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LiadansWhisper · **08-06-2014, 03:56 PM**

(08-06-2014, 03:50 PM)Coatleque Wrote: 3.) Do they raise their ass in the air if you touch the base of their tail?

I was told by a friend of mine in my free company, Kondo, that only the females are allowed to touch fluffy tails. Â *sage nod* Â So don't do that, or they might take your hand off. Â >.>

Cactuar

McBeefâ„¢ · **08-06-2014, 03:57 PM**

(08-06-2014, 03:50 PM)Coatleque Wrote: Alright, time for the more important questions.

1.) Do they claw the furniture?
2.) Do they like getting their chins scratched?
3.) Do they raise their ass in the air if you touch the base of their tail?
4.) Do they bury their poo in sand?
5.) Do they run when you spray water at them?
6.) When they leave the Quicksand do they often turn around and come right back in?
7.) Do they sleep on things you're trying to read?
8.) When given an expensive toy you bought, do they instead prefer to play with a dead leaf that just blew inside?

1.) Yes (Franz was furious)
2) Who doesn't?
3) Try it and find out
4) Tribal ones probably do, but Nat is housebroken
5) Yes
6) Yes
7) More accurately, 'do they interrupt your work' I think Crofte would say yes.
8) No. Nat is pretty excited to play with the Cannon that Kage bought.

Zhavi · **08-06-2014, 03:59 PM**

(08-06-2014, 03:36 PM)Enteris Wrote: Going a bit deeper and using the emotes, it seems that the tail and ears merely lend themselves to further solidify the emotion of the miqo'te. as has already been stated in this thread. That being said, nothing that I see would serve as evidence for the tail being able to be used for much more than wagging. Carrying a small amount of weight while still being "upright", maybe. Pointing at people and things, or even being prehensile enough to actually grab and hold onto things... or carry their own weight while hanging from a branch (like cartoon monkeys...) not so much....

So, using the evidence given to us, to be able to stick to the known lore... one would play their miqo'te as being fairly human/hyur-like, with ears and a tail capable of mirroring their emotions, having good sense of balance with powerful legs, and with a powerful sense of smell. Anything else would simply be conjecture on the player's part.

If you have control over a body part, why couldn't you use it to point, or hit someone with it? Are you saying that miqo'te don't have full control over their tails? It just seems a bit silly to me, but I guess to each their own.

(just to reiterate, no one has really claimed miqo'te tails are prehensile if we're going by the definition of 'able to grasp something' Wink

)

***Nero*** · **08-06-2014, 04:08 PM**

(08-06-2014, 03:59 PM)Zhavi Wrote:
(08-06-2014, 03:36 PM)Enteris Wrote: Going a bit deeper and using the emotes, it seems that the tail and ears merely lend themselves to further solidify the emotion of the miqo'te. as has already been stated in this thread. That being said, nothing that I see would serve as evidence for the tail being able to be used for much more than wagging. Carrying a small amount of weight while still being "upright", maybe. Pointing at people and things, or even being prehensile enough to actually grab and hold onto things... or carry their own weight while hanging from a branch (like cartoon monkeys...) not so much....

So, using the evidence given to us, to be able to stick to the known lore... one would play their miqo'te as being fairly human/hyur-like, with ears and a tail capable of mirroring their emotions, having good sense of balance with powerful legs, and with a powerful sense of smell. Anything else would simply be conjecture on the player's part.

If you have control over a body part, why couldn't you use it to point, or hit someone with it? Â Are you saying that miqo'te don't have full control over their tails? Â It just seems a bit silly to me, but I guess to each their own.

(just to reiterate, no one has really claimed miqo'te tails are prehensile Â if we're going by the definition of 'able to grasp something' )

The image of a Miqo'te having a prehensile tail that can grab things is hilarious to me, like a Miqo'te monk wielding a third pugilist glove. Three Talon fighting style, go!

On the topic at hand, though, I was always under the impression that Miqo'te were more or less Hyur with some minor cat-like physical traits like the already aforementioned keener senses, night vision, agility and balance with the tail, etc. I'm not sure how much I believe them having cat-like behaviour too. Would Miqo'te knock over vases and stuff to get attention, too?

Fates Skein · **08-06-2014, 04:15 PM**

I'm one of those miqo'te RPers that treads on the 'more animalistic than Hyur' for my miqo'te. Â A lot of C'rhisi's biology and mannerisms are based on lionesses. Â Mahvashi is based primarily on smaller 'big cats' like caracals, ocelots, things like that. Â I think there's a wealth of RP opportunities on basing certain things on big cat social behavior versus domesticated cat social behavior. Â Big cats (especially the really social ones like lions) have really complicated social structures in the wild that can change and adapt even to what kind of environment they live in. Â Then you have big cats like tigers or leopards that are very minimally social, or even large predators that aren't feline like wild dogs that are matriarchal and you can find a lot of neat inspirations for 'wild animal' behavior if you're looking for stuff beyond the domesticated cat for inspiration.

I love that miqo'te have some acknowledged wild aspects to them and I absolutely play this up. Â Part of why I play miqo'te is because they're not Hyur with big ears and a tail, they've got their own unique biologies, societies, cultures, all sorts of fun RP hooks.

Coatleque · **08-06-2014, 04:16 PM**

(08-06-2014, 04:08 PM)Nero Wrote: Would Miqo'te knock over vases and stuff to get attention, too?

Yes. They also sit next to your bed, lean 3 inches from your face, and go "Hey!" "Hey!" "Hey!" until you wake up and feed them.

Dogberry · **08-06-2014, 04:18 PM**

Felis Mi'qotus is your taxonomical nomenclature.
An endothermic biped, omnivorous by nature.
Your visual, auditory, and olfactory senses
Contribute to your hunting skills and natural defenses.

I find myself intrigued by your subvocal oscillations
A singular development of Mi'qote communications
That obviates a certain hedonistic predilection
For a rhythmic stroking of your ears to demonstrate affection.

A tail is quite essential to your acrobatic talents.
You would not be so agile if you lacked its counterbalance
And when not being utilized to aid in locomotion
It often serves to illustrate the state of your emotion.

My Mi'qote friends, the complex levels of behavior you display
Connote a fairly well-developed cognitive array
Though I may question your sanity I hope you'll comprehend
I nonetheless consider you my true and valued friends.

- Almost 100% cribbed from Data's Ode to Spot from Star Trek: TNG

Coatleque · **08-06-2014, 04:20 PM**

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UWWLwtMLWCI

Enteris · **08-06-2014, 04:24 PM**

(08-06-2014, 03:59 PM)Zhavi Wrote:
(08-06-2014, 03:36 PM)Enteris Wrote: Going a bit deeper and using the emotes, it seems that the tail and ears merely lend themselves to further solidify the emotion of the miqo'te. as has already been stated in this thread. That being said, nothing that I see would serve as evidence for the tail being able to be used for much more than wagging. Carrying a small amount of weight while still being "upright", maybe. Pointing at people and things, or even being prehensile enough to actually grab and hold onto things... or carry their own weight while hanging from a branch (like cartoon monkeys...) not so much....

So, using the evidence given to us, to be able to stick to the known lore... one would play their miqo'te as being fairly human/hyur-like, with ears and a tail capable of mirroring their emotions, having good sense of balance with powerful legs, and with a powerful sense of smell. Anything else would simply be conjecture on the player's part.

If you have control over a body part, why couldn't you use it to point, or hit someone with it? Â Are you saying that miqo'te don't have full control over their tails? Â It just seems a bit silly to me, but I guess to each their own.

(just to reiterate, no one has really claimed miqo'te tails are prehensile Â if we're going by the definition of 'able to grasp something' )

I actually had to do some quick google "research" on this. There have been several studies regarding this fact (in regards to cats, that is) and whether or not they have full, conscious control of their tail. Much like their purring, the results have been fairly inconclusive. Many say yes, many say no. Even still, the tails on cats seem to only mirror their emotions. Nice and tall if they're happy, wagging if they're pissed, etc.

To my knowledge, we have yet to run into any humans that have tails that also have full (or any) control of them. As such, I can't rightly say to what degree a person would have control of their tail. Is it a series of muscles from base to tip that would allow them to flex and point as you suggest? Or is it simply a muscle at the base that allows them to wag it and perhaps make it stand upright (like a happy cat)?

Sure, I am all for a miqo'te being able to "hit" someone with their tail by wagging it, but as far as controlling it to the point where they can literally point to people in a crowd with is, saying "You, you, you, you........" I'm not so sure about that.

Even then, if they DID have control of their tail to that degree, it makes me wonder what would be the "proper social" etiquette regarding the use of it. Much like our tongue, we have relatively close to full control of it, but we don't use it to point at people. Tongue

TheBlob · **08-06-2014, 04:27 PM**

(08-06-2014, 04:24 PM)Enteris Wrote: Even then, if they DID have control of their tail to that degree, it makes me wonder what would be the "proper social" etiquette regarding the use of it. Much like our tongue, we have relatively close to full control of it, but we don't use it to point at people.

I don't know what you're talking about... that's how Andralyn greets people daily.

Zhavi · **08-06-2014, 04:38 PM**

(08-06-2014, 04:24 PM)Enteris Wrote: I actually had to do some quick google "research" on this. There have been several studies regarding this fact (in regards to cats, that is) and whether or not they have full, conscious control of their tail. Much like their purring, the results have been fairly inconclusive. Many say yes, many say no. Even still, the tails on cats seem to only mirror their emotions. Nice and tall if they're happy, wagging if they're pissed, etc.

To my knowledge, we have yet to run into any humans that have tails that also have full (or any) control of them. As such, I can't rightly say to what degree a person would have control of their tail. Is it a series of muscles from base to tip that would allow them to flex and point as you suggest? Or is it simply a muscle at the base that allows them to wag it and perhaps make it stand upright (like a happy cat)?

Sure, I am all for a miqo'te being able to "hit" someone with their tail by wagging it, but as far as controlling it to the point where they can literally point to people in a crowd with is, saying "You, you, you, you........" I'm not so sure about that.

Even then, if they DID have control of their tail to that degree, it makes me wonder what would be the "proper social" etiquette regarding the use of it. Much like our tongue, we have relatively close to full control of it, but we don't use it to point at people.

That's . . . really cool. Mostly my line of thought was that if you can wag the tail, curl it, lift it, wave it, then you could do simple actions such as point or what not -- I hadn't actually given thought to the idea that it would actually make biological sense for it not to be controlled. On an intelligent person, the idea of not having control over a limb kinda freaks me out a bit, I will admit. Although I will also say that I didn't imagine it being precise either; pointing in a general sense more than a specific -- so I'm with you on that one (not dextrous as a monkey's tail, but able to make simple motions already shown to be in range -- just controlled rather than automatic).

Although, if it isn't able to be controlled then there would be a question of whether or not its movements would be able to be suppressed when the miqo'te feels something -- ie, if my character is annoyed by something, would she not consciously be able to stop it from twitching?

Ahahaha, luckily for me social etiquette doesn't much come into play. Wink

Half the fun of rping Zhi is getting to showcase that rude, ignorant teenager who thinks she's beholden to no one.

edit - ah, and I wouldn't count humans-with-tails in the same league as miqo'te. At the very least we can agree that miqo'te tails are far more mobile and expressive than anything humans have ever had.

Enteris · **08-06-2014, 04:54 PM**

(08-06-2014, 04:38 PM)Zhavi Wrote:
(08-06-2014, 04:24 PM)Enteris Wrote: -snip-
That's . . . really cool. Â Mostly my line of thought was that if you can wag the tail, curl it, lift it, wave it, then you could do simple actions such as point or what not -- I hadn't actually given thought to the idea that it would actually make biological sense for it not to be controlled. Â On an intelligent person, the idea of not having control over a limb kinda freaks me out a bit, I will admit. Â Although I will also say that I didn't imagine it being precise either; pointing in a general sense more than a specific -- so I'm with you on that one Â (not dextrous as a monkey's tail, but able to make simple motions already shown to be in range -- just controlled rather than automatic).

Although, if it isn't able to be controlled then there would be a question of whether or not its movements would be able to be suppressed when the miqo'te feels something -- ie, if my character is annoyed by something, would she not consciously be able to stop it from twitching?

Ahahaha, luckily for me social etiquette doesn't much come into play. Â Â Half the fun of rping Zhi is getting to showcase that rude, ignorant teenager who thinks she's beholden to no one.

edit - ah, and I wouldn't count humans-with-tails in the same league as miqo'te. Â At the very least we can agree that miqo'te tails are far more mobile and expressive than anything humans have ever had.

And that is indeed the part where conjecture comes in. As for what Square has given us, we truly don't have any idea. So we have to look to real life examples to see how it would work.Â

Well, they're human-like to a degree... so humans with tails. We have a tail bone and there are humans out there that have tails (think stubs, not actually full-length miqo'te type tails). Some of them are able to wag it a bit, but that's really about it. Others don't have control at all. So, from the human example we know we can possibly wag a tail if we had it.

Then we look to cats, the other "half" of the miqo'te. And, as I stated above, the results of studies have been fairly inconclusive. We do know that cats use it to express emotion (think body language)... again upright and tall when happy, wagging/twitching when pissed, etc. Beyond that, we've yet to see cats do much else with their tails, other than chase it (Yes, owning seven cats myself... I have seen them chase it. And, on that note, a couple of our cats do intentionally hit us with their tail... haven't seen them point yet, though. Tongue

Â ) So, even from the cats all we know for sure and have seen is that mirroring of emotions type deal.

So the confusion comes from the crossover between the two creatures. How far does the human/hyur brain go to control the tail? Or is the cat side of the brain in "control" of it, leaving it to be nothing more than a visible emotional extension?

I think this plays into your question about being able to suppress it. That entirely depends on the unknown amount of control that the miqo'te actually has... how much that "hyur side" of their brain controls it versus the "cat side." In that regard, I would like to think that they are able to consciously control the muscle at the base of their tail to the point of making it stop and put on a "poker face". That being said, I personally feel that would be the extent of their "hyur control" of their tail... being able to wag it and being able to stop the wag.Â

Otherwise, I think every single sentient creature in Eorzea would love to play poker with miqo'te. You'd never lose against a miqo'te with their tail being giant, obvious tells. Tongue

Fates Skein · **08-06-2014, 05:00 PM**

Re: tails

I actually wonder- cats and dogs have a big bundle of nerves that connect to the base of their tail. Â If the tail is pulled hard enough, it can damage that bundle of nerves and actually cause paralysis to the legs/lower part of the spine. Â It would be an interesting weakness to have to protect against, considering armor doesn't really protect against pulling/ grabbing and all their armor has a tail slot for it to wag around instead of actually protecting the tail (which is prone to all sorts of injuries- degloving, breaking, being caught in doorways...)

I imagine that miqo'te that fight very rarely have full-length tails in actuality and that most of them have sustained some sort of injury to their tail...

***Nero*** · **08-06-2014, 05:04 PM**

(08-06-2014, 04:16 PM)Coatleque Wrote:
(08-06-2014, 04:08 PM)Nero Wrote: Would Miqo'te knock over vases and stuff to get attention, too?

Yes. Â They also sit next to your bed, lean 3 inches from your face, and go "Hey!" Â "Hey!" Â "Hey!" until you wake up and feed them.

Well, what I do with my cat is chase him with a spray bottle whilst screaming at the top of my lungs "I AM THE GOD OF THUNDER!" I imagine such behaviour probably wouldn't work as well on Miqo'te.

.......or would it?

Fates Skein · **08-06-2014, 05:05 PM**

(08-06-2014, 05:04 PM)Nero Wrote:
(08-06-2014, 04:16 PM)Coatleque Wrote:
(08-06-2014, 04:08 PM)Nero Wrote: Would Miqo'te knock over vases and stuff to get attention, too?

Yes. Â They also sit next to your bed, lean 3 inches from your face, and go "Hey!" Â "Hey!" Â "Hey!" until you wake up and feed them.

Well, what I do with my cat is chase him with a spray bottle whilst screaming at the top of my lungs "I AM THE GOD OF THUNDER!" I imagine such behaviour probably wouldn't work as well on Miqo'te.

.......or would it?

Only if that miqo'te is not also a thaumaturge, who would then, I imagine, zap you with lightning just to prove a point. Tongue

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Cats. And things that look like them.

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