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(((All of the below is in reply to the post before Melphina's, which wasn't posted when I started typing, but in reply to Melphina, you specifically said in your post that you "didn't have time" to get through the lore of the game, though it seems you are well read and thought out. I don't think you specifically un-creative, but I do think the idea of world hopping into an RP community as such in every incarnation, and so don't take my thoughts on "those who posts these threads." to heart, as I am speaking of my experiences, rather than you in particular, and how those experiences shaped my opinion of "Just no please.". )))
I actually never use the term special snowflake, that is the first time I have ever used it on these forums, or even in my personal thoughts. Â I am not unreasonable at all, forcing my ideas on others, I am stating my opinion with sound arguments in reply to some of the nonsense I have had to listen to over the years of being on this site, and in this community. Â I am not just making things up and generalizing, I am looking at the sort of people that make these threads, and looking at the sorts of arguments against what I view as beyond the reasonable content of the community, from first hand, not from random thoughts.
Over the years, there has been an unceasing flow of people who want to not only just have their way with their not just "a little special or different" characters, but extraordinary characters, designed to the enjoyment of that RPer alone. Â Sure, some of you think "Yes, why not, could be fun? Â Could be fun to imagine this person is crazy, could be fun to let them play out this nonsense story-line, could be fun to imagine they are crazy, or playing a game, or god knows what else just because they should be allowed to", but what is really being said is, that even though we value our community, we should just let someone trample all over it by doing whatever they please. Â By allowing someone the rudeness of just coming into a generally fun and pre-established community while making whatever character they want, we are saying to prospective members of the community, and veteran ones alike: "Hey it is okay to just do whatever you want and ignore the rest of us, as long as someone RPs with you, who am I to say no?".
Okay...sure. Â We will go with that, we will go with the fact that someone else gets to be rude to those around them by being totally ignorant of the norms of the community which allow most of us to have fun in an environment without worry of crazy randoms the internet often throws out and into MMOs, but to any of us who want just say, "No, please don't do that, because the community isn't just you, it is all of us, and we may have to RP with you at some point, and would prefer you had a character that wasn't so far-fetched as to be completely annoying and awkward to the point of ruining the enjoyment of others around them." Â we are out to ruin fun.
Guess what? Â I say NO, we aren't ruining other people's fun, we are trying to have fun ourselves, and we are trying to uphold some of the scant norms of the community so that when we all get together from time to time, there isn't this glaring black-hole of stress at having to ignore, and being ignored in a social situation with creative little souls we work very hard on to protect and grow. Â Let me come at you from the prospective of the actual person I am, rather than the person you believe me to be, shall I?
As I said before, and this is in no way a popular opinion: Magi of all types should be allowed to play their roles as their characters. Â Someone wants to be a white mage? Â Let them! Â Elementals cannot control succor, they cannot take all the teaching away literally, and they tried to leave no trace of them before, but the practices still remain in some places, so I say, "Let them eat cake!", but less accidentally hypocritically, and more literally. Â Be a white mage, find a soul stone lost from the time of Amdapor, learn the ancient arts that brought about a Calamity, because you know what? Â Not every white mage was that powerful, not every single one was out to abuse their strength, and not every person is going to come along and claim all-powerful white mageness to themselves, because they know, that there are other people in this community who would like to play with them without having to jump through hoops for a conversation or adventure.
Wanna be a black mage? Â Please do! Â Mhach was one of the greatest civilizations to ever grace Eorzea. Â They were strong, ruthless, and their power unmatched at the time, and the Void Ark flies free! Â Somewhere, at some time, a black mage soulstone other than the singular Gem of Shatotto has been dropped, has been left behind by its dying master, only to be picked up again, thought nothing of, or sold as a precious artifact on the blackmarket, or hell, is still somewhere in the many ruins of the nations which rose out of it! Â Please do, it isn't popular, but guess what: It has actual precedence in the game! Â We know of the warrior of light being one right now of course, but the many jobs we have seen, some of them aren't hidden behind the gate the community builds around the lore of those jobs, and as we know much more about things than we might, things that we know that carry over into other jobs, we know that it is possible to have more than one soulstone per job, it is possible that anyone skilled enough could create one, and while not as likely, there are still more than three instances of it happening in the game and lore other than that of the WoL, so do it!
Approach with caution, these are jobs which aren't popular, but I think are well within the lore to do. Â You don't have to be a Thaumaturge forever, or a Conurer for the rest of your character life never to advance, because minimalism will win the day now, but at the start of the community, it wasn't like that at all, and I am sure sometime down the road, these jobs will likely become more widespread in the community. Â Hey, some of those claimed minimalists, have characters so grandiose and nonsensical, that I can barely even hear them talk about the character, much less RP with them, so don't let them tell you that you can't be a powerful mage, work for it, work up to it, be creative and do it!
See all that up there? Â Those are just a couple of my actual opinions on things, rather than me just being a person who generally crushes the hopes of all creativity. Â I am not like that, there are people here who are, but that isn't what I am asking. Â I have lots more opinions that are similarly "unpopular", and in reality, because of many of my opinions, I don't consider myself to be a very popular part of this community, but that is okay, because I am not afraid to share my opinion whether people think it is PC of whatever. Â I will be the first to tell you that this community has changed, and not always for the better, but I am not trying to "retake it for freedom!" or what have you, I am doing my thing and hoping to be a no-nonsense sort as I do so. Â I am asking people to very specifically:
1. Be actually creative, don't say, "Hey I am doing something new, that is creative!" Â but tell yourself, "Hey, I love this character, this character has worth and meaning, now how can I genuinely bring that worth and meaning into another world, so that I can share that with others while still actually playing with them, and not in a majority against them?"
2. Call on your sense of sharing the community, don't act like a victim because nearly every person asks, why do something like this when you can literally do a thousand other, genuinely shareable and interesting ideas without making the rest of us bend over backwards to include you? Â Just want to be with us, want to be a part of the community, and want your character to function with a variety of people, and not just "some that accept you", because you are cutting us off and yourself off, but blaming the rest of us who gave you perfectly good reasons not to do so, and plenty of space with which to build on.
3. Don't generalize others opinions so that it gives just cause to do whatever you want. Â RPing isn't about doing "whatever you want", none of the lasting characters who have been with the community for years now, came here, to a Coalition of RPers, and said, "Hey, I am just going to do whatever I want, and screw you guys, I am freedom and liberty, and more nonsense like that!" No...just no, we didn't, we thought: "Oh hey, more people who love to do what I do, we should get together and colab on stories and have fun together!" Â You aren't the nail which sticks out and gets hammered down, you are the child at the end of the row still trying to fit a square block into a round hole and refusing to see how others do things so that you can get the enjoyment of figuring this all out with us.
There is a much longer list around here somewhere, but those are a few of my thoughts pertaining to this particular discussion, so I will leave them at that. Â Furthermore (yes really), forget the Atomos and Void, it isn't going to happen for you, you can't make "fetch" happen. Â The Atomos no longer lives, it's Maws are inactive and permanently closed (Except Abyseean ones? Which still transferred you to a given place as far as I know.), and to be honest, whatever "mysteries" the world of XI or XIV holds for us, in both instances, these stories have been very clearly thought out. Â Besides the three trans-dimensional mover and shakers, we have not one single other "normal" person who popped through, we do not have a single bit of flavor text that has ever been mentioned by any of the numerous NPCs which have lore bits so obscure as to point out nearly every other plot point outside of the MSQ, but apparently, they "forgot, or didn't pay any attention to" the admittedly big event of trans-dimensional travel...right, please keep that hope alive. Â Also...each final fantasy is worked on by a team, there is no hivemind of creators in the FF world, where they all have a say, a boss (or a board of them likely) chooses a director for each game, they put together a team, and work on their own project, just because one person says somewhere down the line that "all the FF worlds are connected" doesn't mean that every single director or writer has to agree on that, and certainly, like many of the things in the cash shop, i.e. fantasia, and the like, this is an MMO...some things have to happen to help keep the game interesting and accessible, whether they are canon to the lore or not. Â Lightning? Â Gimmick. Iroha? Â Gimmick. Â Shantotto as I said (whether we assume her to be Shatotto or otherwise in our own heads (mine)), is one of the most powerful characters in XI, and her way of transportation is through a spell of her own design, so figuring you used the same spell, now we have to take you as an all-powerful mage strong enough to match Shantotto as well as a trans-dimensional traveler...hmmm, sure, that could be fun, would you like to be the WoL too? I see no one backing that claim.
If nothing else, one should take Shantotto/Shatotto as their precedence of what to do with their XI character...adapt them...
I actually never use the term special snowflake, that is the first time I have ever used it on these forums, or even in my personal thoughts. Â I am not unreasonable at all, forcing my ideas on others, I am stating my opinion with sound arguments in reply to some of the nonsense I have had to listen to over the years of being on this site, and in this community. Â I am not just making things up and generalizing, I am looking at the sort of people that make these threads, and looking at the sorts of arguments against what I view as beyond the reasonable content of the community, from first hand, not from random thoughts.
Over the years, there has been an unceasing flow of people who want to not only just have their way with their not just "a little special or different" characters, but extraordinary characters, designed to the enjoyment of that RPer alone. Â Sure, some of you think "Yes, why not, could be fun? Â Could be fun to imagine this person is crazy, could be fun to let them play out this nonsense story-line, could be fun to imagine they are crazy, or playing a game, or god knows what else just because they should be allowed to", but what is really being said is, that even though we value our community, we should just let someone trample all over it by doing whatever they please. Â By allowing someone the rudeness of just coming into a generally fun and pre-established community while making whatever character they want, we are saying to prospective members of the community, and veteran ones alike: "Hey it is okay to just do whatever you want and ignore the rest of us, as long as someone RPs with you, who am I to say no?".
Okay...sure. Â We will go with that, we will go with the fact that someone else gets to be rude to those around them by being totally ignorant of the norms of the community which allow most of us to have fun in an environment without worry of crazy randoms the internet often throws out and into MMOs, but to any of us who want just say, "No, please don't do that, because the community isn't just you, it is all of us, and we may have to RP with you at some point, and would prefer you had a character that wasn't so far-fetched as to be completely annoying and awkward to the point of ruining the enjoyment of others around them." Â we are out to ruin fun.
Guess what? Â I say NO, we aren't ruining other people's fun, we are trying to have fun ourselves, and we are trying to uphold some of the scant norms of the community so that when we all get together from time to time, there isn't this glaring black-hole of stress at having to ignore, and being ignored in a social situation with creative little souls we work very hard on to protect and grow. Â Let me come at you from the prospective of the actual person I am, rather than the person you believe me to be, shall I?
As I said before, and this is in no way a popular opinion: Magi of all types should be allowed to play their roles as their characters. Â Someone wants to be a white mage? Â Let them! Â Elementals cannot control succor, they cannot take all the teaching away literally, and they tried to leave no trace of them before, but the practices still remain in some places, so I say, "Let them eat cake!", but less accidentally hypocritically, and more literally. Â Be a white mage, find a soul stone lost from the time of Amdapor, learn the ancient arts that brought about a Calamity, because you know what? Â Not every white mage was that powerful, not every single one was out to abuse their strength, and not every person is going to come along and claim all-powerful white mageness to themselves, because they know, that there are other people in this community who would like to play with them without having to jump through hoops for a conversation or adventure.
Wanna be a black mage? Â Please do! Â Mhach was one of the greatest civilizations to ever grace Eorzea. Â They were strong, ruthless, and their power unmatched at the time, and the Void Ark flies free! Â Somewhere, at some time, a black mage soulstone other than the singular Gem of Shatotto has been dropped, has been left behind by its dying master, only to be picked up again, thought nothing of, or sold as a precious artifact on the blackmarket, or hell, is still somewhere in the many ruins of the nations which rose out of it! Â Please do, it isn't popular, but guess what: It has actual precedence in the game! Â We know of the warrior of light being one right now of course, but the many jobs we have seen, some of them aren't hidden behind the gate the community builds around the lore of those jobs, and as we know much more about things than we might, things that we know that carry over into other jobs, we know that it is possible to have more than one soulstone per job, it is possible that anyone skilled enough could create one, and while not as likely, there are still more than three instances of it happening in the game and lore other than that of the WoL, so do it!
Approach with caution, these are jobs which aren't popular, but I think are well within the lore to do. Â You don't have to be a Thaumaturge forever, or a Conurer for the rest of your character life never to advance, because minimalism will win the day now, but at the start of the community, it wasn't like that at all, and I am sure sometime down the road, these jobs will likely become more widespread in the community. Â Hey, some of those claimed minimalists, have characters so grandiose and nonsensical, that I can barely even hear them talk about the character, much less RP with them, so don't let them tell you that you can't be a powerful mage, work for it, work up to it, be creative and do it!
See all that up there? Â Those are just a couple of my actual opinions on things, rather than me just being a person who generally crushes the hopes of all creativity. Â I am not like that, there are people here who are, but that isn't what I am asking. Â I have lots more opinions that are similarly "unpopular", and in reality, because of many of my opinions, I don't consider myself to be a very popular part of this community, but that is okay, because I am not afraid to share my opinion whether people think it is PC of whatever. Â I will be the first to tell you that this community has changed, and not always for the better, but I am not trying to "retake it for freedom!" or what have you, I am doing my thing and hoping to be a no-nonsense sort as I do so. Â I am asking people to very specifically:
1. Be actually creative, don't say, "Hey I am doing something new, that is creative!" Â but tell yourself, "Hey, I love this character, this character has worth and meaning, now how can I genuinely bring that worth and meaning into another world, so that I can share that with others while still actually playing with them, and not in a majority against them?"
2. Call on your sense of sharing the community, don't act like a victim because nearly every person asks, why do something like this when you can literally do a thousand other, genuinely shareable and interesting ideas without making the rest of us bend over backwards to include you? Â Just want to be with us, want to be a part of the community, and want your character to function with a variety of people, and not just "some that accept you", because you are cutting us off and yourself off, but blaming the rest of us who gave you perfectly good reasons not to do so, and plenty of space with which to build on.
3. Don't generalize others opinions so that it gives just cause to do whatever you want. Â RPing isn't about doing "whatever you want", none of the lasting characters who have been with the community for years now, came here, to a Coalition of RPers, and said, "Hey, I am just going to do whatever I want, and screw you guys, I am freedom and liberty, and more nonsense like that!" No...just no, we didn't, we thought: "Oh hey, more people who love to do what I do, we should get together and colab on stories and have fun together!" Â You aren't the nail which sticks out and gets hammered down, you are the child at the end of the row still trying to fit a square block into a round hole and refusing to see how others do things so that you can get the enjoyment of figuring this all out with us.
There is a much longer list around here somewhere, but those are a few of my thoughts pertaining to this particular discussion, so I will leave them at that. Â Furthermore (yes really), forget the Atomos and Void, it isn't going to happen for you, you can't make "fetch" happen. Â The Atomos no longer lives, it's Maws are inactive and permanently closed (Except Abyseean ones? Which still transferred you to a given place as far as I know.), and to be honest, whatever "mysteries" the world of XI or XIV holds for us, in both instances, these stories have been very clearly thought out. Â Besides the three trans-dimensional mover and shakers, we have not one single other "normal" person who popped through, we do not have a single bit of flavor text that has ever been mentioned by any of the numerous NPCs which have lore bits so obscure as to point out nearly every other plot point outside of the MSQ, but apparently, they "forgot, or didn't pay any attention to" the admittedly big event of trans-dimensional travel...right, please keep that hope alive. Â Also...each final fantasy is worked on by a team, there is no hivemind of creators in the FF world, where they all have a say, a boss (or a board of them likely) chooses a director for each game, they put together a team, and work on their own project, just because one person says somewhere down the line that "all the FF worlds are connected" doesn't mean that every single director or writer has to agree on that, and certainly, like many of the things in the cash shop, i.e. fantasia, and the like, this is an MMO...some things have to happen to help keep the game interesting and accessible, whether they are canon to the lore or not. Â Lightning? Â Gimmick. Iroha? Â Gimmick. Â Shantotto as I said (whether we assume her to be Shatotto or otherwise in our own heads (mine)), is one of the most powerful characters in XI, and her way of transportation is through a spell of her own design, so figuring you used the same spell, now we have to take you as an all-powerful mage strong enough to match Shantotto as well as a trans-dimensional traveler...hmmm, sure, that could be fun, would you like to be the WoL too? I see no one backing that claim.
If nothing else, one should take Shantotto/Shatotto as their precedence of what to do with their XI character...adapt them...