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+--- Thread: [Discussion] Your thoughts on jump potions? (/showthread.php?tid=17831)
RE: Your thoughts on jump potions? - Cecily Jisi - 12-02-2016
(12-02-2016, 11:57 AM)GhostlyMaiden Wrote: The only issue I see from this is someone who buys the potion for a job they have no idea how to play and won't take the time to actually figure it out and going into these dungeons and making things more painful to get through than they should be.
That, I believe, is what Palace of the Dead is for. It grants you access to skills early on so you can learn what to do rather quickly.
As for my opinion on this matter, I say it's great for making an alt or even help a friend be ready to hop in alongside you and your company.
RE: Your thoughts on jump potions? - Cecily Jisi - 12-02-2016
(12-02-2016, 11:58 AM)Gegenji Wrote: I think the main issue about jump potions in FFXIV is... well... the plot is very heavily story-oriented. And locked behind the quests. So, would jump potions allow you to bypass all the gates? Such as, for example, Ishgard being locked behind the MSQ? If not, you're getting a bunch of levels to basically still be forced to plow your way through the dungeons.
On the other hand, for alts that I use mainly for RP and the like, the idea of being able to get them to the levels needed to make full use of the wide range of outfits and glamours... it's quite appealing. Especially for those who might be here solely for the RP and the dress-up and less the PvE side of things.
Ultimately, I think I'd need more information on these things before I could fully pass judgement. Like, does it make you max level in EVERYTHING? Or is it one class/job per potion? I'd assume the latter, of course, but you never know given the leveling system in FFXIV. Do you have to use it at creation, or is it something you can use on a character that is already existent? There's a lot of questions to be answered.
From what I understand, the jump potion would basically skip you past the story.
RE: Your thoughts on jump potions? - Edda - 12-02-2016
I don't think they should be a thing. I understand their purpose in countries like China, where the subscription model is different, but anywhere else - no thank you. Whether it's skipping to 50/60 or just getting a pass through MSQ, new players should have to do it all. I would be fine with a one character, one job boost ala Legion when we're six expansions deep, but we're nowhere near that point as of yet.
That being said... bypassing MSQ restrictions on alts should absolutely be a thing. Have a character that's max level and already done X amount of MSQ? Then any alts on that account should be able to waltz into Ishgard in their level one skivvies(they'll still have to level of course). I also think that should be standard, not the result of some $10 potion. But that will never happen.
RE: Your thoughts on jump potions? - Gegenji - 12-02-2016
(12-02-2016, 04:01 PM)Cecily Jisi Wrote: From what I understand, the jump potion would basically skip you past the story.That's the bit that bothers me the most, I think.
FFXIV is far more story-oriented than WoW ever was, and a lot of the content was tied directly to the plot. Why various dungeons existed and why the Warrior of Light was even going into them. Even the hard modes of the dungeons seem to refer to the first time you go into them in their setup and layout. That's a lot of information and nuance that would just be... overlooked... if someone could just skip past it. And would likely lead to a lot of folks confused at the story they'd be coming in at and asking a bunch of questions - unless the new story is completely self-contained and wouldn't require any clarification based off previous events.
That said, if folks really didn't care at all about the story (an odd thing considering how plot-focused the game is), would they really be missing out all that much? Yes, they'd be a bit inexperienced in what the abilities and roles do but - as mentioned - there are folks who got to 60 the normal way and still don't know what they're doing. And you might even get more folks coming in who could potentially pick stuff up quick... because they can jump right in with a friend or family member who's already at the endgame level.
It's really difficult to say. Understanding the story, understanding their job... those are both things that aren't specifically tied to level or even having gone through all the content. You can get lore elsewhere, and you can still take steps to learn your class at any level.
RE: Your thoughts on jump potions? - Noxtis316 - 12-02-2016
I ended up skipping a lot of the cut-scenes. Therefore, I often end up skipping the story connected to them when I leveled. (And sometimes the dialogue...When I look at lore I also look at story, and I did that before I even got into the game.)
The Pathfinders, when they joined me to help me at parts of the dungeons/trails required for MSQ progression, would tell me that it is okay to see the cut-scene. But with the trails and raids, there are others and those people that have already BEEN to the content- I don't like making people wait. Plus I can review the story at another point in time, I can review the lore at another point in time.Â
So the jump potions? I can understand the use for them. I can also understand why people are against it. Do I like the idea? Â I think they are optional. No strong like or dislike from me here about these. I wouldn't feel like my time leveling is a waste...I certainly am not making alts to go through the MSQ again...
RE: Your thoughts on jump potions? - Valence - 12-02-2016
Ethys sums up my opinion pretty well.
[youtube]e0V8w4o-zRE[/youtube]
Also, the dev notes said that the potential jump potions for 4.0 will jump players to lvl60 and the end of Heavensward if I remember correctly.
RE: Your thoughts on jump potions? - Sounsyy - 12-02-2016
(12-02-2016, 04:48 PM)Gegenji Wrote: You can get lore elsewhere
Job security.
Though in all seriousness, I am very against a potion that would enable a new player to skip any significant portion of the MSQ, free 60 class or no. I think that's an option best reserved for players with an existing MSQ-current character. If for no other reason than it goes against their longstanding model of rehashing old content for progression to assist the queues of new players experiencing the content for the first time. But also I admit I'd be slightly peeved at a new player skipping three years worth of story only to ask for a summary on a forum.
RE: Your thoughts on jump potions? - Syranelle Ironleaf - 12-02-2016
I'm all for things that let friends play with friends. Â Having played through the MSQ three times now, I can completely understand not wanting to go through all that headache and new players potentially getting discouraged when all they want to do is hang out with their friends and have fun.
The game can be taught, even at end-game, a lot of people just don't care to. Â They expect people to inherently know how to play a game they've been playing for years. Â If I'm signing on to a monthly sub to play friends, I'd certainly hope my friends cared enough to at least help me get acclimated to the game and playing decently. Â
That said, there will always be "bad" players and people who don't know how to play the game. Â Always. Â You're never going to get around it, so why punish good people who just want to come and have fun with their friends, same as you, on the misconception that anyone who "jumps" is automatically someone who will be terrible at the game. Â It's this kind of mentality that's slowly pervading gaming communities and making them the "toxic" places people have come to know and love. Â "You aren't as good at this game as I am, even though I've been playing for years, so that automatically means you suck."
Just let people play together and have fun. Â If it's not your brand of fun, then just... don't play with them. Â Stick to your statics, your circle of friends, and leave the mentoring to people who genuinely have an interest in helping others, jumpers or not.
RE: Your thoughts on jump potions? - Zhavi - 12-02-2016
I'm for either tying it to an account with a character advanced to 60 MSQ point whatever, or veteran reward tier whatever.
But as someone who likes leveling characters, it's not 1-50 (and, I guess you could say, 51-60) that's problematic in any way. It's the gate at 50 that irritates me. As someone else said, it needs trimming. Most of that "story" is unnecessarily broken up into a bajillion little mini quests (glorified messenger) that feel punishing rather than illustrative about what's going on, and would be likely to encourage a new player eager to get to the endgame to just skip them anyways -- except now they're gonna be frustrated by it.
....honestly I'd love a 'story' skip pot even just at 50 (and, once I stop being lazy, prolly post 3.0 stuff at 60, too). That's when I start getting whiny. The rest can be tedious, but it's the interruption to the feeling of progressing in levels that is, imo, truly frustrating.
RE: Your thoughts on jump potions? - Shofie - 12-09-2016
I'm curious how this would be handled in lieu of the fact that MSQ unlocks everything for you. Dungeons, raids, chocobo, grand company stuff, etc.
RE: Your thoughts on jump potions? - Sophia_Grave - 12-09-2016
I don't like the idea of a new player skipping the entire MSQ, but then again, some players don't care about that content, so I don't see the point of forcing them to do it if they just want to do roulettes till their eyes bleed like the rest of us. Plus, I get some work-free alts out of the deal.
Of course, if I had my way, new players would go through it at least once, then jump potion to their hearts content on their other non-craft/gather jobs. Or let them jump potion right away, but have them do the quests anyway.
I don't know, I'm biased. I just don't want to level my damn alts anymore, and I'm willing to pay :V
RE: Your thoughts on jump potions? - Valence - 12-09-2016
I really don't see the point of forcing players to go through it if they don't want to. The main fear is that we would get a legion of lvl60 players popping up with no clue at all how to play their class... Well, it's already the case even without jump potions anyway. Why would you need to do at least once the MSQ to 60? To be knowledgeable about your class? That's moot, the next alt or job you will level up with the jump potion will probably be another one anyway. Except if it's of the same role, you will be as brand as new, especially with a full 60 skillset. So, if not that, what then? To have witnessed the story at least once? Why would you shove that down the throat of people if they don't wanna?
The problem is not so much people that don't know how to play their classes (they will learn in time, just like that huge flow of bad DRKs at lvl30 that never tanked in their life when 3.0 released), but the lazy, the idiots and the people willingly refusing to play by the rules. Those, you will get no matter what, and no matter what you do, they will not learn or change.
Now then, I heard wow offers trials and challenges to clear before letting their newly jumped players into the wild.
But my main fear is that, if we don't get jump potions, we will continue to get that endless trainwreck of people bitching and whining about how long and tedious cutscenes and quests and stuff are. They are toxic to the story itself, since they aren't interested in it. This is a whole different kind of people than just us being dissatisfied with the story, being critical and whatnot. It's about this huge part of players that just don't want to have anything to do with it. If they want out of the story I say, let them do. All the better for us.
RE: Your thoughts on jump potions? - V'aleera - 12-09-2016
I don't really care one way or the other. I honestly doubt that a significant portion of new players would actually care to purchase a jump potion if they could. Don't have any evidence for it, but I feel like it's only a narrow section of players who come into the game wanting literally nothing else than to be at max level immediately.
RE: Your thoughts on jump potions? - Teadrinker - 12-09-2016
Great for RP, bad for PvE.
People complain about 'bad' players enough as it is. Imagine queuing for your roulette and getting this.
"Hi guys! Just jumped this Paladin, I have no idea what I'm doing so be patient k lol!"
RE: Your thoughts on jump potions? - Gegenji - 12-09-2016
(12-09-2016, 10:01 AM)Teadrinker Wrote: Great for RP, bad for PvE.
People complain about 'bad' players enough as it is. Imagine queuing for your roulette and getting this.
"Hi guys! Just jumped this Paladin, I have no idea what I'm doing so be patient k lol!"
As opposed to someone who is bad at the class, somehow got to 60 anyway, and doesn't say anything? Like the WHM in Titan HM who just sits in Cleric Stance the entire time while spamming Cure IIs? I'd actually welcome someone who was upfront about not knowing how to play their class - that means they might actually listen and take advice.
"Okay, you should have an ability called Shield Oath. Click that to turn it on. Now, for groups you want to use Flash to generate aggro along with Circle of Scorn when you have it. Otherwise just stick to your melee combo and you should be good. You have a bunch of defensive cooldowns, feel free to pop those whenever except for Hallowed Ground - that's your panic button. Any questions?"
And then we go in and we'd probably do fine. That's what I'd like to think, anyway.
