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K'nahli · **04-17-2015, 11:16 AM**

(04-17-2015, 11:10 AM)Warren Castille Wrote:
(04-17-2015, 11:05 AM)K Wrote: Clover said her problem was that, were she to create an Au Ra from that clan, then she'd have to write it off as though her tribe were not involved in any sort of war - if she were even still part of one.

Your response was basically citing this exact same problem as a reason why the lore won't work. It sounded like you were refuting her point by somehow using her own point when ultimately that only meant that you were both of the same understanding!

Hence, you are a silly sausage.

Well, yes, but Nunhs. If you're going to play one, you should have a good reason why you're not doing the lore-expected thing you should be doing. Those Au Ra are warlike and fight their tribal battles. If you want to do that, you won't be in Eorzea. So don't roll that character...? I see your point, but this is definitely PEBKAC.

Nunhs is an odd case in my opinion. If you leave your tribe, even temporarily then you're not going to hold the title anymore. It makes no sense to. People(IC) just choose to anyways, out of pride or something perhaps but they're kidding themselves really. In other words, it's not really an issue for them, people(OOC) just sometimes seem to choose to take the route that makes less sense(at least those who don't accept that it's just a false title).

For Xaela.... well, plainly put there is nothing they can do about their lore situation without taking massive liberties about it. You're saying "don't play" them but that's precisely the issue!

Martiallais · **04-17-2015, 11:19 AM**

Well I think even on a personal level it could be effective in bringing something to RP. Then again I know I personally find the idea of a rival for my characters something that can be really fun and provide lots of great moments/scenes.

Within one LS you could have a variety of Au Ra, like some people who still carry those innate dislikes (grudge matches?) and probably others who want to 'put the past behind' and focus on 'bigger issues'. But I'm just sort of rolling along and rambling off topic now.

Warren Castille · **04-17-2015, 11:20 AM**

(04-17-2015, 11:16 AM)Knahli Wrote: For Xaela.... well, plainly put there is nothing they can do about their lore situation without taking massive liberties about it. You're saying "don't play" them but that's precisely the issue!

But you can play them! You just have to be alright with having reduced tribal connections and/or no wars to fight. Or, making a big tribe with other players and finding rivals.

I admit that it's not comfy for roleplayers, but remember that the player character is supposed to be coming to Eorzea as an adventurer, not as one of the rank-and-file citizens.

Aya · **04-17-2015, 11:21 AM**

Huh.. wow.. so the old Dark Knights are Aya's heroes.Â I really didn't expect that sort of twist Smile

Gegenji · **04-17-2015, 11:23 AM**

(04-17-2015, 11:20 AM)Warren Castille Wrote:
(04-17-2015, 11:16 AM)K'nahli Wrote: For Xaela.... well, plainly put there is nothing they can do about their lore situation without taking massive liberties about it. You're saying "don't play" them but that's precisely the issue!

But you can play them! You just have to be alright with having reduced tribal connections and/or no wars to fight. Or, making a big tribe with other players and finding rivals.

I admit that it's not comfy for roleplayers, but remember that the player character is supposed to be coming to Eorzea as an adventurer, not as one of the rank-and-file citizens.

Couldn't another Xaela tribe have fled (or maybe one of its last members) to Eorzea and yours came after them? Or sent you? Then your character is effectively still having those tribal connections (you're on a mission from your tribe, after all) and you have a war-related plot hook (especially if your target gathers up allies or weasels their way into a hard to reach place a la Taeros).

K'nahli · **04-17-2015, 11:33 AM**

(04-17-2015, 11:20 AM)Warren Castille Wrote:
(04-17-2015, 11:16 AM)K Wrote: For Xaela.... well, plainly put there is nothing they can do about their lore situation without taking massive liberties about it. You're saying "don't play" them but that's precisely the issue!

But you can play them! You just have to be alright with having reduced tribal connections and/or no wars to fight. Or, making a big tribe with other players and finding rivals.

I admit that it's not comfy for roleplayers, but remember that the player character is supposed to be coming to Eorzea as an adventurer, not as one of the rank-and-file citizens.

Haha, of course we can, but returning back to Clover, that was her concern. She likes adhering to lore and not neglecting the unique story/personalities it can give us, hence why she plays her miqo'te as a tribal. She was looking forward to adopting Auri lore on to her own character that will be from the Xaela clan but now she is forced to largely ignore it - as will most everyone else.

(Sorry for being unclear!)

(04-17-2015, 11:23 AM)Gegenji Wrote:
(04-17-2015, 11:20 AM)Warren Castille Wrote:
(04-17-2015, 11:16 AM)K'nahli Wrote: For Xaela.... well, plainly put there is nothing they can do about their lore situation without taking massive liberties about it. You're saying "don't play" them but that's precisely the issue!

But you can play them! You just have to be alright with having reduced tribal connections and/or no wars to fight. Or, making a big tribe with other players and finding rivals.

I admit that it's not comfy for roleplayers, but remember that the player character is supposed to be coming to Eorzea as an adventurer, not as one of the rank-and-file citizens.

Couldn't another Xaela tribe have fled (or maybe one of its last members) to Eorzea and yours came after them? Or sent you? Then your character is effectively still having those tribal connections (you're on a mission from your tribe, after all) and you have a war-related plot hook (especially if your target gathers up allies or weasels their way into a hard to reach place a la Taeros).

Very interesting indeed...

Kismet · **04-17-2015, 11:34 AM**

Speaking of Nuhns being 'proper' Nuhns, we still don't know for sure whether tribal Miqo'te life for Seekers is still commonplace or not. We have examples that say it is, and examples that say isn't. The RP community is kind of split on which side they want to adopt as being the norm.

This could possibly also be true for one or both of the Au Ra clans. Perhaps a sizable portion of Xaela view tribal, nomadic life as old-fashioned? Perhaps a sizable portion of Raen view settled, quiet life in the mountain valleys as inefficient? Who knows.

allgivenover · **04-17-2015, 11:35 AM**

You are assuming they will have to be ignored, we don't actually know that yet.

K'nahli · **04-17-2015, 11:36 AM**

I may have to be ignored then. The concern, at least, is still valid ^^

Iex · **04-17-2015, 11:37 AM**

Another possibility for those wanting to play nomads (since it seems a lot of people don't want to play the Doman ones possiblyÂ due to the doman RP stigma.): Since likely the tribes have been fighting for a while... your tribe get mostly defeated and destroyed and then you just being nomading you way through life. If your family is tight knit you might want revenge/die honorablyÂ or maybe you realize it is somewhat hopeless for one person to defeat another tribe and just flee.Not the HEROIC choice... but still fitting.

Really not much was truly revealed other than location and social structure of loner and tight knit families. We also know all of these are 'standards' not hardcore rules via evidence presented by other race NPCs that don't follow the racial standard created by SE.

Just because your character is going to be 'different' than the standard doesn't mean you are going to fall into SPECIAL SNOWFLAKE EXPECTION SUPER AWESOME MARYSUE... (insert other trope stuff here) territory.

Melkire · **04-17-2015, 11:41 AM**

Culture doesn't just vanish because you emigrate/immigrate. Nomadic warrior peoples are not going to suddenly stop roaming or fighting territorial disputes just because they've been displaced. Assimilation is not instant, it takes years if not decades (I should know, my entire family immigrated to the U.S. back in the 70s and we're still VERY cultural w/ regards to our ethnic background).

It's like adding two tomcats who are new to each other to a household that already has two pugs for dogs. Staking out and fighting over and establishing territory is still going to happen... and the dogs rarely even care. (I've done this). I see Xaela in the same vein. Eorzea is just more territory over which to feud ("We earned the trust of the Gridanians, Johnston, YOU cant live here" "Well, Avery, Thanalan sucks, so we're moving in!")

K'nahli · **04-17-2015, 11:45 AM**

The singular examples, while nice, don't really help the issue much when you consider the sheer volume or Auri a lot of us are expecting to see injected into the community - all of whom will likely see little, other alternative than to turn to some generic excuse for whey they are even here.

Imagine if 80-90% of every miqo'te in-game had in their backstory that they were tribal but then "left"... wouldn't that start feeling a little bland after a while? That's kind of the point I think.

Warren Castille · **04-17-2015, 11:51 AM**

(04-17-2015, 11:45 AM)Knahli Wrote: The singular examples, while nice, don't really help the issue much when you consider the sheer volume or Auri a lot of us are expecting to see injected into the community - all of whom will likely see little, other alternative than to turn to some generic excuse for whey they are even here.

Imagine if 80-90% of every miqo'te in-game had in their backstory that they were tribal but then "left"... wouldn't that start feeling a little bland after a while? That's kind of the point I think.

That's part of the challenge of playing a new race, though. If people can't do it, they shouldn't do it.

I say this, of course, perched high above my throne on Highmander Master Race Mountain.

Melkire · **04-17-2015, 11:53 AM**

There are so many ways to spin that though. Look at ROG and NIN. Is every knife-fighter in Eorzea trained by Jacke and co.? Has every ninja taken lessons from Oboro or whatever his name was?

When the hang-up is "universal origin is bland," that's not a lore concern, that's purely a roleplay issue on a personal level. Xaela aren't nearly as restricted by lore as, say, White Mages are... and yet I can point to people who have creatively justified their divergence of origin.

Bryn · **04-17-2015, 12:00 PM**

(04-17-2015, 11:41 AM)Melkire Wrote: Culture doesn't just vanish because you emigrate/immigrate. Nomadic warrior peoples are not going to suddenly stop roaming or fighting territorial disputes just because they've been displaced. Assimilation is not instant, it takes years if not decades (I should know, my entire family immigrated to the U.S. back in the 70s and we're still VERY cultural w/ regards to our ethnic background).

It's like adding two tomcats who are new to each other to a household that already has two pugs for dogs. Staking out and fighting over and establishing territory is still going to happen... and the dogs rarely even care. (I've done this). I see Xaela in the same vein. Eorzea is just more territory over which to feud ("We earned the trust of the Gridanians, Johnston, YOU cant live here" "Well, Avery, Thanalan sucks, so we're moving in!")

Yep. Take the Ala Mhigans, for example; their migration into Greater Eorzea is very recent, having occurred only 20 years prior to ARR's launch, but the lore demonstrates loudly and frequently that very few of them have integrated into the cultures in which they now live. This isn't just a matter of them all being dirt poor and Ul'dah resenting their presence, either; quests in Little Ala Mhigo show that the 'Mhigans adhere stubbornly to their old customs and ways of seeing things.

The fact that so few 'Mhigans have managed to rise above the poverty of Pearl Lane, Little Ala Mhigo and the refugee camps says to me not that they are the feckless, ne'er-do-well layabouts the wealthy Ul'dahns claim them to be, but rather that they struggle with the collective and powerful wounding to the psyche that inevitably comes as a result of people from a warrior culture being dropped into a culture in which their philosophy, skills and traditional ways are not only undervalued, but seen as dangerous, primitive and worthless.

Like the 'Mhigans, the Au Ra Xaela are a warring people, and these cultures tend to be very proud. As such, we could reasonably expect the Xaela to cleave fiercely to their traditions and culture whatever they may be, wherever they find themselves living.

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