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pepperhelfier · **05-03-2015, 09:28 PM**

A few days ago I had asked about a Blue Mage concept on tumblr, thank you to those who replied, now I am bringing it here! I think Iâ€™m going to work with said concept for my miqoâ€™te Arialys- it fits her character and it was the original concept I had made for her. Iâ€™d like to take a minute and explain it, maybe get some more opinions and maybe even ideas on how to make it better? Either way, here goes!

[Image: tumblr_inline_nnsi8jniqy1tqxxfg_500.jpg]

[Image: tumblr_inline_nnsi8jniqy1tqxxfg_500.jpg]

(obligatory anime girl)

Blue Magic- Â is a skillset consisting of abilities used by monsters.Â

A lot of people may be concerned with the fact that this will enable my character to learn exceptional moves from certain enemies, such as the Primals or any other being that holds a terribly powerful type of move. Or that it will be an instant thing and suddenly sheâ€™d throwing around the move Bad Breath and decimating people. This is not, and will not be the case, ever. Since there are no actual game mechanics to go off of, I will refer to previous mechanics and such as a type of guideline. In FFXIV the Echo is something that can read aetherical waves, which memories are seemingly imprinted on, allowing anyone with the Echo to tap into the aether and see past events. Blue magic is just another type of aetherical wave (as is any magic), so with a type of altered Echo, a blue mage should be able to simply see/read the waves as they are produced, studying them before they disappear and memorizing them over time. No, Blue magic is not and instant process. Depending on the move and the skills of the blue mage themselves will depend on the moves they are able to wield/use. Just because they can read the waves and memorize them does not mean they will always have the available aether to actually use said move (limitations such as this prevent them from learning special moves from Primals/Bosses and such).

The process of learning the move means that the enemy must use the ability and the blue mage has to be present to see it, meaning they need a clear shot and no distractions during the usage of the ability. Unlike the Echo, it does not require one to be unconscious, but the blue mage will be incapacitated while they are reading the aetherical waves. Now, unlike the typical game mechanics of only being able to learn abilities from just monsters, the blue mage should be able to apply this to just about any type of magic, againâ€¦it depends on their abilities to read the aether and manipulate it later on. While Iâ€™m on the topic of abilities being usedâ€¦certain monsters have moves that were once able to be learned by the blue mageâ€¦which logic wise made very little sense. A prime example of this is Bad Breath that the Morbols use. This would not be a move that could be learned. Why? Morbols as a species are a plant like creatureâ€¦Bad Breath is not a move the requires aether to be used, logically I would say it is a type of poison produced by a gland the Morbols have, which is very potent. Since the blue mage does not have these glandsâ€¦this move is unattainable. This would go for a few different moves that are beast/creature specific like that- blue magic is strictly magic only.

Thatâ€™s all Iâ€™ve got for the moment on this topic, but it is something Iâ€™m going through with as a character concept. Any opinions/critique would be nice, Iâ€™d love any input on the topic really. Thank you for taking the time to read!

Yangh · **05-03-2015, 10:22 PM**

Everyone who knows me knows that I am a Blue Mage supremacist and thus I support any and all attempts at Blue Magery!

That aside, I've not much to add to what you wrote, however, I have been RPing a Pseudo Blue Mage concept for my character Yangh for the best part of 8 months, I think? I went a completely different route to your concept though. I instead used current known lore to construct a method that would allow my character to learn and hold monster magicks and attacks.

This works very similar to the way Odin does (I came up with the concept long before the lore of Odin was revealed mind you!) and I even posted a pre-mature version of it on this board... somewhere!

I'd be happy to share notes and such if you like!

I support this foray in to Blue Magery!

Steel Wolf · **05-04-2015, 06:26 AM**

I, too, support this Blue Mage stuffs. It's almost guaranteed (right now) that we'll not see the class in-game, so people coming up with ideas and their own stories without really making themselves to be uber-powerful is very cool.

Curious if this will see some traction and some neat, insular RP with a group of peoples. :3

OttoVann · **05-04-2015, 10:33 AM**

I never asked for anime

Cailean Lockwood · **05-04-2015, 10:40 AM**

(05-04-2015, 10:33 AM)OttoVann Wrote: I never asked for anime

Then you're playing the wrong game. Final Fantasy IS anime!

Bryn · **05-04-2015, 10:49 AM**

Still heartbroken we won't be getting BLU. It was my favourite class in FFXI. I don't buy SE's reasoning for it, because I think that with some thought it could be a wonderful addition to the game. It would be best like the FFXI set up: learn the abilities by hunting enemies, and pre-equip a skill set with allocated points before a duty. BLU could thus perform any of the three roles admirably, but not quite as well as jobs dedicated to those roles. It's real strength would come from buffs/debuffs unique to the class.

Oh, well. I can dream.

mongi291 · **05-04-2015, 11:03 AM**

(05-04-2015, 10:49 AM)Bryn Wrote: Still heartbroken we won't be getting BLU. It was my favourite class in FFXI. I don't buy SE's reasoning for it, because I think that with some thought it could be a wonderful addition to the game. It would be best like the FFXI set up: learn the abilities by hunting enemies, and pre-equip a skill set with allocated points before a duty. BLU could thus perform any of the three roles admirably, but not quite as well as jobs dedicated to those roles. It's real strength would come from buffs/debuffs unique to the class.

Oh, well. I can dream.

I think the biggest problem is actually learning skills. Even if it didn't require you to get hit (like in older FFs) and just required you to kill the enemy that knows the skill, it would force you to run dungeons and stuff just to learn abilities. And if you don't have a certain set of skills you will be gimp. As if grinding for gear wasn't tedious enough.
Not to mention, there are very few interesting enemy abilities, and we most likely wouldn't get the most interesting ones.

Mercurias · **05-04-2015, 11:06 AM**

*cracks fingers*

Now I'm not the lore expert that some of our friends here on the board are, but I'm not...Horrible. Here are the things I see which could step in your way:

First, you say that your blue mage concept would be able to read the aetheric 'waves' caused by aether-based skills utilized by other players and enemies. Functionally, even if you absolutely do not mean it that way, what you're saying is that any skill used by anyone that utilizes aether (rather than a biological component like, say, a barbed tail or breathing acid) is within the bounds of your character's ability to learn, right?

Now the only issue with that is it essentially leaves your character with an extremely perceptive form of magesight, which we've seen in multiple points of the game to be a thing (There are game instances involving both Conjurers in Gridania reading auras to discern a person's identity and the Thaumaturges in the THM questline referencing the use of an 'Inner eye" to see a person's progress). I say this because your character is able to read the 'waves' of the skills being used, like the frequency of the radio.Â

And y'know what? On its own, that's actually pretty cool. Your character might not be a godling, but she can sense when someone is using some kind of magic nearby and exactly what kind. I can dig that.Â

My main issue is the thought that she can, after 'reading' these skills, then duplicate them so easily. It's been on record that magic takes time, training, and dedication to learn, and by seeing HOW a person performs a spell, she would have to reproduce the same methods used by its caster, or create a hybridized version of the spell with her own aether. In other words, she could KNOW that someone is casting Fire III, but even if she knows exactly how it's done, it's going to take time and practice with Thaumaturgy in order to be able to cast it herself.

In FFXI, in order to become a blue mage, one was forced into an alchemical transfusion in order to use blue magic. This rendered a person able to use the skills of beasts by literally binding the souls of the slain monsters to the blue mage, but it came at a cost: No blue mage ever lived to die of old age due to the constant pain and horrible damage that blue magic incurs upon the body, and often blue mages would be consumed by the souls of the monsters they've slain and become monsters called Soulflayers. In other words, Blue Mages were very powerful, but they were also no longer human and risked transforming into a monster in full with every breath they take after their transformation.

Personally, I like the idea of going further into the concept of being a magical tuning fork or radar over blue magic because I think it would be more lore-friendly and, honestly, a little more fun to roleplay. I'm not you, however, and I can only give you the information and opinions I have. I hope it's of some use.

Another neat note that I hadn't known, and a little off topic, the head of the Immortals (the organization of Blue Mages serving the empire of Aht Urhgan, where the school of magic originated), was namedÂ Raubahn.

Bryn · **05-04-2015, 11:09 AM**

(05-04-2015, 11:03 AM)mongi291 Wrote:
(05-04-2015, 10:49 AM)Bryn Wrote: Still heartbroken we won't be getting BLU. It was my favourite class in FFXI. I don't buy SE's reasoning for it, because I think that with some thought it could be a wonderful addition to the game. It would be best like the FFXI set up: learn the abilities by hunting enemies, and pre-equip a skill set with allocated points before a duty. BLU could thus perform any of the three roles admirably, but not quite as well as jobs dedicated to those roles. It's real strength would come from buffs/debuffs unique to the class.

Oh, well. I can dream.
I think the biggest problem is actually learning skills. Even if it didn't require you to get hit (like in older FFs) and just required you to kill the enemy that knows the skill, it would force you to run dungeons and stuff just to learn abilities. And if you don't have a certain set of skills you will be gimp. As if grinding for gear wasn't tedious enough.
Not to mention, there are very few interesting enemy abilities, and we most likely wouldn't get the most interesting ones.

I don't see it as different at all to having to run dungeons to get the best gear for your level, or to get the drops for zodiac weapons. If anything, it would simply serve to lengthen the 'shelf life' of lowbie dungeons, which is something SE have been obviously keen on.

BLU got many of the interesting and signature FF moves in XI, they were simply adjusted for the player character in terms of strength and potency.

OttoVann · **05-04-2015, 11:11 AM**

I don't see why there needs to be super long drawn out explanations for a blue-mage IC. You learned spells from the Beast-Men. The end. Enjoy your rp. Piss on the haters.

Warren Castille · **05-04-2015, 11:13 AM**

The trouble in FFXI came from it being a second set of gear to obtain, to put it bluntly. You could have an i130-equivalent with no spell above level 15, and they'd be as effective as you'd think (which is to say, not at all). It doesn't translate well to XIV's paradigms.

V'aleera · **05-04-2015, 11:26 AM**

I personally think Blue Magic would fit nicely within the paradigm of arcanima. Arcanima is essentially it's own form of math and science, and I could see an arcanist observing a monster's magical capability, breaking down the the technique into its basic components, then recreating those conditions via magic and directing them toward a target.

Melkire · **05-04-2015, 11:33 AM**

(05-04-2015, 11:06 AM)Mercurias Wrote: First, you say that your blue mage concept would be able to read the aetheric 'waves' caused by aether-based skills utilized by other players and enemies. Functionally, even if you absolutely do not mean it that way, what you're saying is that any skill used by anyone that utilizes aether (rather than a biological component like, say, a barbed tail or breathing acid) is within the bounds of your character's ability to learn, right?

Now the only issue with that is it essentially leaves your character with an extremely perceptive form of magesight, which we've seen in multiple points of the game to be a thing (There are game instances involving both Conjurers in Gridania reading auras to discern a person's identity and the Thaumaturges in the THM questline referencing the use of an 'Inner eye" to see a person's progress). I say this because your character is able to read the 'waves' of the skills being used, like the frequency of the radio.Â

And y'know what? On its own, that's actually pretty cool. Your character might not be a godling, but she can sense when someone is using some kind of magic nearby and exactly what kind. I can dig that.Â

My main issue is the thought that she can, after 'reading' these skills, then duplicate them so easily. It's been on record that magic takes time, training, and dedication to learn, and by seeing HOW a person performs a spell, she would have to reproduce the same methods used by its caster, or create a hybridized version of the spell with her own aether. In other words, she could KNOW that someone is casting Fire III, but even if she knows exactly how it's done, it's going to take time and practice with Thaumaturgy in order to be able to cast it herself.

...correct me if I'm wrong, but the concept described here that is being considered by the OP as the mechanical justification for BLU would be, essentially, a FFXIV take on the Sharingan from Naruto.

If that is the case, fair word of warning: now matter how different you make this mechanic in minutae, there are going to be a lot of roleplayers who will object to this. Regardless of how you spin it, roleplayers of conjurers and thaumaturges and arcanists and every other school of magic are going to be disgruntled that this concept allows the character in question an intuitive, "unearned" understanding of how certain feats are performed or accomplished. Their characters will be disgruntled because they will take this as an invalidation of their own skills and hard work.

Good execution can mitigate this, such as the "you can learn how its done instantly but it will take you months of practice to perform it" idea. That said, this amounts to gimping the character to a significant degree.

For the record, I am not saying the OP shouldnt do this. I am saying that the OP should prepare themselves for a certain amount or degree of rejection should they choose to implement their concept as-is. This is especially true given that BLU has yet to be officially introduced to XIV and its lore, despite the existing numbers, however small, of BLU roleplayers.

Gegenji · **05-04-2015, 11:35 AM**

(05-04-2015, 10:49 AM)Bryn Wrote: BLU could thus perform any of the three roles admirably, but not quite as well as jobs dedicated to those roles. It's real strength would come from buffs/debuffs unique to the class.

This is where I see a problem due to FFXIV's sticking to the Tank/DPS/Healer triad. I could see it having some abilities that might dip into the other roles (White Wind for Healing, Mighty Guard as a short term defensive buff to tank/help the tank), but I'd say it'd still have to stick to being a "DPS" class if it was ever implemented. Furthermore, I'd see it being like the BRD as a support-based class, using buffs/debuffs and its minor healing to aid the healers in topping folks off if needed.

(It'd be hilarious to have their personal LB3 be Self-Destruct, which wouldn't kill them but instead an AoE hit centered on them.)

But that's neither here nor there, I suppose, I just wanted to put my two cents in. As for RPing as the class, I stick to my Rule of How. If you can answer my "how?" question, I'm cool with it. Though I am liable to press further, kinda like Mercurias already did, if it seems a bit... sketchy? Is that the right word for it?

And the only real issue this envisioning of BLU brings to mind is that... it's just someone who can understand and learn all types of magic? That sounds more like the old... Sage class, I think? Or even a RDM - who could cast both White and Black Magic. BLU's allure, to me, comes from being able to use those beastly abilities no one else can - the Bad Breath and 1000 Needles - which this concept says they wouldn't be able to do.

Meanwhile, we have ALCs and we have the concept of crystallized beast aether (atma) that is already present in game. So I could totally see going the FFXI route of creating, say, a Morbol Atma by gathering enough Morbol Tentacles or whatever to concoct the infusion potion. It'd be neat (and kinda disturbing) to see a person going out to actively hunt couerls with a set of sampling shears and a wide-eyed look of excitement.

Yangh · **05-04-2015, 11:58 AM**

Since we're talking BLU I might as well throw in my existing concept of how I do it... even though I mostly RP it with VERY few people because peoples like to get reaaallll antsy about grey areas of lore (and non existing too) and rightly so.

The method I took with BLU was akin to a parasitic weapon (A Scimitar obviously) that actively seeks monsters and guides the user to them in order to feed on them. Once defeated, the weapon severs and captures the aether of said monster as it attempts to return to the life stream (Much like Odin severs and binds, and much like the process we see in the MSQ with the Ascian and crystal).

The essence of the monster is then stored within one of eight un-aspected aetherical crystals that are set in to the hilt of the weapon itself which can then be called on for later use. Actually calling upon the monster skill itself is a question of the users will to force it to manifest and spoken words of power (In Yangh's case she speaks her native tongue to force the spells to manifest). Every essence will fight and struggle against the user as they are commanded and more so still when they are bound back to the crystal. If the users will is overcome, the weapon then devours the user instead and becomes dormant. Each essence is effectively bound to the user who trapped it and is dispersed when they either die or is devoured.

I went with this method simply because it lines up with known lore (Even though it didn't at the time but luckily it all worked out) and things we have seen and read about in the game itself.

The question of RP balance is down to the delivery as Melkire mentioned. Its a powerful concept and the real challenge is curbing its potentially overwhelming power, which is easy enough done... especially as most of the spells she uses are of protective nature. She has very few direct attack spells.

-takes breath-

I'd also like to echo the advice already given and say that there will be some or perhaps even many who would not be happy with the concept (I've met a few) and that's completely fine. People have opinions, they have their right to them just the same as you having the right to RP whatever you want.

Anyway... just thought I'd share that, might help you or someone further down the road!

Sorry for the wall of text!

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