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Razamir Lahoka · **07-23-2013, 01:50 PM**

We would like to say this to everyone that feels we may have insulted them in some way shape or form.Â When we post on these forums that is never our intent. We merely wish to make our opinions known. Â

We can not take back anything that was hurtful that we said, even though I'm not exactly sure what these things were, but as it has been pointed out, our opinions have seemed insulting to some.

We can only ask that people forgive us, as that was never our intent.Â
Whether the individuals that feel we have wronged them, or others, do is their own choice.Â

We sincerely, and humbly make this apology to them.

For those that wish to know what we are apologizing over it is this thread
http://ffxiv-roleplayers.com/showthread.php?tid=2961

Asyria · **07-23-2013, 03:20 PM**

Who's "we"?
And why apologize if you're not sure what you're apologizing for?
I'm confused.

Razamir Lahoka · **07-23-2013, 03:54 PM**

(07-23-2013, 03:20 PM)Asyria Wrote: Who's "we"?
And why apologize if you're not sure what you're apologizing for?
I'm confused.

Â To clarify we " me and my wife "Â are apologizing for our opinions that led to hurt feelings.

Myxie Tryxle · **07-23-2013, 04:57 PM**

As the originator of that post and the target of most of the behavior for which you are apologizing, I'd like to express my gratitude for this post. It shows a lot of courage. Reputation +1

I can see why you would be frustrated that most of the discussion surrounding Miqo'te at the moment revolves around their reproductive biology. I even put forth an hour's worth of research and writing to try to expand the topic to include a discussion of the senses idea you requested as well as suggesting that it could be balanced from an RP perspective.

(07-23-2013, 12:07 PM)Rhynka Wrote: It isn't unreasonable, considering the info you gave about lion prides I knew when I was still in elementary school I have to question if you're really a biologist.

For the response to that effort to be a personal insult followed by two directly contradictory rants about how uninformed I am as a biologist while putting words in my mouth is insulting. I understand the desire to expand the discussion to other aspects of Miqo'te biology and culture, and I wholeheartedly approve. I'd like to see and engage in those discussions. If the discussions are rational and respectful, I'll be right there offering my own insights, considering others' viewpoints, and modifying my own perspective on the subject.

Asyria · **07-24-2013, 01:44 AM**

The whole study of miqo'te mating habit kinda reminded me of the Pretend Dragon thing the Animal Planet channel this. It was a fantasy study of a fantasy animal, done with a scientific approach based on real knowledge and myths alike.

Some of the reactions were like someone called the producers to tell them that episode made no sense and was of no interest.

I don't know why or how it got so serious, but kudos for apologizing.

Peaceful resolution is what we all like. Smile

Spiritual Machine · **07-24-2013, 11:34 AM**

(07-23-2013, 01:50 PM)Razamir Lahoka Wrote: We can not take back anything that was hurtful that we said, even though I'm not exactly sure what these things were, but as it has been pointed out, our opinions have seemed insulting to some.

I think I can help.

You see, when discussing a topic or refuting someone's comment, it's usually in bad form to mock and insult people, and generally approach others in an angry and hostile tone and manner for the purposes of expressing an opinion. This is especially the case when it's possible that the target of this reaction may have misconstrued their intentions. Most of communication, after all, has less to do with what is said than how it's said. The tone and such.

And perhaps the tone of these angrier posts was also misconstrued, but a number of people had the same reaction to those, and the insults were definitely real.

All told, I wasn't involved in that debacle at all, but I read the whole thing. You yourself don't appear to me to be the one who got inflammatory. I don't know if you should be apologizing for both you and Rhynka, especially if you're not sure what was said that made things in that last thread go so pear-shaped.

Personally I don't think that saving face is a very brave maneuver like other people here do. No one wants to be persecuted, after all. However, the fact that you made a whole new thread to acknowledge that something went wrong and express remorse for that is a pretty decent thing to do.

It's not the courage that is important, I think, so much as it is the degree of self-awareness that this shows. In a community like this one where for the most part we much moderate ourselves, self-awareness is something that decent people ought to have. I believe you when you say that you didn't mean to cause upset or harm, and for my part I'm not gonna hold it against you.

Kyatai · **07-24-2013, 09:10 PM**

^^^^this.

Zyrusticae · **07-25-2013, 12:25 AM**

(07-24-2013, 11:34 AM)Spiritual Machine Wrote: I think I can help.

Show Content

Spoiler
You see, when discussing a topic or refuting someone's comment, it's usually in bad form to mock and insult people, and generally approach others in an angry and hostile tone and manner for the purposes of expressing an opinion. This is especially the case when it's possible that the target of this reaction may have misconstrued their intentions. Most of communication, after all, has less to do with what is said than how it's said. The tone and such.

And perhaps the tone of these angrier posts was also misconstrued, but a number of people had the same reaction to those, and the insults were definitely real.

All told, I wasn't involved in that debacle at all, but I read the whole thing. You yourself don't appear to me to be the one who got inflammatory. I don't know if you should be apologizing for both you and Rhynka, especially if you're not sure what was said that made things in that last thread go so pear-shaped.

Personally I don't think that saving face is a very brave maneuver like other people here do. No one wants to be persecuted, after all. However, the fact that you made a whole new thread to acknowledge that something went wrong and express remorse for that is a pretty decent thing to do.

It's not the courage that is important, I think, so much as it is the degree of self-awareness that this shows. In a community like this one where for the most part we much moderate ourselves, self-awareness is something that decent people ought to have. I believe you when you say that you didn't mean to cause upset or harm, and for my part I'm not gonna hold it against you.

Well-stated. I wish I could say it as nicely as you do (but I can't, so I didn't say anything at all).

However, I also have to add that it really helps if people actually read the thread. The whole thing about ERP was a complete non-sequitur from where the thread actually was. I don't understand why people needed to take offense to something that wasn't even happening in that thread and is only tangentially, in some roundabout way, related to it in the first place. If everyone just stuck with the topic (i.e. talking about Miqo'te from a purely biological perspective), things would've been hunky-dory.

But, you know what? There's someone who really should be making the apology, and it's not the OP...

Rhynka · **07-25-2013, 05:20 PM**

(07-24-2013, 11:34 AM)Spiritual Machine Wrote:
(07-23-2013, 01:50 PM)Razamir Lahoka Wrote: We can not take back anything that was hurtful that we said, even though I'm not exactly sure what these things were, but as it has been pointed out, our opinions have seemed insulting to some.
All told, I wasn't involved in that debacle at all, but I read the whole thing. You yourself don't appear to me to be the one who got inflammatory. I don't know if you should be apologizing for both you and Rhynka, especially if you're not sure what was said that made things in that last thread go so pear-shaped.

I guess us sitting right down next to each other to word the part of the post you just quoted wasn't enough? We're not just an IC couple, we are married IRL and we saw no reason to copy and paste the same statement into two different posts by two different users on the forums. Sorry if you missed that somewhere or not, but just about everything we do online (And off) we do as a team seeing as we represent not just ourselves but us as husband and wife as well.

And if you weren't part of it or insulted, I don't understand why you're giving your input at all except to try provoking something we're trying to let die.

(07-24-2013, 09:10 PM)Kyatai Wrote: ^^^^this.

If someone went at someone you loved IRL and called them "Boring" would you go back at them too or just let it happen? It still doesn't justify my behavior at all and I am sorry for insulting you, it was a knee jerk reaction in response to your remark toward Razamir.

(07-25-2013, 12:25 AM)Zyrusticae Wrote: But, you know what? There's someone who really should be making the apology, and it's not the OP...

I'm pretty sure you are speaking toward me. While I promised my husband, Razamir I wouldn't post on these threads again unless it is to submit a creative work of my own to the IC sections of the RPC forums... He's at work and can't stop me.Â My husband often takes the reigns in many situations IRL or online to advocate on my part as well as his if needed because of my condition.

I doubt any of this is important to state since it seems you will pick back at it just as you have the earnest apology we've both made. (When it was made toward Callipygian, and Kyatai because those were the two directly insulted, not you Zyrusticae.) I guess I'll apologize for disturbing whatever I did with you, but please don't expect a response, I am done making my husband look bad, mmk?

That said, thank you very much to those who did accept our apology. If Razamir were next to me right now I'm sure he would want to say the same! As promised, I'm not posting any further opinions on these forums again, and I ask others not bring me up to my husband in such a tone again. It's human nature he'd want to defend me, so I cut in before he could.

Happy RPs for all... Peace!

Kyatai · **07-25-2013, 05:39 PM**

Totally respect that and it's over and done, Rhynka.

I will say on my behalf that I had absolutely NO intent to 'attack' Razamir nor did I think I called him boring. I find his posts anything of the sort. As I said in my apology- I totally misunderstood what he meant by 'noses of hounds' (thinking it a physical, not a scent attribute) and further thought he was saying "lets talk about something other than sex! how about noses?!"
Was a total misunderstanding- NOT an attack on your husband.
And I did apologize and explain in the thread, at that time, but it was the last post on page 5 I think and might have been missed.

Either way, over and done with. Onward and upward.
Smile

Asyria · **07-27-2013, 10:42 AM**

It's not like anyone was aware that the apology post was worded by two people, so reacting agressively to what some said about who should be apologizing is a bit unfair and kinda does mess up the whole apology thing.

Just keep things in perspective, folks.

Spiritual Machine · **07-28-2013, 01:51 AM**

(07-27-2013, 10:42 AM)Asyria Wrote: It's not like anyone was aware that the apology post was worded by two people, so reacting agressively to what some said about who should be apologizing is a bit unfair and kinda does mess up the whole apology thing.

Just keep things in perspective, folks.

Yes, this is exactly my sentiment.

@Rhynka, I'm not here to provoke anything, no. I was only trying to be helpful by offering a bit of perspective.

First, I was explaining what it was people viewed as improper about the posts your husband is apologizing for, since he wasn't certain about that.

Second, I was presenting the idea that in addition to unduly insulting people on the forum and lashing out in a really unnecessary and unfriendly manner might make you look bad to people who are just reading the thread you're posting in, hurting your reputation.

I offered that I wouldn't judge you guys based on that perception, since it had all seemed like a misunderstanding, but I don't think you're helping matters by getting defensive again. We're all being friendly here, or so I thought.

Let's just chill out about everything. No one's trying to ostracize anyone. Stuff happens.

Azthran · **07-28-2013, 02:16 AM**

The apology has been made and I hope that some misunderstanding have been cleared up so I think it would be best if we just let it go and stop posting on this thread.

So with respect I ask that we all just leave this be.

Public Apology

RPC has moved! These pages have been kept for historical purposes