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Gegenji · **06-22-2017, 02:45 PM**

(06-22-2017, 02:34 PM)Kage Wrote:
bad shitpost theory Wrote:So who reckons itll turn out yosutsu is infact the real Yda? who some how survived and become a villian common story plot twist!

Me: Could you spell her name correctly or at least come up with a plausible theory?

Especially considering you see a flashback of her childhood. In Doma. Hundreds of malls away from Ala Mhigo. And get a brief synopsis of her life up to that point which doesn't at all mention Ala Mhigo. Seriously, that theory's terrible.

Kage · **06-22-2017, 03:19 PM**

(06-22-2017, 02:45 PM)Gegenji Wrote:
(06-22-2017, 02:34 PM)Kage Wrote:
bad shitpost theory Wrote:So who reckons itll turn out yosutsu is infact the real Yda? who some how survived and become a villian common story plot twist!

Me: Could you spell her name correctly or at least come up with a plausible theory?

Especially considering you see a flashback of her childhood. In Doma. Hundreds of malls away from Ala Mhigo. And get a brief synopsis of her life up to that point which doesn't at all mention Ala Mhigo. Seriously, that theory's terrible.

And her entire plot is the fact that she hates Domans cause her 'family' treated her like utter garbage and so did all the other Domans she encountered. She grew up with Domans... not doing shit in Ala Mhigo.

Gegenji · **06-22-2017, 03:23 PM**

A far more viable theory could be that Yda could've been captured by the Garleans. If she was an Echo-user, she could've even been the starting point for the whole artificial Echo gene therapy thing that we see going on. Possibly still kept in one of those tubes like Krile was in. Maybe mind-altered to be an enemy to fight later too, given the lack of scruples the Garlean bio-science division seems to have... but even that's stretching just to have Yda alive for some dramatic reveal of it later.

... That said, if that actually does end up being a thing that happens, I'm going to point back to this post and say "called it" with a laugh of disbelief.

Kage · **06-23-2017, 12:15 AM**

I still can't believe that a gunblade is a lever.

***Nero*** · **06-23-2017, 10:19 AM**

blah blah list review and stuff ahead. wall of text is spoiler'd.

Show Content

LiadansWhisper · **06-24-2017, 07:20 PM**

(06-23-2017, 10:19 AM)Nero Wrote: -Zenos was a boring villain. Every time he's on screen he's twirling his mustache about the Hunt and MY CUP RUNNETH OVER and it's just annoying. The only time they really get into his character is at the very end after Shinryu. He has exactly one note, and he keeps pushing it over and over again. His whole shtick was to make the Warrior of Light hate him so that the WoL would feel the same bloodlust that Zenos felt, but I don't think it worked here.

He was very two-dimensional without a single redeeming quality. That made it very hard to care overly much about him, except to be annoyed when he strolled idly off and we somehow weren't able to catch him.

Quote:-The bulk of Yotsuyu's character is revealed in an exposition dump at the end of Doma Castle. That was very melodramatic.

It also didn't make me give a shit about her "motivations." They were so shallow - she was just an awful person.

Quote:-There are a lot of little minor moments that make me scratch my head. For example, Yotsuyu stomping on that little fishing village with a single bodyguard. I get that she takes pleasure in oppressing Domans, but as acting viceroy does she really not have better shit to do? Also, with only a single bodyguard (and said bodyguard guarded by plot armor) she really should have been in way more danger.

She had other guards there. If you approached after the initial cutscene, but before you go to rescue Gosetsu, there are Garlean NPCs in the town itself. Additionally, there were supposed to be unseen-but-present Kojiin of the Red.

Quote:-Gosetsu's "death" was originally going to be in the "pro's" section, but SQUARE ENIX, YOU HAVE NO BALLS. WHAT THE FUCK. Way to completely RUIN a good moment by bullshit handwaving away his and Yotsuyu's survival. How did he survive getting shot three times!? How did Yotsuyu survive getting slashed across the body by Hien!? How did they survive a castle getting dropped on them!? Because....that kind of kills most people!

This was honestly my biggest gripe. The scene where Gosetsu "died" had me in tears. I really felt that. THEN IT WAS ALL FOR NOTHING. It just...it just cheapened the entire scene. :-\ Very disappointing.

Quote:Krile gets kidnapped and experimented on and presumably drained of some kind...and lives.

And, the text of Zenos talking about Krile after they've taken her captive suggested to me that she was going to end up tortured or something. But, nope - they just stuck her in a weird void ark-esque box and drained her aether or...something.

Quote:Gosetsu surviving did way more damage than it initially appears. That moment revealing he survived at the end single-handedly killed any sense of tension or drama that the future story could possibly hold, because now we know for certain that Square Enix is just going to give every character bullshit plot armor, and the only characters who will die will be paper-thin nobodies like Conrad, or people like Moenbryda who are introduced for exactly one patch just to die at the end.

I just...am really mad about that. lol. I really loved Gosetsu, and I still think the character is awesome, but...his death was supposed to hurt. I just felt tricked, tbh.

Virella · **06-24-2017, 07:26 PM**

I'm glad Zenos was just a psycho, instead of being another motive behind it.

I agree Yotsuyu motivation was awful. Sure she was treated like shit, but doesn't justify her actions. I could have understood it if she just wanted revenge on her family, but she just continued.

Fordola is amazing as well though. I love how brainwashed she is by the Garleans.

All in all, I sort of like the villains? They didn't get redeemed so far after all. Yotsuyu and Fordola might in the end though, but I hope they won't.

Kage · **06-24-2017, 08:02 PM**

I mean, basically it's
[Image: drN8D.gif]

I'm more interested in Fordola. She seems to be under the complete impression that she was doing the right thing (ends justifies the means) whereas Yotsuyu was just incredibly selfish and hated all domans for what her 'family' did to her.

Zhavi · **06-24-2017, 08:33 PM**

(06-24-2017, 08:02 PM)Kage Wrote: I mean, basically it's

I'm more interested in Fordola. She seems to be under the complete impression that she was doing the right thing (ends justifies the means) whereas Yotsuyu was just incredibly selfish and hated all domans for what her 'family' did to her.

She also mentioned a pleasure district in that long ass monologue. It stuck with me because it was so ... out of place? Like she went from one husband to a second, but uhh...it didn't really make sense, but it kinda added overall.

The impression I got from her though wasn't just that it was her family. It was everyone. She was getting abused and everyone knew it and turned a blind eye. The village, anyone she tried to get help from. They all just told her to grin and bear it. And while it does read like cheap characterization, I kinda wonder if maybe this isn't a stock villain character in Japanese literature? You know, where the character isn't really a character so much as a moral representation for something else. Would maybe help explain why she's so flat.

BUT I DUNNO MUCH ABOUT JAPANESE LITERATURE, LOL. So like as not I'm way off base.

Anyways, I think the things I'm most hyped about are Azim Steppes, and that Gyr Abanian architecture. Ugh, all that Moorish influence (and hints of Ottoman?) makes me drool. Like, man, the MSQ has its flaws and I don't even care. Too busy staring at the pretties.

Also Gosetsus death scene was way over contrived. Like this dude is holding up a roof and everyone is taking five minutes to tearfully express how much they love him. It stole the realism and urgency from the scene, and I rolled my eyes so hard because what started out as a gut wrenching scene became 'wow, we're taking turns telling him this while he's struggling to hold up this roof?' like I dunno, I g et he's strong and all but like if he had the strength to hold it up for that long it s eems like they could've figured something out to ... yeah.

I get it leads to a SURPRISE HE'S ALIVE thing later, but imo it would have been way more heartwrenching if they all had to leave before finishing up those final last words.

BUT OMG THE STEPPES. So many fucking references. I don't like what they did with the Naadam, because imo the real life version with the games is way cooler, but all the food bits, the hospitality, the pastoral nomadism tidbits, the meat dishes!! -- everything! I love it all so much I could do an entire expansion focused around the steppes. Big Grin

Also wtb Ala Mhigo housing pretty please.

V'aleera · **06-24-2017, 08:38 PM**

(06-24-2017, 08:02 PM)Kage Wrote: I'm more interested in Fordola. She seems to be under the complete impression that she was doing the right thing (ends justifies the means) whereas Yotsuyu was just incredibly selfish and hated all domans for what her 'family' did to her.

I'm of the opposite mind. I found Fordola to be an intolerable hypocrite who tried to wrap up her innate selfishness and brutality in a facade of "altruism". Yotsuyu on the other hand was an absolute monster, but she was entirely honest about it. The world and everyone in it treated her like shit and when the tables were turned she responded in kind.

Also, I think the entire narrative around Lyse would have flowed way better if they had just left Yda as Yda and let Minfilia be the lead character.

Zhavi · **06-24-2017, 08:53 PM**

(06-24-2017, 08:38 PM)Valeera Wrote: Also, I think the entire narrative around Lyse would have flowed way better if they had just left Yda as Yda and let Minfilia be the lead character.

To me, what Lyse was really missing was more shots of her interacting with other people from Gyr Abania. Leading them, interacting with them, having them have reasons to actually ... want to follow her? There's more of them who seem to look up to the WoL than really show any sort of that for her.

It feels like the writing treated her with kid gloves. I mean, Alisae had a stronger learning-to-deal-with-leadership moment when she doesn't know if Alphinaud is alive or dead and gets that 'yeah I know your brother is missing but we need you to step up right now' spiel. Lyse had a couple spots here or there (the one in the Ruby Sea towards the end where she has a monologue about her own naivete and then sorta waves her hands at you saying she doesn't want to wallow in it or whatever could've gone somewhere, but it never did), but overall she's up on a pedestal and not really allowed to learn or interact or really feel anything the mortals are feeling.

She was likeable to me, and I enjoyed her, but every time she started to go somewhere it's like she got pulled back so someone else could take the spotlight. So in the end she kinda stayed where she's always been as the lighthearted backup to the srs stuff.

LiadansWhisper · **06-24-2017, 09:22 PM**

(06-24-2017, 07:26 PM)Virella Wrote: I'm glad Zenos was just a psycho, instead of being another motive behind it.

I agree Yotsuyu motivation was awful. Sure she was treated like shit, but doesn't justify her actions. I could have understood it if she just wanted revenge on her family, but she just continued.

Fordola is amazing as well though. I love how brainwashed she is by the Garleans.

All in all, I sort of like the villains? They didn't get redeemed so far after all. Yotsuyu and Fordola might in the end though, but I hope they won't.

Fordola was the one villainous NPC that I really, really wanted to know more about. I wish they would have gone into her background more extensively.

LiadansWhisper · **06-24-2017, 09:27 PM**

(06-24-2017, 08:38 PM)Valeera Wrote: I'm of the opposite mind. I found Fordola to be an intolerable hypocrite who tried to wrap up her innate selfishness and brutality in a facade of "altruism". Yotsuyu on the other hand was an absolute monster, but she was entirely honest about it. The world and everyone in it treated her like shit and when the tables were turned she responded in kind.

Fordola appears to be one of the children that Gaius "made" with his brainwashing camps. That's the main reason why I want to know more about her. I didn't think she was consciously hypocritical - there's a line from Ardveld, one of the Walkers, who got an Echo off her during the encounter where she takes Krile. He describes her as someone who was promised the world...at the cost of her soul. Like she was told she would have everything she ever wanted - citizenship, a better life, acceptance...but that isn't what happened. It was a lie. The way she keeps talking about "freedom" is almost childlike. Like she's repeating what she'd been told over and over again, until she believed it.

That's the main reason why I am more interested in her over Yotsuyu.

Quote:Also, I think the entire narrative around Lyse would have flowed way better if they had just left Yda as Yda and let Minfilia be the lead character.

idk. I couldn't stand Minfilia because she seemed so useless. But maybe in this situation she'd have been a lot more useful? Thing is, Minfilia was never a warrior. And I kinda feel like only a warrior could truly lead the resistance - because they'd have to fight, too.

***Nero*** · **06-24-2017, 09:28 PM**

Conrad making Lyse as the leader was really silly because far as I recall, Lyse didn't do anything as leader. The only one she ever interacted with to any real extent was M'naago, and as cool as M'naago was, she didn't really do anything either.

I mean, I get the feeling that the story was gearing Lyse towards a parallel with Hien, but Lyse really didn't learn anything. She started the story as a young revolutionary bent on freeing Ala Mhigo and ended the story as a young revolutionary bent on freeing Ala Mhigo. There was no transition.

What made Hien a great character was that he was wholly focused on the welfare of his people. Hien was fully willing to consider the idea that revolution was not the best outcome, and that surrender to Garlemald, as harsh as it was, might be the best course of action. Amidst his doubts and his experience as having been born during the occupation, he was equally willing to fight or forfeit.

However, all of these things completely fly over Lyse's head. Not once does she attempt to consider Fordola's perspective. While that mini storyline in Ala Gannha attempts to she some light on it, Lyse responds basically by being a robot that beeps "REVOLUTION REVOLUTION REVOLUTION RESISTANCE RESISTANCE RESISTANCE" over and over again.

Lyse was ostensibly the "main" character and the leader of the Resistance, but she took a backseat to the entire Ala Mhigan revolution. She didn't do anything, plan anything, or make any real significant decisions in her entire time there. She was purely a biased observer, yet the story seems to expect that she be treated as the main actor in everything.

Aaron · **06-24-2017, 09:33 PM**

How the FUCK did Gosetsu survive and why the FUCK did Yotsuya survive Hien literally slicing her like he wanted to kill her???

Why the FUCK did Gosetsu SAVE Yotsuya and SWIM TO an isolated island when he was COUGHING UP BLOOD FROM SEVERAL BULLETS IN THE FLANK AND CHEST??? WHO HEALED HIM???

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[Discussion] [SPOILERS] Stormblood MSQ + Story

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