(09-12-2014, 03:58 AM)LiadansWhisper Wrote: I don't think that "leadership" and "authority" can be confined to specific titles, though. Â If a Padjal walks up to a Forestborn and says something, the Forestborn will listen. Â There's a difference between Official Authority and social authority, and from what I can tell, Padjal have that social authority in spades. Â They are given great deference (and it seems like, in general, there is little to no questioning of Padjal or Hearers). Â Was this different in 1.0?
Yes and no. I definitely agree that most often if a Padjal asked something of a forestborn, that person would probably comply. As they are the channel between Man and Elemental, it'd be kind of silly not to. But Padjal don't often ask things of others or exert said authority. Which is the difference. (I guess that's what I was trying to say before?)
However, we do have a couple lore examples of Padjal being challenged on their "authority."
Vista #40 - Haukke Manor
"Long frowned upon by the people of Gridania as a symbol of excess, the Seedseers would finally submit to pressure from the citizenry, selling the deed to the manor to Lady Amandine of House Dartancours. The word "Haukke" is of ancient Padjali origin and means, "to speak without words."
From the 1.0 Order of the Twin Adder Page:
"The Order of the Twin Adder establishes a medium from which the Seedseers can return from their wanderings deep within the Black Shroud and directly oversee not only the safety of Gridania's citizens, but the workings of the local guard. Both the God's Quiver, who defend the forest from external threats, and the Wood Wailers, who protect it from internal strife, have expressed their support of this temporary measure. There are, however, those within Gridania who would question the ability of the Seedseers, whose duties until now have been limited to various ritualistic proceedings, and doubt whether or not they are fit to lead a nation into war."
Compare to the 2.0 Order of the Twin Adder Page:
"The Order of the Twin Adder...' '...have expressed their support of this temporary measure. Although they have proven their aptitude for handling political affairs in light of the Calamity and events that followed, there are still those within Gridania who would question the Seedseer's ability to lead a nation into war."
But aside from these examples, in the 1.0 Gridania Storyline Quest "Beckon of the Elementals" we eavesdrop in on a conversation between Bowlord Lewin and O-App-Pesi. In the cutscene, O-App defers to Lewin's judgement on the matters at hand. Also, a few cutscenes later when Yda and Papalymo are caught "red handed" at the burning tree, it is Lewin who stands the Wood Wailers down, not O-App.
(09-12-2014, 03:58 AM)LiadansWhisper Wrote: Question! Â If the Seedseer Council is made up of the guild leaders, why are A-Ruhn Senna and Raya-O Senna called the Seedseer Siblings or whatever? Â After going through the 2.0 questline, I was under the impression that they were the actual council (which rather gave me pause, since A-Ruhn is kind of a dickhead).
This is an interesting question. Lore on this is kind of confusing for me as well. I might be wrong on this. I could've sworn in 1.0 that Bowlord Lewin and Swethyna show up at a Council gathering, however I can't seem to find the quest. Bleh.
Anyways, if the Seedseer Council is made up of only Hearers, it would need to be greater than just the Senna family, because the Senna family never really graced Gridania with their presence much before 1572. Kan-E-Senna's Twin Adder speech started off with an introduction of who she was to her people. And in "Imperial Devices" the Wood Wailers who survived Toto-Rak didn't even know who A-Ruhn-Senna was when he saved them. They just thought he was some batshit crazy Padjal wandering around Toto-Rak.
So I guess the Seedseer Council was made up entirely of Hearers from the Stillglade Fane meaning E-Sumi-Yan, O-App-Pesi, Telent, Morys, and Ingram.
As for why the Senna family is in control, I defer to this. Now, I'm not sure in what context "prominent" refers, as it could mean accomplished, oldest, or prominent number-wise, or combination of all three. Of which the Senna family is certainly the most prominent by that definition. So that is why the Senna siblings are heads of the Council. They are the most prominent Padjal family. But you are totally right, A-Ruhn is totally not cut out for leadership duties. Nor is Raya-O either, honestly. How did Gridania survive without Kan-E before 1572?? Poor E-Sumi had his work cut out for him...
