RPC has moved! These pages have been kept for historical purposes

K'nahli · **09-01-2013, 03:54 PM**

(09-01-2013, 03:47 PM)katattax Wrote:
(09-01-2013, 03:28 PM)K Wrote: Welll, even if they have a different way of doing things I think many of us can't help but bring some aspects closer to home to make our characters feel more human and less animal >w< I don't imagine my character will engage in any relationship but I don't want to absolutely cut off any possibility for her either ;w;

I always saw them as more human than animal, aside from flicking ears, bristling tails and perhaps growling in frustration and such. Maybe I'm in the minority there, I don't know.

But the relationship and sexuality aspects discussed here - if I were to accept it as established lore - don't need to have much influence on your RP overall. If mine gets into a relationship then perhaps a discussion of "oh, you've settled with just one mate? how odd" might come up but I don't think it's enough to dwell on when there are so many other aspects of miqo'te culture you can bring into your RP.

Ahhh you misunderstood too! Sorry, that was my fault for being unclear. It wasn't a physical comparison but rather one towards their social behaviours.

I'm not sure what you mean with the second paragraph, the only use I ever sought from this topic personally was to ensure that females weren't expected to mate at a certain age or anything because I didn't want to deviate from the lore but I certainly didn't want a character who would be around that age if it were the case either. The only relation the aspects discussed in this topic has to me personally is that I will assume my miqo'te has no reason to not mate when her tribe's nuhn in the future but, again, that point will never be reached in the RP ^^

Lost River · **09-01-2013, 03:54 PM**

Quite an interesting take on how Miqo'te are... Lost River may need to stay away or be drawn closer to that one! My character Lost River (Hellsguard Roegadyn) finds Miqo'te adorable and Lalafell also, to the point of wanting to pick them up and squeeze them like a pet. Ahem.

As I redouble myself, an interesting read!

Raccoon · **09-01-2013, 03:56 PM**

(09-01-2013, 03:51 PM)Bea Wrote:
(09-01-2013, 03:35 PM)Raccoon Wrote: I'm impressed I had that much of an impact on you that you felt the need to curse at me.

'Cause cursing equals mad now, right? It couldn't possibly just be that it's a regular part of his vocabulary and comes up in just about every one of his posts. By that logic, he only ever posts angry. AND when we have conversations about anything, he's only doing it in a very angry and upset fashion because the amount of "fucks" he uses. ...Seriously, that doesn't mean anything and once again you're not adding anything to the conversation in an attempt to "troll" the people who disagree with the topic of this thread. It's not working and everyone can see what you're doing.

And I'm going to continue to call you out on it every fucking time. Because just as much as people have a right to agree with this shit, people have a right to disagree.

(09-01-2013, 03:35 PM)Uther Wrote: So, what we've learned here is that your entire debate structure is based on "U mad bro?" and has no real relevance to anything.

I. Have. No. Interest. In. The. Thread.

I don't know how much more obvious I can make it. I tried to emphasize what I perceived one comment was about, after coming to the conversation late. That's it. I get that you want to defend your friends and back them up, but it's really not needed.

But you've succeeded in driving me off. I'm done. Congratulations. You win. Yay.

Rinh Hallani · **09-01-2013, 03:56 PM**

(09-01-2013, 03:54 PM)K Wrote: I'm not sure what you mean with the second paragraph, the only use I ever sought from this topic personally was to ensure that females weren't expected to mate at a certain age or anything because I didn't want to deviate from the lore but I certainly didn't want a character who would be around that age if it were the case either. The only relation the aspects discussed in this topic has to me personally is that I will assume my miqo'te has no reason to not mate when her tribe's nuhn in the future but, again, that point will never be reached in the RP ^^

Ah I meant that as a more general statement, not directed at you, sorry! I just meant that if someone (not you specifically) isn't interested in these aspects of the miqo'te culture, they don't have to use them because there are plenty of other ways to bring their culture into RP.

K'nahli · **09-01-2013, 03:59 PM**

(09-01-2013, 03:35 PM)Uther Wrote: It is just you. Also, the idea that "only a rare few actually feel the way that (I)Â do" because Velkyron got one rep point and Myxie got 15 is a ridiculous statement. There are plenty of people who have expressed similar sentiments that have gotten rep points, I'm sure. Also, not everyone likes the rep system. Furthermore,Â her post has been around for a lot longer than Velkyron's, which has been around for about an hour. So using that comparison as an accurate representation of opinion is foolish to say the least.

I won't get into your assumption that I'm easily offended, because frankly, it's just you who thinks that again. I will say your lalafell will notÂ push my buttons because I don't really get how that character is offensive. To anyone. I don't even know why you thought was interesting enough to bring up.

Okay, I thought someone else would correct this but seemingly not. Myxie wasn't suggesting that your disagreements were any less valid because of the reputation points and PMs. He quoted a post of the person you +1'd(and you since you were agreeing to him by +1'ing) because they stated they saw no point in the topic. He responded by outlining all of the positive responses that he received as a result of creating the topic which shows that it served of some use to people, and that validates as a point.

Clover · **09-01-2013, 04:00 PM**

Just a note. The harem culture has also been a part of the human society, so it's not like sentient creatures are above it. We just need to understand what kind of emotional attachment (or lack ofÂ it in this case) such human beings could have in order to perhaps understand Miqo'tes. I personally don't understand a thing, for I believe that jealousy and possessiveness are also natural emotions that every or most sentient creatures would experience (?).

Lost River · **09-01-2013, 04:03 PM**

I'm also curious about social ecology of said Miqo'te; also for example, if one was said reared by a non-Miqo'te parentage as this feels more like an "in their native habitat" sort of approach with less focus on sentient thought and more of primal urges. ^_^

Uther · **09-01-2013, 04:06 PM**

(09-01-2013, 03:59 PM)K Wrote: Okay, I thought someone else would correct this but seemingly not. Myxie wasn't suggesting that your disagreements were any less valid because of the reputation points and PMs. He quoted a post of the person you +1'd(and you since you were agreeing to him by +1'ing) because they stated they saw no point in the topic. He responded by outlining all of the positive responses that he received as a result of creating the topic which shows that it served of some use to people, and that validates as a point.

While you bring up an admittedly valid point and I may have misinterpreted what she said, I still don't think rep points are really a solid indicator of anything. Furthermore, I never said "take the thread down." I said, "it's weird and I don't get it." so showing me "proof" that it's useful to people doesn't really negate my feelings toward it.

K'nahli · **09-01-2013, 04:09 PM**

(09-01-2013, 04:03 PM)Lost River Wrote: I'm also curious about social ecology of said Miqo'te; also for example, if one was said reared by a non-Miqo'te parentage as this feels more like an "in their native habitat" sort of approach with less focus on sentient thought and more of primal urges. ^_^

Well, no. If I contributed to that idea then I apologise. I don't mean to suggest that miqo'te are incapable of thinking for themselves without succumbing to some sort of base, primal instinct. They just follow a particular culture. One which, as Clover pointed out, is not above sentient beings such as humans. On a more reformed and modern view of things however, their actions are considerably comparable to the behaviour of animals in the wild.

Really, it's all a matter of upbringing. If a miqo'te grew up in a different environment it wouldn't have the teachings or moral leanings towards the strongest male unless by some off chance their parents/guardians managed to instill the same ideals of sorts. Miqo'te are just like all other races on an intelligence level. It's just a cultural upbringing which could easily be applied to any other race, even hy'urs or humans in reality.

Quote: Uther
While you bring up an admittedly valid point and I may have misinterpreted what she said, I still don't think rep points are really a solid indicator of anything. Furthermore, I never said "take the thread down." I said, "it's weird and I don't get it." so showing me "proof" that it's useful to people doesn't really negate my feelings toward it.

I don't think he was arguing that your feelings were invalid or anything though, he was just demonstrating that the topic isn't useless as it was sort of suggested. personally I don't mind if you find the idea creepy. I don't agree to it because I think you are misinterpreting what most people are trying to learn from it all but to each their own. I can't speak for Myxie but I am sure he wasn't saying you were wrong to feel that way.

(Unless he said so elsewhere in his post, I sort of skimmed it).

Shuck · **09-01-2013, 04:10 PM**

(09-01-2013, 03:40 PM)Knahli Wrote: You took that quite literally. I wasn't referring to their physical attributes but rather the fact that attraction and desire to mate with the strongest male is more of a primitive and animal-like instinct rather than the emotional attachment humans create.

No, no. You're coming at that statement too narrowly, and I should've clarified. They're observably more human than not in just about every way. They think, they feel, they reason, and they create just like humans do. There's no distinction between human and Miqo'te that isn't a few superfluous physical quirks.

Also, whether you realize it or not, your attraction is still influenced by physiology, and things that equate to power.

Click these words for a blurb on the matter that links to a big ol' published paper.

And that works in reverse. Red means "power" to your brain. Power is attractive. That's universal.

(09-01-2013, 03:35 PM)Raccoon Wrote: I'm impressed I had that much of an impact on you that you felt the need to curse at me. I'm also amazed that you found that I was suggesting anything to do with numbers when I was merely clarifying what someone else seemed to be suggesting.

I know you said you quit, and whatever, but we all know you'll read this.

To the point: I swear constantly. I don't think I was even swearing at you. I think the only occurrences of that evil, evil F word were to illustrate the severity of quantity.

To further this point, even though you quit, because I guess you had no interest in a thread and decided to post anyway (why bother?):

(09-01-2013, 03:15 PM)Raccoon Wrote: It may just be me but I don't see how that was hostile in any way, merely stating that only a rare few actually feel the way that you do, while many found it to actually be a rather interesting take on things.

When you say "rare", you're quantifying. You don't have a quantity. Quantities are measured in numbers.

Myxie Tryxle · **09-01-2013, 04:14 PM**

(09-01-2013, 03:09 PM)Uther Wrote:
(09-01-2013, 02:51 PM)Myxie Tryxle Wrote:
(09-01-2013, 01:36 PM)Uther Wrote:
(09-01-2013, 01:18 PM)Velkyron Wrote: While some of the conjecture is interesting, I really don't see the point of it.
First of all, +1'ing this.

Roughly fifteen reputation boosts for the original post, a handful of very appreciative PMs, three friends requests, and eight pages of generally constructive discussion indicate that this thread was useful and informative to quite a few people.

Are you really attacking me for giving a rep point to someone who disagrees with you?

I'll ignore that blatant hostility toward a differing opinion for a second, and I'll go ahead and say, while miqo'te mating might be interesting to some, it shouldn't be considered the end-all be-all of miqo'te culture. No one seems to care how they got to Eorzea, when they got to Eorzea, when they broke off into separate clans, what their social structure (outside of bumping uglies) is like, exactly howÂ tribal they are, how their tribal culture has been affected by the fact that instant teleportation is available in Eorzea, and how they assimilate into society. None of that seems interesting in comparison to how they mate. That'sÂ what I don't get.

It's strange to me that this subject is the all-encompassing hot point for learning about miqo'te in the RPC. Sure there are other threads, but this one is by far the largest and it's completely fair to say that it's strange to me. I don't agree with you. Not everyone will. Don't get mad at me for it.

Nothing I said there was aggressive towards anyone. The question was posed as to why this discussion was necessary or worthwhile. I provided evidence that some people wanted to have this discussion and benefited from it. I even encouraged in replies throughout the thread that if people wanted to discuss other aspects of Miqo'te or the other races to start a thread and I would enjoy the discussion. It spawned at least one other thread from another poster as well as another thread from me on aspects of Miqo'te culture like ritual combat. As for a scientific, statistical basis for proving the worth of this thread, it's unnecessary. If fifteen to twenty people come up to me and say "Hey, I really enjoyed/learned from that thing you wrote," it has value, even if a small group or even the majority has no use for it. Just today since this thread has been resurrected, I've gotten three new rep boosts for the original post from people who missed its original run.

I just hate when I see someone pop into a thread (any thread, not just my own) and say "Why does this even exist? I don't need this. It's unnecessary." Why even bother posting that? In my mind it's like walking into an Alcoholic Anonymous meeting and saying "I can hold my liquor. This group is stupid." And another guy walking in and saying "Hell yeah! Who wants to get a beer?" Or standing outside a soccer stadium and proclaiming "Your sport sucks! American football is the only football!" It adds nothing to the discussion and often brings worthwhile discussion to a screeching halt as we spend the next two pages arguing back and forth until one side finally throws up their hands and leaves the thread.

For the four of you from Misericorde who seem to be spurring argument here, I'll say this:

If you honestly believe there's something positive to be gained from continuing to argue about this, please send me or the person you're arguing with a private message, and we can discuss it further. If you have discussion relevant to the original topic of discussion, by all means post it. If you want to see a discussion of other aspects of Miqo'te culture, start a thread on that.

If I see this thread continuing to devolve into something worthy of the depths of 4chan or reddit, I will request that it be locked. Please allow it to remain constructive for people like Siobahn, Clover, K'nahli, and others who are spurring discussion that is on topic.

K'nahli · **09-01-2013, 04:14 PM**

(09-01-2013, 04:10 PM)Shuck Wrote:
(09-01-2013, 03:40 PM)K Wrote: You took that quite literally. I wasn't referring to their physical attributes but rather the fact that attraction and desire to mate with the strongest male is more of a primitive and animal-like instinct rather than the emotional attachment humans create.

No, no. You're coming at that statement too narrowly, and I should've clarified. They're observably more human than not in just about every way. They think, they feel, they reason, and they create just like humans do. There's no distinction between human and Miqo'te that isn't a few superfluous physical quirks.

Also, whether you realize it or not, your attraction is still influenced by physiology, and things that equate to power.

Click these words for a blurb on the matter that links to a big ol' published paper.

And that works in reverse. Red means "power" to your brain. Power is attractive. That's universal.

Oh, I see. I kinda of stated the same in my previous post actually so we are in agreement ^^ If I gave a different impression then I apologise for being unclear. I don't mean to imply that miqo'te are different on a mental level but rather that their cultural mannerisms are more closely comparable to animals than modern society(but as I said, this can apply to any race).

Lost River · **09-01-2013, 04:19 PM**

Perhaps they are the bridge between beast tribes and the others. A nice middle-ground for both types of sentiments to be blended together!

Sigyn Shieldbreaker · **09-01-2013, 04:20 PM**

(09-01-2013, 02:33 PM)Uther Wrote:
(09-01-2013, 02:26 PM)Siobhain Wrote:
(09-01-2013, 02:15 PM)Theodric Brandt Wrote: some of the folk getting really into this discussion

As 'really into this discussion' as I feel like I'm becoming, I wasn't aware that I was trying to mate with any and every female Miqo'te coming my way.Â

So, I highlighted some words for you to look at on the above post for future reference. Of course by "some" he could have meant "all", and more specifically, "You, Siobhain."

Was this really the only thing I've said so far that you can make anything debatable out of? I'll consider myself doing fairly well then. I didn't really feel I needed to express how I was obviously joking and I realize that what he's doing is not-so-discreetly drawing attention to some male Miqo RPers who are 'obviously' (by whoever's definition) only after some cyber fun. That was my mistake.

But just as that is a blatant foible, assuming you know what another person is doing just because you're interpreting their actions, my humor is a parody of that. I'm sorry if that wasn't clear enough, but you seem to have the teeth out anyway.

Sylvari in GW2 are trees that look like people. Elves, Orcs, Trolls, etc. in Warcraft are humanoids also. Does this define them as being 'human' in nature? No. Sexually, physiologically, they're all supposed to be vastly different. If something is not human but close to human, genetically, then they're still NOT. HUMAN. Therefore we can only relate to the characteristics that we find similar to our own and attempt to justify or understand them using our own understanding of ourselves plus what we see. In truth, we don't know what goes on in a cat's head as it lives its day to day life, we just assume it's not capable of any higher level of thinking or feeling than its most primal instinct allows because it's not us and we're not them.Â

That same condition applies to races in this game. Even 'humans' aren't really human, they're Hyur; Lalafell, Elezen, Roegadyn, and Miqo'te also aren't human by any definition and along with height difference and gender-oriented prestige, there'll very likely be as many biological differences in the individuals of their species as there are differences in their basic skeletal, muscular, and overall genetic structure. Having a functioning, higher-thinking brain doesn't mean everyone uses it the same way, we see that in different human societies so why is it so hard to accept that maybe, just maybe, the different races have different outlooks on what is normal versus what is abnormal for them rather than what is normal versus what is abnormal for the roleplayer?Â

I have little to no interest in anyone's opinions of real life sex or the amount you've had or not had and thus how much you want in game or how one might feel the need to posture and act like a big boy or girl at the mention of ERP by putting anything that might vaguely be related to it down as hard as they can manage.Â

All I see here from nay-sayers is 'It's wrong, it's wrong, not because I have facts to disprove it but because you don't have every single detail worked out and SE just isn't going to give it to you'. Hence it's a theory, not a law. She's not forcing it down your throat, she's offering something that could potentially be legitimate.

And on the matter of rep-- Myxie pointed out rep as an indicator, rather than just counting up posts over nine or ten pages, that people appreciate the consideration she's given this topic and the brain food it offers. Putting it down doesn't erase it, doesn't make those people ignorant or stupid or naive, and doesn't make you look any smarter by getting in fights over the impact of numbers. They -don't- account for everything by a long shot, plenty of people probably haven't read this thread and still more would probably at least enjoy her post before this mess started.

I'm personally tired of hypocrisy, as much of a hypocrite as I can be at times. I don't like meeting someone new who's afraid of doing something or not doing something because a bunch of people they don't know or respect said that it's 'overdone' or it's 'meta-gaming' or that they'll be a mary-sue because of it. Warcraft, SWTOR, GW2 are all filled with as many of the most generic, bland characters as outrageously over-powered ones, if there aren't more of the generic kind.Â

I can't tell you how many individuals in Silvermoon City alone have 'Looks like your average Sin'dorei' or 'Troll' or 'Orc' or 'Tauren' or 'Forsaken' written in their MRPs, and those that don't, seem compelled to fill in a paragraph-long OOC disclaimer of WHY they chose to make their character a little prettier than 'average'. It's stifling creativity. Just because some people don't want to think a bit more on the potential differences instead of just assuming all races are meatier, taller, shorter, child-like versions of our own doesn't give anyone the right to sit in here and try to convince others how wrong they are for taking two minutes out of their day to apply some critical thinking skills.

Â You -don't- and may -never- know if a Miqo'te has scent glands or goes into heat, humans don't to the extent of felines, but we also don't have enhanced vision, hearing, or smell which Miqo's might. Those little things that you want to say 'take them off and they look human' makes them -inhuman- and that's the point you should be focusing on. How are they -different-? How can they be more -interesting- than humans with a catgirl cosplay fetish?

---

Also, on the matter of someone thinking someone is advocating the idea of an entire species inbreeding-- Again... What does it take to inbreed? Two members that are related breeding together? Yes. I'm probably related to some guy whose great great great great grandmother or father was the brother or sister of my own so if we get together are we inbreeding? Technically. This is obviously -not- what you mean because chances are you've got some inbreeding in your history, it had a good chance to happen somewhere back in your bloodline with only religion or society to deem whether or not it was acceptable.

The reason that inbreeding is relegated in most communities and has been for so long is because there -is- an increasing potential as direct relatives breed that there may be some genetic mutations or weaknesses in their offspring. Notice: If a father and his child were to have a child -together- there's a good chance the baby would be healthy. It happens with animals all the time, and as you pointed out, it takes several generations of DIRECTLY related inbreeding for the percentage chance of anomalies occurring to rise enough to guarantee you a strange, inbred baby.

If one male Miqo'te has several female Miqo'te mates, who bear him offspring-- and we see this in the animal kingdom with wolf packs, lion prides, etc. as well as human cultures that accept polygamy, the female children usually are either married off to other groups, or in the case of animals, wander off to join other prides while the male children remain to maintain the blood line. Doing this lessens the chance of inbreeding by creating diversity in the genetic pool, virtually guaranteeing that no immediate relatives will be inter-breeding anytime soon.

So, no, I don't see this system as helping out those incest-lovers. Sorry, guys.

Velkyron · **09-01-2013, 04:24 PM**

(09-01-2013, 01:59 PM)Siobhain Wrote: **Snip**

See, THAT is the answer I was looking for! Â And THAT should be the focus here.

(09-01-2013, 04:14 PM)Myxie Tryxle Wrote: I just hate when I see someone pop into a thread (any thread, not just my own) and say "Why does this even exist? Â I don't need this. Â It's unnecessary." Â Why even bother posting that? Â In my mind it's like walking into an Alcoholic Anonymous meeting and saying "I can hold my liquor. Â This group is stupid." Â And another guy walking in and saying "Hell yeah! Â Who wants to get a beer?" Â Or standing outside a soccer stadium and proclaiming "Your sport sucks! Â American football is the only football!" Â It adds nothing to the discussion and often brings worthwhile discussion to a screeching halt as we spend the next two pages arguing back and forth until one side finally throws up their hands and leaves the thread.

I asked that out of sincerity; NOT out of jest. Â And I got the answer I was looking for in detail. Â The reason why I couldn't see it prior was because I come from different environments of RP where things are not taken into such detail. Â Taking the example from WoW that Sio was pointing out with the Kaldorei: I've unfortunately never seen anyone go to such lengths and detail to actually time all of the biological processes right and instead having wolf possessing-female orcs with 11 inch genitalia (This is an actual thing:Â Click at your own risk ).

To those who put that much consideration into what you write: you are awesome. Â It was mostly my misconception of the RP expectations of this community. Â That is it. Â No flame wars. Â Nada. Â In fact, I'm mostly pleasantly surprised by the amount of thought going into people making their characters in this respect. Â It's a nice thing to see and read.

« Next Oldest \| Next Newest »
Pages (18): « Previous 1 … 8 9 10 11 12 … 18 Next » Jump to page:

Miqoâ€™te Mating Strategies Explored: a biologistâ€™s point of view

RPC has moved! These pages have been kept for historical purposes