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+--- Thread: Hearers and conjurers questions (/showthread.php?tid=10220)
Hearers and conjurers questions - dantro - 02-21-2015
Hello! As I'm working on my new character I've wondered many things but I've been able to google lots of it. There is however one question which is hard to find any info about, and that is about those gifted with the power to hear the elementals.
Basically what I wonder is if hearers are limited to specific races and if everyone born with the talent actually end up being conjurers and "official" hearers?
I haven't been able to find any info on the subject and although I have studied the lore as much as possible I may or may not have missed something.
Anyone who is more knowledgeble than me regarding this?
RE: Hearers and conjurers questions - Khoure - 02-21-2015
I haven't heard anything on the subject of applicable races either, which is a good thing as hearing nothing implies that any race can have "hearers". The only ingame ones we see are I think hyur and elezen, but that's probably just because Gridania is the nation that primarily teaches/cares about conjury and its almost entirely made up of elezen and hyur (with a few keeper miqo'te)
as for if everyone born with the talent ends up becoming conjurers? I think they have to be somewhat in tune with conjury in order for their 'hearing' skill to reveal itself, even if it is an innate talent. This is drawn from Sylphie in the Conjurer plot line, she only starts hearing spirits after she finally starts to work with and actively listen to nature. That being said, I don't think a hearer has to be a well trained conjurer, and they certainly don't have to be an official healer. I mean, no one has to be an official anything if they don't want to. They do probably need to be capable of the very basics of conjury though, if they are actually going to be hearing anything. At the same time, that would mean someone could potentially go through their whole life having the hearing gift and never know about it if they never trained in conjury.
RE: Hearers and conjurers questions - Sounsyy - 02-21-2015
All Hearers are Conjurers, but not all Conjurers are Hearers. There seems to be two ways one can become a Hearer, either by dedicating oneself fully to the practice of Conjury until you can hear the Elementals' whispers or you're naturally born with the ability to hear Them. There is however a quote from one of the Brothers saying that some people train in the ways of Conjury their whole lives and never hear.
Brother Ingram Wrote:Is it true? Did you hear the Elementals? Allow me to congratulate you. Having heard the Elementals, you have taken your first step towards greatness as a conjurer. But remember this - hearing their voices alone is not enough. After hearing, you must next understand. And then you must grant the favors that they ask. Your journey has only just begun.
Soileine Wrote:You should not be so hard on yourself. These things take time. Many conjurers enjoy illustrious careers without ever having heard- Truly!? The Elementals spoke to you!?
In regards to the average joe who is born with the ability to Hear but is not a conjurer, there's actually a nameless NPC in the Stillglade Fane who is talking to one of the Conjurers and explaining that he's been hearing voices in his head and he thinks he's going crazy. But he's actually hearing the Elementals, he just doesn't know it yet. From 1.0 lore, we're told that when a person presents such a gift as being able to Hear the Elementals, they are inducted into the Stillglade Fane and trained in the arts of Conjury because they already have a natural affinity for it.
And other than Padjal, who are all born Hearers, it does not appear to be race locked. Just limited to the Black Shroud.
Hope this helps! ^^ I'll leave a couple lore links below that you may find helpful!
-1.0 CNJ Questline
Hearer Lore:
Soileine Wrote:Tread quietly - for here the elementals whisper their will, and we conjurers must listen with every fiber of our being. There are those born with the ability to hear them. But even those without this gift may come to hear the elementals in time - albeit with rigorous training.
T'nbulea Wrote:Be welcome, sister. I am T'nbulea, and I have been among the conjurers in this sacred place for many years. Toil in earnest, but have patience. Only when you have learned to open your heart will you realize this important fact - you can listen as well as you hear.
T'nbulea Wrote:I sometimes hear the trees speak. They say the bond between conjurer and tree is like that between lovers. The whispers cause everything to fade away, until only that sweet voice remains, echoing gently in your heart. Like a lover, though, the trees demand devotion. I am able to hear only a single species - and one of little value. That is the reason I began to seek the voices elsewhere.
Soileine Wrote:Brother Telent is one of our most gifted. For years, he has listened to the trees. Their voices are soft and calm, yet profound and penetrating. He was a violent man in his youth, quick to temper and quicker still when in his cups. Many think it was the voices that soothed him. Yes, we could all learn a good deal from Brother Telent.
Soileine Wrote:Perhaps you have come to realize just how important he is to us. For many, many years, he has heard the elementas. Yet unlike others, he is able to hear the voices within all kinds of trees. Oh, do not envy him his gift. Such power is not necessary to become an accomplished conjurer. Take Brother Morys, for exmple. He is much like you adventurers in a way - unaware of his potential. Forestborn or no, he can hear the elementals as well as any, and better than most.
Soileine Wrote:Hearing the voices of the elementals is one of the most difficult feats a mortal might attempt, Gridanian or no. Many are they who never achieve this goal, and end their days without ever having attained the true power of the conjurer.
Soileine Wrote:There is such sublime purpose in the voices of the elementals that only in the deepest recesses of the mind may they be heard.
Maroile Wrote:Because of my lineage, Brother Ingram came to expect great things of me. But only the elementals of fire see fit to speak to me.
Gugula Wrote:An elemental is an elemental. Their aspect is of no consequence. If you are able to hear their voices, that alone proves your worth and greatness as a conjurer. And don't even think of pretending to hear them. Lies don't spread far here before they come to light. The Seedseers see to that.
Kinborow Wrote:The Twelveswood is the only place in Eorzea where their voices may be heard. Nowhere else may our way be taught or learned.
Zerig Wrote:They say that the most ancient elementals are the easiest to hear - such as those in rocks and trees. The rocks are easiest to hear, ancient and powerful as they are. And they don't come any rockier than the Amberscale.
Maroile Wrote:They say that even those who lack the gift may hear the words of an angered elemental... if they are tainted by the woodsin. I feel that may be true of you.
Ingram Wrote:But remember this─hearing their voices alone is not enough. After hearing, you must next understand. And then you must grant the favors that they ask. Your journey has only just begun.
Soileine Wrote:In time, you will learn to open your heart and mind to the elementals - to bond and commune with them. Elementals abound in the Twelveswood around Gridania. Unto them falls the task of protecting the forest. And unto us falls the task of protecting them. To that end, we have laid the Hedge - a magical barrier formed by our order and the elementals that serves to turn away outside evils. Those who would breach it invite our vengeance.
We are the conjurers - intermediaries of nature and man. Our place is between Gridanians and the elementals. The majority of our citizenry are deaf to the forest's whispers. Yet all feel the presence of the elemntals, as surely as they feel hot and cold. But words cannot justly describe this sensation. You must go and experience it for yourself.
Maroile Wrote:All Gridanians have come to know the true power of the elementals. It falls to us as conjurers, together with the moogles, to connect them with the commonfolk.
Zerig Wrote:Ohoho, the realm of the elementals eludes mortal comprehension, brother.
One may as well ask whence life comes in birth, and whither it goes in death. Answers there must be, for sure, but they are not for us to know.
Kinborow Wrote:The order may come from Brother Telent, but it is the will of the elementals, sure as sunrise. Go forth with pride, brother. The elementals do not distinguish between man and beast. They may give their consent to battle, but the outcome is of little consequence to them.
RE: Hearers and conjurers questions - Magellan - 02-21-2015
Sorry to piggyback on this thread, but how rare are Hearers? Does it hint of Mary Sue-ism to play a Hearer?
And does the art of Conjury lose a lot of power once your character leaves the Shroud, or are they able to communicate with elementals from other areas too?
RE: Hearers and conjurers questions - Sounsyy - 02-21-2015
(02-21-2015, 11:32 AM)Magellan Wrote: Sorry to piggyback on this thread, but how rare are Hearers? Does it hint of Mary Sue-ism to play a Hearer?
And does the art of Conjury lose a lot of power once your character leaves the Shroud, or are they able to communicate with elementals from other areas too?
Well, there was close to 20 in-game NPC Hearers in 1.0, not including Padjal, and probably about that in 2.0. I'd have to go run around Gridania and do a census. (ie. Look for Conjurers wearing purple) But I do not see why being a Hearer would be considered Mary Sue. Sure, you hear the voice of divine beings, but that's kinda the whole point of being a Conjurer. The goal is to hear them. So I say go for it.
And no, Elementals are all over the world. In every rock, every stream, every tree. Lore suggests that these Elementals are just unable or unwilling to reveal themselves without the protection of the Hedge like Gridanian Elementals have. (Because despite their power, Elementals can be slain by conventional weapons.) So a Conjurer should be able to commune with Elementals outside of Gridania just as well.
RE: Hearers and conjurers questions - Magellan - 02-21-2015
(02-21-2015, 11:41 AM)Sounsyy Wrote:I see. Thank you! Very helpful(02-21-2015, 11:32 AM)Magellan Wrote: Sorry to piggyback on this thread, but how rare are Hearers? Does it hint of Mary Sue-ism to play a Hearer?
And does the art of Conjury lose a lot of power once your character leaves the Shroud, or are they able to communicate with elementals from other areas too?
Well, there was close to 20 in-game NPC Hearers in 1.0, not including Padjal, and probably about that in 2.0. I'd have to go run around Gridania and do a census. (ie. Look for Conjurers wearing purple) But I do not see why being a Hearer would be considered Mary Sue. Sure, you hear the voice of divine beings, but that's kinda the whole point of being a Conjurer. The goal is to hear them. So I say go for it.
And no, Elementals are all over the world. In every rock, every stream, every tree. Lore suggests that these Elementals are just unable or unwilling to reveal themselves without the protection of the Hedge like Gridanian Elementals have. (Because despite their power, Elementals can be slain by conventional weapons.) So a Conjurer should be able to commune with Elementals outside of Gridania just as well.
RE: Hearers and conjurers questions - Mikh'a Elakha - 02-24-2015
(02-21-2015, 11:25 AM)Sounsyy Wrote: All Hearers are Conjurers, but not all Conjurers are Hearers. There seems to be two ways one can become a Hearer, either by dedicating oneself fully to the practice of Conjury until you can hear the Elementals' whispers or you're naturally born with the ability to hear Them. There is however a quote from one of the Brothers saying that some people train in the ways of Conjury their whole lives and never hear.
I play Mikh'a as a hearer, which has led to some interesting moments and development.
He was born a Hearer, and spent most of his childhood (In the Shroud) singing and dancing to songs nobody else could hear. They thought he was strange, unusual. He didn't know the others couldn't Hear.
As he grew, he learned to understand what they were saying to him, and would perform small favors for them. Since he was small, these were often things like building a small fire so an elemental could have a change of scenery (Family: why is that strange child attempting to build a fire near a lake ...) this sort of thing.
He has met with elementals who have been corrupted (such as in the quests) and initially didn't know any better, doing doing things that were potentially dangerous (family: Nophica's blessed titties!!! He's building a fire in a tree!!!) though again, he's come to know the difference and will kill a corrupt elemental now, allowing it to be reborn.
Now, as an adult, requests are larger. He is very respectful of nature, lives in the Shroud and is often away performing some task or another (which is a great way to explain time away from game or if you are aren't wishing to RP that day for whatever reason). It has also cropped up in various RP plots, with sometimes fun results (Mikh'a! Talk to your trees, what are the saying? *straghtfaced mikh'a glares*). He is very careful about angering elementals and has refused to perform actions he would normally have no issue with because an elemental has told him no. (What do you mean we can't build a bloody fire? It's freezing!!)
It can be a very interesting facet, conjurer or not, though my only advice would be the same I would give for just about any decision regarding making a character. Don't add it because it sounds cool, add it because it's an interesting facet that you wish to employ with regards to how your character interacts with the world.
Edited to add: Mikh'a also doesn't understand true silence. He hears elementals almost everywhere he goes. If he was to lose this ... he would be distraught and as a device is always available for future rp and development, should things stagnate.
RE: Hearers and conjurers questions - E'irawen - 02-24-2015
I can't really add anything lore-wise that anyone hasn't already said, but I can touch on that K'aworu is a hearer and nobody has ever brought it up to me as being mary-sue in the least bit. He was born with the ability.