlander and Otto is highlander, so it's staying within the same 'race'.
It was good, close, and endearing RP. Adoption is sweet. I guess I'm biased when I don't see how it's tired. Do a lot of people have adoption backgrounds?
RE: Do's and Don'ts - Cato - 06-06-2015
(06-05-2015, 05:15 PM)Lilia Lia Wrote: Just to clarify, I wasn't saying "miqo'te adopted by hyurs" was implausible from a lore perspective, I was just saying it's a bit tired. Having a destroyed hometown and swearing revenge isn't implausible either.
Mm. I don't think it's a bad thing to desire more role-players to take their character's race into greater consideration. It's a little disheartening when one's favoured race(s) end up being portrayed in the majority of cases as little more than humans with different shaped ears - which is essentially what they become when all ties with their culture/racial traits are cut away.
It becomes even more potentially problematic when it becomes the norm rather than the exception to the rule - but I've since made my peace with it since quite a few role-players are keen to take it a step further by guzzling down fantasia to have their character transform into a completely different race. Which in turn lets them embrace all the perks and none of the drawbacks - as will likely be the case with the soon to be influx of Au Ra.
Then there's the 'controversial' aspect of miqo'te life that many claim to find off-putting. I see a lot of people complaining that they loathe the Nunh/Tia system and how the females are expected to breed but oddly enough I don't see the same complaints aimed at the matriarchal themes associated with Keepers or the fact that a large portion of non-tribal female miqo'te are portrayed as courtesans/wenches...
RE: Do's and Don'ts - Lilia Lia - 06-06-2015
(06-06-2015, 03:44 AM)Graeham Wrote: It's a little disheartening when one's favoured race(s) end up being portrayed in the majority of cases as little more than humans with different shaped ears - which is essentially what they become when all ties with their culture/racial traits are cut away.
[...]
Then there's the 'controversial' aspect of miqo'te life that many claim to find off-putting. I see a lot of people complaining that they loathe the Nunh/Tia system and how the females are expected to breed but oddly enough I don't see the same complaints aimed at the matriarchal themes associated with Keepers or the fact that a large portion of non-tribal female miqo'te are portrayed as courtesans/wenches...
In defense of the idea of distancing oneself from the tribal lifestyle, there is the problem of having to explain why it is that your character is no longer living in the tribe and is now traveling the realm and meeting new people and whatnot. But you can do this without being Moses in the bullrushes. I've read some really interesting miqo'te backstories about escaping their clans, usurping Nunhs, and so on.
Really I think a lot of players also remove the tribal background because they simply didn't start developing their character until after they created them, and therefore they don't have a lore-friendly name in the first place. I was reading a few wiki pages yesterday out of curiousity and a few of the adopted miqo'tes even include a note like "and that is why his name does not follow the racial conventions."
RE: Do's and Don'ts - OttoVann - 06-06-2015
I'm doing my catboys out there the biggest favor I can by becoming a proper Hyur Nunh. Two wives, couple of side-chicks, and counting mates, I got your backs.
We going to make these nerds accept poly-life.
Also Keeper cats are demonstrably the best. Matrons are love/life
. They can't marry you, and since your a Hyur they won't likely be making long term relationshit plans with you so you get to swing by on occasion with little to no strings attached - and who doesn't like a strong independent woman type?
RE: Do's and Don'ts - Caspar - 06-06-2015
I don't think it's too cliched to be adopted if you actually engage with the reasons why and make it relevant in the character's development, rather than conveniently using it as an excuse to not have to rp family.
Anyway, I definitely agree with the whole paranoia. Yeah it's kind of a drag that I've met a lot of people whose characters have similar backstories, but I still think that snowflaking a bit was worth it because I get to play off my particular angle on the same concept. Besides, I always think heroes should be heroic; they do crazy stuff, they come from crazy backgrounds. Sometimes that stuff makes them seem larger than life or improbable. Do what comes natural, within reason of course.
RE: Do's and Don'ts - FreelanceWizard - 06-06-2015
Bit of a tangent here:
(06-06-2015, 03:44 AM)Graeham Wrote: I see a lot of people complaining that they loathe the Nunh/Tia system and how the females are expected to breed but oddly enough I don't see the same complaints aimed at the matriarchal themes associated with Keepers or the fact that a large portion of non-tribal female miqo'te are portrayed as courtesans/wenches...
You haven't seen L'yhta complain about how Keeper men are all abused and oppressed, how both clans' traditions are barbaric and uncivilized, and how miqo'te women should stop being "kittens" who work on their backs instead of on their feet.
In all seriousness, though, it's true that most of backlash is aimed at Seekers, since the potential squick factor of their society is higher than that of Keepers (to those of us in Western culture). I've only run into one other miqo'te IC who opposed all tribal culture; most seem to just have no opinion on it while knowing about it, which I think is a little off. IMO, once a miqo'te is familiar with their culture, I can't really see them being purely indifferent to it.