Thread Closed
I'm confused. YMMV on whether you think rape and sexual abuse should ever be involved in storytelling and how it should be handled. But the "problem" seems to be that it's here but not.... edgy enough? That women in XIV aren't treated badly enough?
"1) Women are institutionally equal to men in the world of FFXIV."
As Meishali, ZOMGodzilla, and others have pointed out, there is still sexism in Eorzea. Institutionalized sexism? Maybe not--not in the sense that it's written into laws or that unequal rights are legally granted. But systems can be corrupt in other ways, and institutionalized sexism does not make social sexism and individual sexists disappear. Rape exists outside of sexism. Sexism obviously raises the rates, but even in reality, men are often victims of sexual abuse and rape despite "the patriarchy" (granted that's often because the same sexism applied to women is also harmful for men). There will probably always be sickos looking to get off or to assert their dominance over another person, even in a reality free of sexism.
"2) Rape is facilitated by men possessing near-exclusive control of the means to apply physical violence."
Not every person in Eorzea is a soldier or an adventurer. Many are physically weak. The male counterparts of each race are all taller and larger than the female, in some instances even the max height female still falling short of a minimum height male (Au Ra obviously being the biggest example of this). They've got more size and muscle on their side (though maybe this doesn't mean anything in the XIV verse where Lalafell are on an even playing field with Roegadyn) so people can still very easily fall prey to physical attacks, not to mention, not every attack need be physical. IRL, most rapes aren't a stranger pouncing you in an alleyway, most are date rapes, and often don't involve physical struggle. Social force is often used instead. Threats to terminate the relationship or release some sort of blackmail or start rumors, threats to kick a woman out and leave her financially unstable without access to her children, general guilt-tripping and tearing someone down until they give in, intimidating a woman into compliance with physical threats that aren't actually (and maybe couldn't be) carried out, etc.
"3) FFXIV exists in a historical and social state that is not completely analogous to our own."
And in our own world, one in three women experiences some form of sexual or physical abuse in her lifetime. Sometimes carried out by other women. Sometimes with other women willfully turning a blind eye, or even assisting. There are numerous cases of pedophiles and kidnappers with wives and girlfriends who knew, or who even helped them in their crimes. Women can still be complicit in terrible things. It's a nice thought that women should stick together... but shouldn't we all? A woman shouldn't find rape any more abhorrent than a man, and yet there's no question of why a male soldier wouldn't step in or refrain. I wouldn't assume there's no women committing these same crimes against men just because we don't see them--though we do indeed see a hint of it, at the female pirate bar in Limsa Lominsa.
"4) The only time gender relations in FFXIV are addressed is with crude allusions to rape."
There are numerous male NPC's in the game trying to solicit sex from female NPC's, often with degrading or colorful speech. "Whoreson" and "bastard" are favored insults. Every single sex worker in the game (even the most tame example of the dancers) is a woman.
"5) Regardless of fan explanations, the unquestionable and unflinching equality of women in the world of FFXIV (outside of rape) makes the universe so alien to our own that it will be near-impossible to fully comprehend its social dynamics."
No.
Thinking that employing rape in a storyline should be off limits, or at least handled in certain ways, is perfectly valid and respectable. But I think it's harmful to a) insist that there is no sexism in Eorzea when there is indeed evidence of it; it's far too reminiscent of people who do the same in real life, and b) perpetuate the stereotype that rape is always a physically violent affair and always the product of men being stronger than women, thus implying even if unintentionally that date rape and the like are "not real rape." And maybe I'm assuming incorrectly, but it seems like that's what's rubbing most people the wrong way rather than the opinions of rape as a story element, as a good chunk of the playerbase I've heard from are wholly against it or want to see it handled in very specific ways.
"1) Women are institutionally equal to men in the world of FFXIV."
As Meishali, ZOMGodzilla, and others have pointed out, there is still sexism in Eorzea. Institutionalized sexism? Maybe not--not in the sense that it's written into laws or that unequal rights are legally granted. But systems can be corrupt in other ways, and institutionalized sexism does not make social sexism and individual sexists disappear. Rape exists outside of sexism. Sexism obviously raises the rates, but even in reality, men are often victims of sexual abuse and rape despite "the patriarchy" (granted that's often because the same sexism applied to women is also harmful for men). There will probably always be sickos looking to get off or to assert their dominance over another person, even in a reality free of sexism.
"2) Rape is facilitated by men possessing near-exclusive control of the means to apply physical violence."
Not every person in Eorzea is a soldier or an adventurer. Many are physically weak. The male counterparts of each race are all taller and larger than the female, in some instances even the max height female still falling short of a minimum height male (Au Ra obviously being the biggest example of this). They've got more size and muscle on their side (though maybe this doesn't mean anything in the XIV verse where Lalafell are on an even playing field with Roegadyn) so people can still very easily fall prey to physical attacks, not to mention, not every attack need be physical. IRL, most rapes aren't a stranger pouncing you in an alleyway, most are date rapes, and often don't involve physical struggle. Social force is often used instead. Threats to terminate the relationship or release some sort of blackmail or start rumors, threats to kick a woman out and leave her financially unstable without access to her children, general guilt-tripping and tearing someone down until they give in, intimidating a woman into compliance with physical threats that aren't actually (and maybe couldn't be) carried out, etc.
"3) FFXIV exists in a historical and social state that is not completely analogous to our own."
And in our own world, one in three women experiences some form of sexual or physical abuse in her lifetime. Sometimes carried out by other women. Sometimes with other women willfully turning a blind eye, or even assisting. There are numerous cases of pedophiles and kidnappers with wives and girlfriends who knew, or who even helped them in their crimes. Women can still be complicit in terrible things. It's a nice thought that women should stick together... but shouldn't we all? A woman shouldn't find rape any more abhorrent than a man, and yet there's no question of why a male soldier wouldn't step in or refrain. I wouldn't assume there's no women committing these same crimes against men just because we don't see them--though we do indeed see a hint of it, at the female pirate bar in Limsa Lominsa.
"4) The only time gender relations in FFXIV are addressed is with crude allusions to rape."
There are numerous male NPC's in the game trying to solicit sex from female NPC's, often with degrading or colorful speech. "Whoreson" and "bastard" are favored insults. Every single sex worker in the game (even the most tame example of the dancers) is a woman.
"5) Regardless of fan explanations, the unquestionable and unflinching equality of women in the world of FFXIV (outside of rape) makes the universe so alien to our own that it will be near-impossible to fully comprehend its social dynamics."
No.
Thinking that employing rape in a storyline should be off limits, or at least handled in certain ways, is perfectly valid and respectable. But I think it's harmful to a) insist that there is no sexism in Eorzea when there is indeed evidence of it; it's far too reminiscent of people who do the same in real life, and b) perpetuate the stereotype that rape is always a physically violent affair and always the product of men being stronger than women, thus implying even if unintentionally that date rape and the like are "not real rape." And maybe I'm assuming incorrectly, but it seems like that's what's rubbing most people the wrong way rather than the opinions of rape as a story element, as a good chunk of the playerbase I've heard from are wholly against it or want to see it handled in very specific ways.
![[Image: NCtCate.png]](http://i.imgur.com/NCtCate.png)