(07-19-2013, 05:55 AM)Uther Wrote: I'm sure this has been said before, but I only lightly skimmed this thread. It's clear to me that you know the difference between Ala Mhigo's lancers and Ishgard's dragoons. Some clarification might be needed on top of what Shuck already said, though.
You mentioned something earlier about your character's father always wanting to be a dragoon or wanting his son to be a dragoon or some such idea. While dragoons are seen as pretty badass in Eorzea, I'm not sure if it's something outsiders would really aspire to be. I see this a lot, and it's not just you who has this idea of outsiders yearning to be dragoons.Â
Aside from what Shuck already pointed out regarding the difficulty of becoming a dragoon, I personally don't see why most people would want to. Being a dragoon means you serve Halone the Fury in a holy war against dragons for the defense of Ishgard. Unless you were already worshiping Halone in your spare time and had some weird connection to a place you weren't even allowed to enter, why would you want to do that? A dragoon isn't just a really good lancer who jumps around and goes on adventures, as game mechanics seem to imply. Being a dragoon goes hand-in-hand with Halone, Ishgard, and fighting dragons. Of course, you see some dragoons wandering around out in the world, but those are usually exiles who have actually fought in the holy war.Â
The idea that anyone who holds a spear or some type of polearm would live their life trying to be a dragoon is confusing to me, and I see it a lot. It's like saying "I'm a swordsman from Mongolia, but I really want to be a Templar Knight." While Templars were very well-trained and word got around about them killing people, it's unlikely that someone from a different culture would commit their lives to their holy war, country of origin, and religion just to get some sweet tricks. I hope that makes sense.
Not trying to ruin your day or anything. I just thought I'd throw in my two cents as someone who is also roleplaying a dragoon.
I hate to say this, as I am absolutely loving this discussion, but isn't this lore-abiding view of Dragoons a bit... elitist? Â Trust me, I am fully aware of what an ironic statement that is. Â But we have to look at the gameplay mechanic as well as backstory to make any of this work. Â
To become a Dragoon, in game, you have to level your Lancer class.  I don't think anyone will disagree with that.  Uther, I read your backstory, and it's interesting as hell with one caveat: the only way that your story works (and by proxy, the Dragoon class) is if you were already a Dragoon before the events of the game.  All things being equal once ARR rolls out, how do we explain the masses of folks that have the same intentions and aspirations that you do (to become a Dragoon) without the backstory of them already being one?  I hate to point out the obvious, but excluding RP, Ishgard is not a starting city-state, and as far as mechanics go, if you want to fly into the Dragoon class swiftly, you're starting as a Lancer in Gridania.  Now, you can RP that you're a Dragoon in the meantime, but for me personally, that doesn't allow for RPvE opportunities, which is something that appeals to me.  It seems that taking a 'you don't know what it means to be a real Dragoon' approach to anyone who works towards that Job without a lore-centric background could potentially make things difficult in the future.  This is an honest question: How then, IC, would Uther explain the multitude of other players running around with the Dragoon class?  OOC,as far as I know the jobisn't some random scripted in-game event that selects random PC's to be worthy of the title, it's something that has to be initiated by the PC.  It is something to strive for.  Of course people are going to strive for it, that's not confusing to me at all.  I get the analogy of the Mongolian Swordsman wanting to be a Templar, and it's a good one, but that's not what this is.  Which indeed brings me to my point.
Kayle isn't a Dragoon!  His father wasn't a Dragoon, his step-father wasn't a Dragoon.  (resolved in a previous post)  It's a childhood aspiration.  I could have just made him a Lancer, like his father before him, and worked my way up the ladder to becoming a Dragoon, as the gameplay mechanics demands.  But instead I forced another role upon Kayle due to circumstance.  Does that mean he still doesn't have aspirations?  Of course not.  To play off of your analogy, let's say some kid from the slums who's great a basketball has dreams of becoming an astronaut.  That doesn't strike me as odd at all.  Does it mean he'll become and astronaut?  Not necessarily.  Does it mean he can't become one?  Absolutely not!  I am aware that there are in game restrictions to the Dragoon, and to be honest, Kayle has no idea what they are.  To him they are childhood stories, mythical figures that are rarely seen in public.  And that intrigues the hell out of him.
Character Profile:Â Kayle Delwyn