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LiadansWhisper · **09-16-2014, 04:20 PM**

(09-16-2014, 04:17 PM)Kage Wrote: Personally.... Personal rooms at 300K with a garden plot sounds like it'd fix more issues for those who wanted personal housing.

The issue for FCs unable to get houses is a different matter entirely. (Availability)

The two are kind of separate. Â Because individuals and FCs are now pitted against each other for space, it's just going t make things harder for those FCs trying to come up with the money. Â I agree that the gardening would solve a lot (since Chocobo raising should be available to everyone in the FC, etc), though.

Dogberry · **09-16-2014, 04:21 PM**

Yeah man, grow that hydroponic moko grass in our FC rooms.

Kage · **09-16-2014, 04:27 PM**

... Kage might need that moko grass.

Anyways, here's the official translation of what he said.
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/threa...ost2442149

Quote:Hello, everyone. Producer and Director Yoshida here.

Thank you for all the large amount of feedback regarding the prices of land for personal housing which was implemented in Patch 2.38.

As the current personal housing prices are higher than what players expected, I would like to discuss the statement I made previously regarding the plan to make the personal housing prices cheaper than Free Company housing.

â– Regarding what I saidâ–
The statement I said was from a post made last December.
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...=1#post1685344
At that time, we were correcting the economic disparity between legacy players and new players with regards to Free Company land prices in Patch 2.1. As we were hoping to implement World Transfers as quickly as possible, we set Free Company plot prices on the high side. Due to this, we received a lot of feedback mentioning that even though there were plans for personal housing, there would be no way that players would be able to pay that high of a cost. In my reply, I wrote: â€œI can say that prices will be completely separate from Free Company housing, and, naturally, far more affordable.â€

What this meant was the following:
â€¢The prices will be completely separate from Free Company land prices (At the time of Patch 2.1)
â€¢Weâ€™ll be making the prices much cheaper than what they are currently (At the time of Patch 2.1)

However, reading this again, I realize that this statement is extremely unclear. Also, because I wrote this quickly to try to quell the uneasiness at the time, I ended up causing even more problems for everyone. I sincerely apologize for this.
â– How we decided on the prices for personal housingâ–
After Patch 2.1 weâ€™d been monitoring the land purchase conditions on all Worlds and largely reducing the prices in stages. Additionally, the original time frame for reaching the lowest land price was three months, which we shortened to one month. Due to this, the prices of land drop several tens of thousands of gil every six hours. After one month the price would be half of what it was originally.

Additionally, in order to stimulate the in-game economy after Patch 2.1, we increased the methods in which you can obtain gil and the average amount of gil all players possess increased severalfold. We are constantly checking the amount of gil everyone possesses, and based on this we made the decision that the starting prices of personal housing should be the land prices at the time that Patch 2.3 was implemented.

Focus will always be on the prices at release, but after one month these prices will be halved. The average amount of gil in possession is much greater than you all imagine, and we are concerned that if we were to lower the cost of land for personal housing any further it would exacerbate problems like RMT and the purchase of land by secondary characters.

As we have also received requests to make it so you can garden and raise chocobos from personal houses, we strived to develop personal housing with the same core features as Free Company houses to address this feedback.

When setting the prices, itâ€™s not as though we didnâ€™t even consider whether we should separate the prices for Free Company land and personal housing land; however, looking at the current economic conditions and also considering future expansion we decided to make the prices the same. I apologize and hope for your understanding.
â– The reason why Free Company houses and personal houses are in the same areasâ–
The biggest reason is to ensure the effective utilization of land. FFXIV is entering a stable period and the amount of newly created Free Companies is gently declining, therefore the demand for new Free Company houses will also decline. Additionally, with expansions to the land sale feature, after the demand for land has been fulfilled there will gradually be land openings in the wards.

On the other hand, when it comes to personal housing, with the constant increase in the amount of gil everyone possesses, as time passes the demand for personal housing will increase and a large amount of open land will be necessary.

If we were to separate Free Company housing and personal housing into different areas, in the event that Free Company land opens up I believe we would then receive requests asking to make it possible to build personal houses on those plots. So in order to balance the two we made it possible to purchase land in the same housing areas and feel this will allow for land to be utilized efficiently.
â– In conclusionâ–
In regards to the housing system, there are a lot of elements that are intertwined with each other. For example, the hefty amount of gil required to purchase, or whether you play within a Free Company or by yourself, and also due to the fact that the implementation cost and the allocation of demands becomes more complex, there are times when the decisions made by the development team are not always in perfect alignment with the thoughts of the players.

However, similar to what we did after Patch 2.1, we will be doing our best to answer everyoneâ€™s feedback and demands, but we would like to ask for some time. Thank you very much.

FreelanceWizard · **09-16-2014, 04:33 PM**

Thread closed.

Please see http://ffxiv-roleplayers.com/showthread.php?tid=8314 for more information.

FreelanceWizard · **09-19-2014, 02:07 PM**

Thread reopened, as the moratorium is now over.

Melkire · **09-19-2014, 02:11 PM**

*points at the giant windmill in The Goblet next to Raubahn's Salute*

Take that. AndÂ similar places in Lavender Beds and The Mist.Â Add a door. Drop an aetheryte right outside that we can teleport to. Give us laaaaaaarge apartments via instances,Â with the ability to garden in potted plants a la Mog Houses. Add a communal chocobo stable instance. Allow us to whitelist friends we'd like to be able to visit our "personal housing". Price this setup accordingly.

...oh look. Something everyone would have been happy with.

McBeefâ„¢ · **09-19-2014, 02:14 PM**

Rawr I'm so mad.

Not really, but I get the hate. We can only hope they'll change it a bit in the future. Yoshi P is pretty good at responding to stuff like this (hunts are a good example.)

TheLastCandle · **09-19-2014, 02:16 PM**

I'd gladly take city apartments. Make Gridania's an area in the trees with suspended platforms and bridges. Like an Ewok village! Only, you know, with a little more class. And slightly less yub-yub.

(09-19-2014, 02:14 PM)Natalie Mcbeef Wrote: Rawr I'm so mad.

Not really, but I get the hate. We can only hope they'll change it a bit in the future. Yoshi P is pretty good at responding to stuff like this (hunts are a good example.)

Kage · **09-19-2014, 02:17 PM**

Honestly I don't even know what I'd do with a garden. ULDAH regularly trains the chocobos stabled. Our gardener left and no one knows what to garden so the garden has been empty for like a week now. I don't know what I'd do with one for myself.

McBeefâ„¢ · **09-19-2014, 02:19 PM**

The bad thing about this though, is that they can't turn back time. I'm under the understanding that the personal housing areas take up *huge* amounts of memory on their datacenters. Which is why they have been increasing them rather slowly.

Even if they changed the housing policy tomorrow, they can't just take them away from the people that already have them. So while the price issue could get fixed (with something like apartments), the problem of individuals snapping up all the smalls before an FC can get one doesn't go away.

Phayte · **09-19-2014, 02:29 PM**

Apartments would be way better than what they have now if they could provide it to everyone. They could have made like 1 (or a cluster) of personal housing wards that look like the current one. But instead of getting to decorate the outside and having a plot to yourself, you make it more generic outdoor area. When people access the door, they choose who's house they want. It'd be like company room, but in a slightly larger scale. That at least gives the illusion of a house. Instanced and would presumably be less server intensive.

Of course that would take away the stable and garden though. They should just make it so you can stable your chocobo at the porters int he cities and just have a potted plant. Can't cross breed maybe, but you can at least grow chocobo foods.

C'kayah Polaali · **09-19-2014, 02:40 PM**

(09-19-2014, 02:19 PM)Natalie Mcbeef Wrote: The bad thing about this though, is that they can't turn back time. I'm under the understanding that the personal housing areas take up *huge* amounts of memory on their datacenters. Which is why they have been increasing them rather slowly.

Even if they changed the housing policy tomorrow, they can't just take them away from the people that already have them. So while the price issue could get fixed (with something like apartments), the problem of individuals snapping up all the smalls before an FC can get one doesn't go away.

There are a number of things they could do to address this.

- They could fix their crappy housing code so that it's not so much a problem -- this sounds like the path they're taking to be able to add so many new wards in 2.4
- They could use a "ward pool" that assigns new wards to servers on-demand as old wards fill up. This would let heavily populated servers have more wards, since the less populated servers frequently don't have many filled wards. They'd want to do something to make sure servers have a minimum number of wards, but this would help mitigate the problem.
- They could flag some small plots as FC-only, to allow FCs the opportunity to buy houses on new wards before they're snapped up by individuals.
- They could allow people to invite others into their inn rooms! A lot of people simply want to have a private space for RP, so this would allow for that.

Titor · **09-19-2014, 02:44 PM**

All in all I do not think that housing should be taking up that much memory.Â Below is a rough calculation that I had made when this was first announced. I made the mistake of posting it on the OF where I got flamed and insulted to the point that I took it down. IDK why, was genuinely trying to get an estimate and was not attacking anyone (unlike most of the other threads that were getting support and upvotes), but whatever that is besides the point. Here were my calculations that I had preserved.

Show Content

Aside from that, most other games with housing are able to support player-owned houses easily. I really wished it would have been an instanced plot that you can invite friends or whatever over with (Maybe with an ACL), and I was REALLY hoping for the ability to expand/build on my house. Build new wings, build new floors, build new structures, whatever. That would have been really awesome. It would have been a great gilsink too since more expansions would be more money, and SE could always add new expansions on. Make the base house like 100k, then have 80 mil worth of different upgrades if they wanted to dump that much. IDK.

C'kayah Polaali · **09-19-2014, 02:51 PM**

(09-16-2014, 04:20 PM)LiadansWhisper Wrote: Because individuals and FCs are now pitted against each other for space, it's just going t make things harder for those FCs trying to come up with the money.

It's not so much an issue with coming up with money as it is an issue with the way plots are sold.

When you look at a ward, you can see the free plots. You can't buy them. You have to run to them and hope they're free by the time you get there. On the morning the servers came up for 2.38, a friend of mine hit the wards to buy a plot for her FC. She had done her homework and had a priority-sorted list of plots, and started right when the servers came up. She tried 4 plots, but each was sold by the time she'd gotten to it. By the time she missed the 4th, the smalls were gone.

The larger issue, though, is simply the competition between a smaller number of FCs that want a plot and a large number of individuals that do. It was already a problem in 2.38 (which was surprising because no one knew they'd be so expensive until the night of the patch). For 2.4, *everyone* will have a month to save up for their house. I did some back-of-the-envelope calculations, and I'm predicting that a FC aiming for a small house is going to have something like a 10-20% chance of getting one in 2.4. This assumes they're there when the servers come up and know exactly what they're doing.

I'm in favor of personal housing, but the way they've managed things pretty much screws any small FC out of housing now.

C'kayah Polaali · **09-19-2014, 02:58 PM**

(09-19-2014, 02:44 PM)Titor Wrote: Aside from that, most other games with housing are able to support player-owned houses easily. I really wished it would have been an instanced plot that you can invite friends or whatever over with (Maybe with an ACL), and I was REALLY hoping for the ability to expand/build on my house. Build new wings, build new floors, build new structures, whatever. That would have been really awesome. It would have been a great gilsink too since more expansions would be more money, and SE could always add new expansions on. Make the base house like 100k, then have 80 mil worth of different upgrades if they wanted to dump that much. IDK.

I love your calculations, my brother and/or sister in math!

Have you seen how housing is done for EverQuest II? It's pretty amazing. You buy (and pay taxes on*) a plot that gives you a basic floorplan, but you're otherwise able to decorate however you want with a flexibility that puts FF's housing to shame.

Take a look at EQ2 Decorators, a website with housing decorator tips and showcases of nice setups. It's pretty amazing.

The fact that this is a ten year old game only makes FF's housing problems that much more painful.

*IIRC from my EQ2 days, you bought the plot (for a reasonable sum) and payed regular (reasonable) taxes on it to use it. Getting too much into arrears would lead to you losing the plot, with all your decorations going into escrow. This freed up housing owned by people who'd left the game without being a hassle for people who were simply taking a break.

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Personal Housing Thread 2.0

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