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***Alothia*** · **09-24-2014, 09:55 AM**

Guys, please keep this discussion civil, or we're going to have to lock the thread and put out another moratorium. We're all adults (I hope), so let's maintain a civil conversation about this topic. It's an important topic, one we're all pretty invested in as RPers...I'd like to continue being able to read discussion on it.

Thanks!

Clover · **09-24-2014, 09:55 AM**

(09-24-2014, 09:00 AM)J Wrote: The only malicious thing going on within this thread is the unfortunate habit some individuals have in attacking and belittling pretty much anyone who isn't worshiping the ground on which Yoshi-P walks on.

Comments like this suggest that you, too, haven't understood a thing the other side is trying to say, or aren't aware of how all the negativity your side is throwing looks from a different point of view ^^;

Anyway, so the problem is that Yoshida said was that personal houses would be in a different map than FC houses, but right now they are together. I don't think that sharing a map with FCs is going to make personal houses any less awesome or different, neither is it going to make the neighbourhood any less beautiful. If prices are the problem, prices are going down and will be half of what they currently are in a month. I believe that buying a small house for 2million doesn't sound too bad for someone who has actually tried to save up. It just requires some effort, as does farming for equip.

As for the limited number of small houses, remember they're working on it.

What I mean with all this is... this is not about worshipping Yoshida; it's about seeing a huge drama blown out of proportion, all because of problems that are only half truths. What's more, some people are offended that some of us don't see a problem with the arrival of personal houses (if anything, I'm thankful, mind you). In the end, this whole drama is getting annoying for all sides.

K'nahli · **09-24-2014, 10:29 AM**

(09-24-2014, 09:00 AM)J Wrote: Nobody is being malicious in their criticism of the housing fiasco. A developer said one thing and did another. This isn't anything new - it's been happening in pretty much every MMO out there be it WoW, Rift, GW2, SWTOR and so on.

The only malicious thing going on within this thread is the unfortunate habit some individuals have in attacking and belittling pretty much anyone who isn't worshiping the ground on which Yoshi-P walks on. He's only human and he made a mistake. Nobody is suggesting that he's a terrible person or that he should lose his job.

Accountability, however, is important. He's admitted his mistake and so...there's not much point in claiming that he put his point across well as he himself has stated outright that he didn't.

The idea that people have to quit or unsubscribe over this is, quite honestly, pretty stupid as well - you can enjoy every other aspect of a game whilst criticising a handful of elements. Some of you really need to grow thicker skin and stop acting like constructive debate Â and criticism should never occur.

...and if you really can't restrain yourself from thinly veiled personal attacks/jabs, here's an idea: don't bloody post in threads related to something you can't remain civil about. Something that applies to both sides of the discussion.

Without the intention to offend or point fingers but... your posts are the only ones that have felt even mildly aggressive to me since the last outburst some pages back involving other people. No-one is really disagreeing with your upset as much as they're saying: "Okay, look... its not THAT big of a deal".

('you' meaning your side from this point on)

At the end of the day, this was going to happen one way or another. Yoshi simply could have saved himself some backfire if he thought to mention it but, well, he didn't. Everything you're looking for will be coming along at some point. Your real concerns should be the lack of space even with the implementation of new wards, not getting angry at Yoshi for something he is trying to find a way around.

No-one here is blindly defending Yoshi... what good would that do anyone? It's simply a matter of us saying that you should aim your anger and upset at the actual problem as opposed to finding the nearest person to point your finger at and blaming everything on him as though he were able to fix everything but, you know, simply chose not to.

He didn't lie, that's skewing the truth to make it sound worse than it really is. Having said that, he wasn't as open as people were expecting/hoping for him to be; if you want to believe that he did that consciously then fine, you're entitled to think like that, but no-one is in any position to accuse him of lying, just as I am in no position to testify to his innocence and say that there is no way that he knew what was going on and could never do such a thing. I just believe that he didn't because it would have been completely unnecessary. To me, its logical to assume that he didn't deliberately hide anything.

Cato · **09-24-2014, 10:32 AM**

Different people are invested in different aspects of the game. What doesn't concern you might affect somebody else and the reverse is true as well. At this point there isn't much debate going on at all - it's the same select few posters trying to convince the other side not to feel the way that they do which isn't something that is going to end well.
It's a divisive subject with solid points on both sides - but at this point we've already established how X, Y and X feel about the subject. What we should be focusing on isn't whether X, Y or Z are throwing a fit (which is unlikely given that most people seem to be assuming that this is something the opposing side is losing sleep over) but rather what solutions can be conjured up and put forward to FFXIV's developers over on the official site.

It may be that they don't ever read this thread, or anything posted on the official site for that matter. Either way something is better than nothing and if some people are happy to just overlook the entire matter, that's fine - but they don't really have the right to demand or pressure everybody else into brushing the issue under the rug if it's something they feel strongly about.

The short term solutions are better than nothing but they don't really address the core issue which is a major shortage of available houses. Once they start actively addressing the long term issues with player housing then I'll be very happy. If they don't? Well I'm not going to leave the game over it as I find it enjoyable enough to continue investing in for other reasons.

I think there's a communication issue here - I'm not upset. I'm not losing sleep over this. I'm just...well, British. I'm naturally blunt and direct - I enjoy a solid debate but I enjoy a civil debate. I haven't launched any personal attacks, though I have expressed frustration in regards to the tone and implications surrounding certain posts.

If people want further clarity in regards to my posting style they're welcome to approach me either within this thread or via a PM. I don't bite.

(09-24-2014, 09:55 AM)Alothia Wrote: Guys, please keep this discussion civil, or we're going to have to lock the thread and put out another moratorium. We're all adults (I hope), so let's maintain a civil conversation about this topic. It's an important topic, one we're all pretty invested in as RPers...I'd like to continue being able to read discussion on it.

Thanks!

It would be much more efficient to just eliminate the perceived problematic posts instead of stifling discussion of the subject entirely. As someone who has done moderator work elsewhere (MMO-Champion to be precise) I'm no stranger to heated debate and...in all honesty I can't help but feel as though there's a bit of a knee jerk reaction over on this site.Â

Ultimately it's your site and your rules (for the moderation team/admin team as a whole) but so far I can't really see anything that is truly worthy of an entire subject being locked down. If three students in a class of thirty are causing trouble then it's not fair for the tutor to toss everybody into an after school detention. Punishing everybody for the actions of a few is a very slippery slope.

Warren Castille · **09-24-2014, 10:47 AM**

The real problem they're going to run into, I think, is only having 30 houses to a ward. They need to either open up apartments (seriously, SE, you did this just in XI a decade ago) or... some other thing. I don't know. I can't begin to presume I know how programming works.

What I AM tempted to do, though, is make a dummy FC rank 6 and just... buy a house. Let people who want to "join" an inactive FC come and get their personal room for 300k. I'd make the front room look like a lobby or something and just... Let people have at it.

Hmm.

Cato · **09-24-2014, 10:52 AM**

(09-24-2014, 10:47 AM)Warren Castille Wrote: The real problem they're going to run into, I think, is only having 30 houses to a ward. They need to either open up apartments (seriously, SE, you did this just in XI a decade ago) or... some other thing. I don't know. I can't begin to presume I know how programming works.

What I AM tempted to do, though, is make a dummy FC rank 6 and just... buy a house. Let people who want to "join" an inactive FC come and get their personal room for 300k. I'd make the front room look like a lobby or something and just... Let people have at it.

Hmm.

That's a pretty solid idea. A Free Company run by role-players for role-players with the intention of providing somewhere for players to park their character and invest in a house with very few strings attached would be brilliant. As someone who role-plays a character who doesn't really fit in many of the current guilds out there it'd certainly be something I'd invest in.

Aldotsk · **09-24-2014, 10:56 AM**

(09-24-2014, 10:47 AM)Warren Castille Wrote: What I AM tempted to do, though, is make a dummy FC rank 6 and just... buy a house. Let people who want to "join" an inactive FC come and get their personal room for 300k. I'd make the front room look like a lobby or something and just... Let people have at it.

That's literally my FC house at the moment, but I still prefer good-aligned IC people to join and use it as a tenant-landlord style.

Dont' want someone to summon void cult or make bombs in a house.

Warren Castille · **09-24-2014, 11:00 AM**

I know someone with a Rank5 FC. I'll poke him to see if he'd be interested in doing some good for the public. There'd need to be a bit of discussion if enough people were interested; ward, size, etc. I can get a small plot with my wallet but if anyone wanted anything more than that, it'd be time to Kickstart it. Plus location, which specific ward, etc.

Might just do it on my own and tell people when it's finished? I don't know. I'm open to suggestions.

**Unnamed Mercenary** · **09-24-2014, 11:04 AM**

(09-24-2014, 10:47 AM)Warren Castille Wrote: The real problem they're going to run into, I think, is only having 30 houses to a ward. They need to either open up apartments (seriously, SE, you did this just in XI a decade ago) or... some other thing. I don't know. I can't begin to presume I know how programming works.

What I AM tempted to do, though, is make a dummy FC rank 6 and just... buy a house. Let people who want to "join" an inactive FC come and get their personal room for 300k. I'd make the front room look like a lobby or something and just... Let people have at it.

Hmm.

...That almost sounds like <uldah>! ...except we RP living together. Anyone who joins becomes part of the "family".

Berrod Armstrong · **09-24-2014, 11:17 AM**

(09-24-2014, 11:04 AM)Unnamed Mercenary Wrote:
(09-24-2014, 10:47 AM)Warren Castille Wrote: The real problem they're going to run into, I think, is only having 30 houses to a ward. They need to either open up apartments (seriously, SE, you did this just in XI a decade ago) or... some other thing. I don't know. I can't begin to presume I know how programming works.

What I AM tempted to do, though, is make a dummy FC rank 6 and just... buy a house. Let people who want to "join" an inactive FC come and get their personal room for 300k. I'd make the front room look like a lobby or something and just... Let people have at it.

Hmm.

...That almost sounds like <uldah>! ...except we RP living together. Anyone who joins becomes part of the "family".

Yeah, Agent offers folks a room and a spot in gardening rotation (IC, too!) along with all the other perks.

perks designed to distract them from the fact that they'll spend 80% of their time almost getting killed

Warren Castille · **09-24-2014, 11:24 AM**

...can/should I make a thread mentioning there are alternatives for people out there? I don't want to just be like HEY EVERYBODY, JOIN ULDAH AND AGENT FOR ROOMING (don't know your FC name, Altdotsk, sorry) without first clearing it, but I think it would do people a lot of good to know, if it's a house and chocobo they want, there's a way before 2.4.

Kellach Woods · **09-24-2014, 07:34 PM**

(09-23-2014, 10:18 AM)Warren Castille Wrote: This is a slippery slope, though. ANY gate to content is exactly that: a gate to content. This one happens to be artificial, and again, I agree the limit on wards makes it frustrating. This is hopefully going to be alleviated in 2.4 and then everyone should be able to have their own houses if they want one.

On this, I don't agree... for 2.4

If they're adding a couple of plots per patch until they stop selling within 10 mins, then yeah, sure. However, the numbers don't add up otherwise.

LiadansWhisper · **09-24-2014, 11:02 PM**

(09-24-2014, 07:19 AM)Warren Castille Wrote: Does anybody know anyone who actually quit over this?

My sub runs out in three days. Â Smile

LiadansWhisper · **09-24-2014, 11:03 PM**

(09-24-2014, 09:36 AM)Coatleque Wrote: So yeah...

Quote:"No matter how upset you get, no matter how irrational the initial reaction to getting your nose a little out of joint is, you are not allowed to lose sight of the fact that there is no possible way anything that happens in 'pretendy fun time games' can actually be important. It is not, nor will it ever be, a big deal."

That is absolutely true, because RP is pretendy fun times.

Who I pay money to is reality times. Â The two are not the same thing.

ArmachiA · **09-25-2014, 02:45 AM**

I have a dummy FC strictly for the Rum and Rumble in Mist I could volunteer the rooms for for this. There would be no structure (I'm busy running the Night Blades ; Wink

or any overarches storyline or anything. You'd just use the RnR to get to your room OOC and could say your room was ANYWHERE ICly.

The only thing I would ask is that the RnR stays as is.

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Personal Housing Thread 2.0

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