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+--- Thread: Looking for Pointers (/showthread.php?tid=18172)
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Looking for Pointers - Kazukata - 01-11-2017
So! I'm figuring out my first rp character for ffxiv: Kazukata Go. I had two things I wanted to figure out before I start actually using him. First, I think his backstory works, but ffxiv's lore is pretty scattered in random tidbits, so I wanted to post it just to make sure it all checks out.
The general outline I've got for Kazukata is that he's a Raen Au Ra that participated heavily in the Doman revolt, but managed to escape with the other refugees Yugiri brought with her. (So far as I can tell, that's about the only way an Au Ra could end up in Eorzea short of a long and winding solo journey?) He made it out with basically just the clothes on his back, then quickly parted with the other refugees and went on to spend most of the events of Heavensward moping around after seeing the revolt that had basically become his life get crushed. As he's learned more about Eorzea and its heroes, however, he's started to regain a sense of hope and purpose, and has decided to adopt the spear in defense of his new home.
Personality-wise, he's blunt and utilitarian to a fault, but also friendly and eager to give what advice he can to others around him. He probably comes off as judgmental or a busybody to others, but he genuinely views his advice as an attempt to help and better those around him. I've given him a quirk where he obsesses a bit much over people's natural talents and uses them to categorize his world (so, for example, he would wonder why the hell a Roegadyn would ever want to be a white mage -- why put all those muscles and natural size to waste!?) He's personally opted to become a Lancer because of this philosophy, as he feels a spear is the best tool to utilize his tall but wiry frame. I think that's enough of a baseline to work with starting out.
But what I'm more worried about are the little details, the things I'm going to be screwing up and not even realizing it until someone pulls me over a month down the line. For example, I randomly noticed someone mention that most Domans speak their language with < > around the text. So I'm looking for pointers on little random stuff related to my character like that that I'd never be able to figure out without someone telling me. I'm probably just overthinking this part, but it never hurts to be prepared.
On a side note, Doman Au Ra would know Doman, right? I understand they helped the country, but flipping through the forum, I also read that Doma itself has a predominantly human population, and I don't know when exactly the Au Ra stepped in...have they been around long enough to know the language?
RE: Looking for Pointers - Jana - 01-11-2017
That thing people do with their text in < carrots > is just meant to convey that they're speaking in Doman (which is most likely old-timey Japanese from the names Doman characters have) rather than Eorzean common (English, as seen in the in-game written text). It's certainly not an agreed-upon practice among the RP community anyway.
RE: Looking for Pointers - Kilieit - 01-11-2017
They follow the same naming conventions as Doman Hyur (Edo-era Japanese names), so one can only imagine that a Raen would know the Doman language!
A note on that... there's some information in the lore book, Encyclopaedia Eorzea, which states the majority of Raen already know a dialect variation on Eorzean, and therefore don't find it very difficult to adjust language-wise when they arrive in Eorzea.
Some people take this to mean that Doman is a dialect variation on Eorzean, but that's not canon stated fact. My belief based on all the evidence (including stuff from the geography section) is that "Doman" is an ancient language all of its own (with its own rules and writing script), but most Domans also know a "trade language" that is aforementioned dialect of Eorzean.
Communication between Othard (the continent Doma is on) and the rest of the world started about 20 years ago, thanks to the advent of airship travel (for 2000+ years before then, there was a huge mountain range in the way). So that's when people would've started learning this language; it's likely your character would've too. If he's young enough, he might even have grown up speaking it in addition to Doman.
And yeah, people use <brackets> to denote the use of a language other than Eorzean. Sometimes it means Doman, or sometimes it means other languages - like Xaelan/Steppes, Ala Mhigan, and so forth - so it can be good to check with the players what they're using it to mean today. [Square brackets] and {curly brackets} are workable alternatives if you end up needing to speak in 2+ "non-Eorzean" languages in a scene; just make sure everyone's on the same page to which is which!
For good measure, here's my write-up of all the lore I could find in the Encyclopaedia Eorzea on Doma, excluding information included in the section on Ninja or specific races.
I don't want this to be a scary wall of text so that's all I'll address for now; feel free to ask follow up questions and I, or someone else, will answer them for you!
RE: Looking for Pointers - Kazukata - 01-11-2017
By all means, feel free to wall of text me! FFXIV seems like it has a lot of scattered lore, so I imagine I'm stepping into the game woefully under-read despite having finished the main storyline and a smattering of class storylines. I didn't realize Doma actually still existed as a nation. All the little notes about it made it sound like the entire country just got scorched earthed off the map, but after reading through that info, I guess it's still technically reclaimable.
I guess one question I have is how the relations between the two different Au Ra clans are. In the little official blurbs ffxiv has, they both take little digs at each other, which gave me the impression that they're philosophical opposites and have somewhat contentious, if not outright hostile relations. Is that a correct assumption, or is it considered a non-issue most people don't care about? Are any of the differences between Raen and Xaela of any import for rp, or going to color how people view characters of each clan?
RE: Looking for Pointers - Sounsyy - 01-11-2017
(01-11-2017, 11:14 PM)Kazukata Wrote: By all means, feel free to wall of text me!
Here is a massive wall of lore text about Doma, the Raen, and the Ninjas from Hingashi. It even includes links to more walls of text that reference in-game lore! Basically those links cover just about everything we have in the game about Doma and the Raen, so I hope they're helpful. ^^
(01-11-2017, 11:14 PM)Kazukata Wrote: I guess one question I have is how the relations between the two different Au Ra clans are. In the little official blurbs ffxiv has, they both take little digs at each other, which gave me the impression that they're philosophical opposites and have somewhat contentious, if not outright hostile relations. Is that a correct assumption, or is it considered a non-issue most people don't care about? Are any of the differences between Raen and Xaela of any import for rp, or going to color how people view characters of each clan?
Most people seem to gloss over how the Xaela do not usually get along with any other race and even the Raen in most RP interactions I've witnessed. That's not to say you can't incorporate that into your own roleplay though. My own Raen character is quite suspicious of Xaela who just happened to turn up in Eorzea around the same time as the Doman refugees.
Encyclopedia Eorzea Wrote:Possessed of a strong self-preservation instinct, the Au Ra believe in protecting tribe and family, though the means by which the two clans choose to do so diverges greatly. The Raen coexist peacefully with other races to ensure the safety of their own land, while the fiercely tribal Xaela shun relations with other races, even viewing strangers of their own kind as potential enemies. As such, the former are viewed favorably by the outside world, while the latter are typically regarded with suspicion and hostility.
There's a lot of lore to sift through, but feel free to ask more questions if you have them! ^^
RE: Looking for Pointers - Kilieit - 01-12-2017
In the present day, I believe you're correct and that Doma's supposed to have been razed to the ground - most importantly that temple at the centre of the nation is gone, I think? You're right, the NPCs are very adamant that Doma's flat-out gone and there's nothing to go back to, and it's unlikely the lore book would contradict that unless those NPCs were somehow mistaken.
As for au ra clan relations - I believe that's correct lore-wise, but for sake of convenience it's something a lot of RPers ignore? I think? In my experience?
My xaela do trust raen, but that's a deliberate character trait (one is Malaguld - the tribe that accepts raen as members - and the other... has his reasons), and while my raen doesn't exactly trust them, there's a certain degree of acknowledgement that the situation in Eorzea is different and that open bigotry isn't going to be accepted by bystanders a lot of the time.
But, like... since it's usually courteous not to blow up at other characters without OKing it with the players first, a lot of people handwave about it to keep the peace. Especially during social RP events where the main purpose of the evening is to make friends, IC and OOC, it's something people are wary of introducing.
RE: Looking for Pointers - Caspar - 01-12-2017
(01-11-2017, 10:38 PM)Kilieit Wrote: Some people take this to mean that Doman is a dialect variation on Eorzean, but that's not canon stated fact. My belief based on all the evidence (including stuff from the geography section) is that "Doman" is an ancient language all of its own (with its own rules and writing script), but most Domans also know a "trade language" that is aforementioned dialect of Eorzean.I agree with this interpretation on a basis of common sense, but for reference's sake do you think you could explain a bit of the reasoning here? It may be useful for myself or other RPers since this is a really inconsistent area of the lore, and translation convention is really dodgy in a multilingual game.
Communication between Othard (the continent Doma is on) and the rest of the world started about 20 years ago, thanks to the advent of airship travel (for 2000+ years before then, there was a huge mountain range in the way). So that's when people would've started learning this language; it's likely your character would've too. If he's young enough, he might even have grown up speaking it in addition to Doman.
RE: Looking for Pointers - Kilieit - 01-12-2017
(01-12-2017, 12:41 AM)Caspar Wrote:(01-11-2017, 10:38 PM)Kilieit Wrote: Some people take this to mean that Doman is a dialect variation on Eorzean, but that's not canon stated fact. My belief based on all the evidence (including stuff from the geography section) is that "Doman" is an ancient language all of its own (with its own rules and writing script), but most Domans also know a "trade language" that is aforementioned dialect of Eorzean.I agree with this interpretation on a basis of common sense, but for reference's sake do you think you could explain a bit of the reasoning here? It may be useful for myself or other RPers since this is a really inconsistent area of the lore, and translation convention is really dodgy in a multilingual game.
Communication between Othard (the continent Doma is on) and the rest of the world started about 20 years ago, thanks to the advent of airship travel (for 2000+ years before then, there was a huge mountain range in the way). So that's when people would've started learning this language; it's likely your character would've too. If he's young enough, he might even have grown up speaking it in addition to Doman.
Sure thing - here's the two passages in question, pulled from this thread (where I went on a teeny tiny rant on page 2 about taking quotes out of context):
![[Image: tumblr_of2pzwJt4I1s94wi1o1_1280.jpg]](https://66.media.tumblr.com/bb642bbd008ca1a354e22a9703b99da1/tumblr_of2pzwJt4I1s94wi1o1_1280.jpg)
![[Image: tumblr_of818ejbVC1qakgddo1_1280.jpg]](https://67.media.tumblr.com/54322885c9631b1629735bf9c6344c7b/tumblr_of818ejbVC1qakgddo1_1280.jpg)
I can definitely see why the first passage introduced confusion, but in context of the second passage... "developed with little influence from the West" and "spoke the same language as the West for 2000+ years" are mutually exclusive concepts.
Given the Encyclopaedia Eorzea is written from an Eorzean perspective (as it's designed to double as an in-universe document), I think the most logical interpretation is that the "common tongue of the Hyur" referred to in the first passage is in fact Eorzean, and therefore that Eorzean was adopted as a new but quickly ubiquitous in Doma in the last 20 years only.
RE: Looking for Pointers - Kazukata - 01-12-2017
(01-12-2017, 12:15 AM)Kilieit Wrote: In the present day, I believe you're correct and that Doma's supposed to have been razed to the ground - most importantly that temple at the centre of the nation is gone, I think? You're right, the NPCs are very adamant that Doma's flat-out gone and there's nothing to go back to, and it's unlikely the lore book would contradict that unless those NPCs were somehow mistaken.
See, now that's the weird thing. Now that I go back to it, one of the excerpts in the Encylopedia link you shared explicitly says "razed to the ground." But then another one only mentions mass executions. But then that begs the question, what would have been the point of restoring order via mass executions if there was no country left to rule over? If the entire country was reduced to rubble, would there even be that many people left to execute? Considering it's just that one niggling detail that's out of step, I'm inclined to think the country is in fact razed to the ground, but I don't see why the Garleans would bother with executions if they're just going to raze the country and probably wholesale slaughter its inhabitants, anyway.
I can also think of a few ways Kazukata could respect the Xaela regardless of cultural differences, not least of which the fact that he just finished fighting in one war and with Stormblood around the corner will probably be fighting in another one soon...regardless of the color of his scales, he's kind of acting more like a stereotypical Xaela than a Raen.
RE: Looking for Pointers - Kilieit - 01-12-2017
I think the main reason is because Doma is far from Garlemald's only province. So if not an example to Doman people, an example to other Garlean provinces that It Could Happen To Them if they tried the same armed revolution crap?
RE: Looking for Pointers - Caspar - 01-12-2017
The book also seems to suggest Doma had land apart from its eponymous, massive capital. It could be that Garlemald burned the capital to the ground and left nothing behind, while executing its rebellious populace wholesale, as an example to the other allies of Doma and the territories they controlled. I wish they were more specific.
RE: Looking for Pointers - Valence - 01-12-2017
The Raen and Xaela tend to really loathe each other. The former sees the latter as nothing more than barbarians, while the latter see the former as people that forsake their ancestral traditions and tongue.
While I indeed don't see a lot of people immediately mistrusting Xaelas in everyday roleplay, the thing I also keep in mind is that except for a Raen character, there is actually very little reason for other races to be wary of them since most of them actually shouldn't even know who those are.
The only mistrust I could see is not from actually being informed about Xaelas (like the Raen are), but the usual mistrust Eorzeans offer to foreigners and alien races.
RE: Looking for Pointers - Kazukata - 01-12-2017
A few more questions after going through all the different walls of text:
1. Yugiri is a shinobi and a general during the revolt, but the shinobi are the ones that ultimately betrayed Doma and are at least partially blamed for the collapse. Am I right in assuming that the traitors were a group of shinobi that acted independently and Yugiri bears no blame for that?
2. The timeline's a bit murky for me, but when exactly did the Doman revolt start? It sounds like it was a full-blown military conflict, so would many of the revolutionaries have, in fact, also fought in the initial war? I was planning on making Kazukata more middle-aged, so do I need to account for the initial conquest, as well? The Garleans' initial conquest was 20 years before present time, but I imagine the revolt at least started a few years prior.
3. Something that's been a consistent frustration and would clear up a lot of my other questions, but I doubt there's an actual answer to: how autonomous were the Raen in Doma? They're constantly talked about like a separate group that allied with Doma, but literally everything that happens to Doma sounds like it also happens to the Raen, making them sound more like actual citizens of the nation.
RE: Looking for Pointers - Kilieit - 01-12-2017
(01-12-2017, 07:23 PM)Kazukata Wrote: 2. The timeline's a bit murky for me, but when exactly did the Doman revolt start? It sounds like it was a full-blown military conflict, so would many of the revolutionaries have, in fact, also fought in the initial war? I was planning on making Kazukata more middle-aged, so do I need to account for the initial conquest, as well? The Garleans' initial conquest was 20 years before present time, but I imagine the revolt at least started a few years prior.
I believe within the span of the 2.1 - 2.55 MSQ (so, historically speaking, very recently). After the previous Garlean emperor died, there was a disagreement about who should become emperor after him. Doma tried to take advantage of this weakening in the Garlean regime, and temporarily succeeded in utilising it to overthrow their Garlean occupiers.
However, the succession problem was resolved faster than Doma expected, and the Garlean response was swift and brutal.
I can't remember off the top of my head when Doma was first annexed to begin with though; hopefully someone else can help you out there.
I also can't remember exactly but I do believe it was a specific faction of shinobi - from a certain island, the island the NIN questgivers are from - who had a hand in assisting Garlemald, but again, someone else will probably be able to come in with sources and specifics.
RE: Looking for Pointers - Sounsyy - 01-12-2017
(01-12-2017, 07:23 PM)Kazukata Wrote: 1. Yugiri is a shinobi and a general during the revolt, but the shinobi are the ones that ultimately betrayed Doma and are at least partially blamed for the collapse. Am I right in assuming that the traitors were a group of shinobi that acted independently and Yugiri bears no blame for that?
These were a separate faction known as the Imperial Shadows, trained by the Shinobi master Gekkai, but likely bolstered and funded by the Garlean Frumentarium (spy network). Gekkai claims to have turned cloak to spare his village of shinobi on the outskirts of Doma, but his actions and subsequent position at the head of the Imperial Shadows says his intentions were likely far less altruistic.
Gekkai Wrote:Don't tell me you require a history lesson, young one. Since the time of our ancestors, the shinobi have served many masters. Have you never wondered why, Oboro? Why, when Doma was subjugated by the Empire, was our village alone spared Garlemald's wrath? It was because of my actions. I protected us where the entire nation of Doma could not.
Gekkai's shinobi, however, are not the only faction of shinobi in the Yanxia region. The art itself is born in Hingashi, an island further to the east across the Ruby Tide, but the shinobi have upheld a long tradition of pledging themselves to a cause or family. Yugiri swore her blade to the Doman General's clan, so while she may have trained under Gekkai, she left the village to serve another master and was not privy to his plot.
Oboro Wrote:As you know, we are blades, and missions are as whetstones to us. Through duty and service, we sharpen our skills and our minds. This is the next step on your path.
Encyclopedia Eorzea Wrote:Having thus mastered ninjutsu and being given the epithet ‘Mistwalker,’ she pledged herself to the remnants of the Doman general’s clan. Thereafter, she waged a war against the Garlean Army.
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(01-12-2017, 07:23 PM)Kazukata Wrote: 2. The timeline's a bit murky for me, but when exactly did the Doman revolt start? It sounds like it was a full-blown military conflict, so would many of the revolutionaries have, in fact, also fought in the initial war? I was planning on making Kazukata more middle-aged, so do I need to account for the initial conquest, as well? The Garleans' initial conquest was 20 years before present time, but I imagine the revolt at least started a few years prior.
The Garlean Empire first invaded Othard in the Year 1528, roughly 50 years ago, and finally brought Doma under Imperial control in the Year 1552, five years before they conquered Ala Mhigo in northern Aldenard.
It's unclear if the known city-states of Othard (Doma, Hingashi, Rabanastre, and Bozja) put up a united defense against the Garleans during this twenty-four year time period. We do know that Garlemald's armies, led by Solus and Gaius during those early years did clash against Far Eastern armies and that at least one Othardian nation summoned a primal in defense of the East.
We also know that the fall of the Doman palace at the heart of their city-state spelled the end of Imperial resistance in the Far East. If there was another nation that had not yet been annexed, they either were defeated shortly thereafter or surrendered with the Domans. So if your character was in the Doman military twenty-five years ago or more, they most certainly would've fought against the initial conquest of Doma, with or without the support of the other nations.
Fast-forward roughly a quarter of a century to about one year ago, which marked the death of the First Emperor Solus zos Galvus to illness at the age of 88 and the start of the War of Succession. During this time period the Domans believed their resistance (which had likely been brewing underground for many months as news of the emperor's health steadily declined from age) could retake the city from a distracted Imperial army. They were right, partially.
The Doman resistance was able to retake several key landmarks, including their palace, but when Garlemald rallied, they were betrayed by Gekkai's Imperial Shadows and the resistance fell. To set an example, Garlemald razed their palace and capital and took every resistance member they captured alive and executed them along with their families for the other Far Eastern nations to see what happens when you betray the empire.
Encyclopedia Eorzea Wrote:Until recently, Doma was a proud independent nation situated in Yanxia - a southeastern region of Othard made fertile by the waters of the One River. At the civilization’s heart lay a mighty walled palace, a city unto itself. It was when this, the pride of their nation, fell into Garlemald’s clutches in 1552 that Doma became but another imperial province amongst many. For long years thereafter, the Domans tasted the bitterness of life as Garlean subjects.
In the coming of the Seventh Astral Era, however, the Empire was plunged into a war of succession. In that moment, the Domans saw their chance for freedom. Marshalling under the previous leader, the people took up arms. Their efforts bore victory, and many key landmarks were reclaimed, including the lost palace. Yet the discord in Garlemald ended more swiftly than the Domans had expected. The imperial forces rallied, and the Domans suffered a second crushing defeat. In the aftermath of the rebellion, the Garleans withheld any and all mercy. Those who took part in, or even supported the insurrection were given public executions, as were their families.
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(01-12-2017, 07:23 PM)Kazukata Wrote: 3. Something that's been a consistent frustration and would clear up a lot of my other questions, but I doubt there's an actual answer to: how autonomous were the Raen in Doma? They're constantly talked about like a separate group that allied with Doma, but literally everything that happens to Doma sounds like it also happens to the Raen, making them sound more like actual citizens of the nation.
The Raen were once nomadic like their Xaela cousins, spreading across Othard many many centuries ago. However, at some point, they gave up wandering and settled specifically in the coastal, southeastern Yanxia region of Othard, where Doma is found today. This region stretches from the One River to the northwest to the mountains of the north to the deserts of the south. Raen can be found in villages throughout this region, not all of them hailing from the city-state of Doma.
Raen can also be found in Hingashi, one of many smaller islands off the Yanxia coastline to the east of Doma across a sea known as the Ruby Tide. Hingashi is the birthplace of the shinobi and seems to have a similar culture and language to that of Doma, which makes sense as the two nations trade frequently.
In any case, the Raen adopt the language, customs, and culture of any nation in which they settle, according to the lore book. They adapt. So yes, there were Raen citizens of Doma. There are also Raen who are citizens of other nations in Othard. However, as the majority of our scope of the lore comes from the Doman refugees who fled to Eorzea (bringing with them the first Raen in Eorzea) much of the lore we get for the Raen is seen through the lens of Doma and their culture.
Encyclopedia Eorzea Wrote:Believing themselves the children of the Dawn Father, the forebears of the Raen left behind their homeland to settle across Othard. They were received with hatred and hostility by other races in the early years, until a prominent warlord of Yanxia, impressed with their valor, forged an alliance with the strange race and took them on as retainers. Before long, the Raen had assumed a prominent role as warriors in the service of countless great warlords.
Encyclopedia Eorzea Wrote:The Raen now make their homes in central Othard and the surrounding islands, where they have forged strong relations with the Hyur and other races, adapting readily to new cultures.
Lodestone Wrote:Unlike their sister clan, the Xaela, who bloody the land with endless tribal conflict, the Raen have embraced a life of tranquility and solitude, long abandoning the nomadic lifestyle of their ancestors to settle the deep valleys of Othard’s mountainous eastern reaches. Only on rare occasions will one emerge from the valley mists to seek adventure in realms afar.
Fernehalwes Wrote:Fernehalwes: “Now, whereas the Xaela are made up of dozens of small tribes lead by khans, the Raen are mostly stationary and live near Doma or in the Far Eastern islands across the sea from Doma. However, due to the invasion of Othard by the Garlean Empire, a lot of Raen have been displaced and now flock to areas where they can find safety—like Eorzea (as was the case with Yugiri).
Hope this helps! ^^