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Warren Castille · **01-28-2015, 08:37 AM**

Following Lance's advice, I wanted to make a new thread to pursue this conversation.

(01-27-2015, 03:42 PM)allgivenover Wrote: It's not about cleaving to the traditional lore. It's about missing the fact that you're playing a humanoid cat like race.

It's more than fine that people had to RP before there was sufficient lore, though the name lore wasn't outright stated, female naming conventions were easy to figure out in 1.0, the name Rakka Kuhn was chosen long before the naming conventions were released, and I arrived at that name after running around the 1.0 world taking notes of the Keeper of the Moon Miqo'te female names and combining those observable patterns with an old tabletop character name. If anyone doubts me on this one, here's the old lodestone link, and a snapshot of the oldest achievement, long before the naming conventions were released:

http://lodestone.finalfantasyxiv.com/rc/...d=12277162

Show Content

some proof

But names are not even what I'm talking about and in fact many of my favorite Miqo'te RPers have characters that are non-traditional with non-traditional names. Even though there is not a single Miqo'te NPC that doesn't have a traditional name in some form I couldn't possibly hold it against 1.0 players like myself for getting attached to a name and not wanting to change it.

What I'm on about with "Hyur in cat ears and a tail" is that for the vast majority of Miqo'te RPers you could retcon their character into a Hyur and absolutely nothing would be different other than them no longer having ears and a tail. This holds true for a lot of long time veterans around here who are otherwise great roleplayers.

It's things like never emoting the expressiveness of these aforementioned ears, or the tail, failing to ever use the sensitive nose to emote picking up scents, ignoring the Keeper diurnal tendency entirely, and (although it's fine to have a non-traditional Miqo'te) outright ignoring the lore because many find it distasteful - at least have the character acknowledge that lore with an IC rejection, don't pretend it doesn't exist at all or be outright hostile to those who acknowledge Keeper promiscuity or the political correctness nightmare that is Seeker harems.

Most Miqo'te RPers are just Hyur in catboy/girl cosplay. And let's not spend any more time than we need too talking about the fetish crowd that permeates Miqo'te. I used to doubt how widespread some claimed it to be, but considering how often I run into Miqo'te who are just a vehicle for fetish, I had to rescind that view.

I'm just hoping beyond hope that AuRa have normal sexual mores and don't have a culture so unsettling that people choose to outright ignore it as they did en mass with Miqo'te, or this will happen all over again.

In the meantime, I'll take the possibility of character creation restrictions severely limiting the creation of AuRa alts as an unexpected boon.

Regarding specifically the feline traits you mention (movement of ears, expressiveness of tail, emoting the nose) I don't think it's entirely fair to say that failure to do so is somehow playing a hyur with ears and a tail. As a person, I am entirely able to control my facial expressions: If something funny happens at an inappropriate time, I don't always bust out laughing. If I hear something in the distance, I don't immediately turn my head and look to see what it is. If someone at work comes into my 'cube and farts, I don't necessarily have to express outwardly that I've smelled anything.

It's also a bit uneven to enforce the diurnal/nocturnal cycle given the flux of the world clock. Who's got the right time, anyway? If your Keeper miqo is in GMT-5 and you're talking to a Seeker and he's GMT+8, what time is it? If you're randomly meeting someone in a bar and there's no windows? Do you consign yourself to playing your character drowsy and off-kilter half of the time because you don't know what time it is in the world around you?

Now, there is some (alright, a lot) of merit to what you're saying, but we could probably take that same scrutiny to a lot of people. Lalafell who, besides naming conventions, are just fat children. Roes who are just giant Russians people. Elezen who are just French snobby tall people. Trust me, I'm as tired of the "flamingly stereotypical yaoi-fantasy mancat" as you are, but it's easier to just ignore those people. You're never going to be able to stem the tide of folks you don't agree with, all you can do is limit your exposure to them.

And if anyone here is expecting the Au Ra population to be anything other than 90-10 in favor of off-canon history and background, I urge you to reconsider your hope in your fellow man.

Edit:

(01-29-2015, 10:59 AM)allgivenover Wrote: A comment about rarely seeing ears, tails, and scent in RP exactly means that I expect people to use it ALL THE TIME or they're not doing Miqo'te RP right. /s

Seriously this misconception about my meaning had me double checking my posts to make sure I didn't completely mess up my phrasing.

This is what I mean:

Quote:Although Rakka'li's face sat placid as a frozen lake, the sharp backward tilt of his ears made it clear how furious he was. Several seconds passed before his ears relaxed and he managed a slow, respectful nod.

Stuff like this. I don't mean emoting all the time that a Miqo'te's tail moved, or that their ears are well, cat ears, I'm on about how these tools of expression go severely underused in general.

Cato · **01-28-2015, 08:51 AM**

I think that it's important to take a character's race into account when portraying them. Even if a Miqo'te isn't associated with a tribal lifestyle they're still a Miqo'te and so they're never going to be exactly like a Hyur.Â
On the other hand compared to certain other MMO's the playable races in this setting don't have a whole lot of established lore to draw from. A lot of it is fairly vague or hidden in obscure places.

Kellach Woods · **01-28-2015, 09:00 AM**

Saying you're X race so you must act like this is... kinda making me uncomfortable.

Leads to so much bad territory.

Warren Castille · **01-28-2015, 09:04 AM**

On one hand, it's logical. Miqo'te should be using their ears and tails and whatnot. On the other hand, it could be considered redundant writing if you acknowledge that our characters are familiar with the other races. It's very definitely a detail that could be left off in casual conversation - How often do you take specific notice of your pet's tail? Their ears? Unless they're behaving strangely, do you even really notice that stuff at all?

I've always been more of a dialogue writer myself, so I always overlook that stuff in my writing. I don't think it makes it bad, or worse or lesser somehow, though.

Cato · **01-28-2015, 09:05 AM**

(01-28-2015, 09:00 AM)Kellach Woods Wrote: Saying you're X race so you must act like this is... kinda making me uncomfortable.

Leads to so much bad territory.

It depends on the approach. I mean, I won't lie - it would be refreshing to see more Miqo'te acting like Miqo'te. Even the subtle stuff like twitching ears or struggling to grasp the full extent of Eorzean culture can make a huge difference in terms of a character's impact.

On the other hand for some races it'd be great to see less stereotypical behaviour. Almost every Highlander I meet is some sort of brute and I don't think I've ever met one who hasn't pushed the height and muscle slider up to max and made much of their role-play about how much of a sex symbol their character supposedly is.

In the end it's a matter of balance. A varied community is much more interesting than one where everybody is doing the same thing. Though on the other hand that also means that it isn't necessarily good for the bulk of role-players to be operating outside of the realm of plausibility.

Clover · **01-28-2015, 09:06 AM**

To each their own, of course. I personally feel that ignoring the lore is a complete waste of opportunities to create something fun, and I'd love for my Seeker to meet other tribal miqo'tes from different tribes (is there any other real tribe out there?). I'm alsoÂ ready and eagerÂ to follow the Au Ra lore, whatever it is.

I must add that, while it's good that everyone RPs their own thing, I personally will prefer to RP with a majority of people who follow the lore. If the majority of characters I met ignored the lore completely, this one would simply cease to exist, as it would no longer be the norm. I'd rather avoid that. (For good or for bad, I don't engage in casual RP with strangers, so I haven't actually had this problem so far).

Kellach Woods · **01-28-2015, 09:12 AM**

(01-28-2015, 09:05 AM)Graeham Ridgefield Wrote: On the other hand for some races it'd be great to see less stereotypical behaviour. Almost every Highlander I meet is some sort of brute and I don't think I've ever met one who hasn't pushed the height and muscle slider up to max and made much of their role-play about how much of a sex symbol their character supposedly is.

I did that on a midlander, except maybe not the height slider.

Results are hot.

That being said, acknowledging that miqo'tes have tails and cat ears every so often feels like such a minor gripe that I'd honestly call it superficial. This isn't straight writing - we can see they have such attributes. Why can't we trust our eyes?

In so far as the lore is concerned, as soon as they release actual lore about not!Eorzea I'll follow it and adapt if necessary. Kell is an outsider, I'm not going to apologize for having literally no lore to fall back on.

A'vlan of Sharlayan · **01-28-2015, 09:24 AM**

(01-28-2015, 09:00 AM)Kellach Woods Wrote: Saying you're X race so you must act like this is... kinda making me uncomfortable.

Leads to so much bad territory.

Mhm! Kinda reminds me of RPing on many WoW servers - lots of "if you're not using a cookie-cutter personality you're bad" which, in all truth, sucked.

Still, yeah, being emotive and all that is great, but I was never really too bothered when Miqo'te didn't emphasise their Miqo'te-ness all the time. In fact, I didn't really notice it at all until it was mentioned. Perhaps it's time to pay more attention!

Kinono · **01-28-2015, 09:39 AM**

(01-28-2015, 09:04 AM)Warren Castille Wrote: On one hand, it's logical. Miqo'te should be using their ears and tails and whatnot. On the other hand, it could be considered redundant writing if you acknowledge that our characters are familiar with the other races. It's very definitely a detail that could be left off in casual conversation - How often do you take specific notice of your pet's tail? Their ears? Unless they're behaving strangely, do you even really notice that stuff at all?

I've always been more of a dialogue writer myself, so I always overlook that stuff in my writing. I don't think it makes it bad, or worse or lesser somehow, though.

As sad as I am to admit it, there are times where I'm much lazier in RP than others, and times where I'm just more inspired. I don't RP a miqo'te currently, but even as just a short, fat kid, there are times when I'm much more explicit with Kino's mannerisms in /em than others, so it's definitely not something I'd begrudge a miqo'te player for leaving out. I imagine it'd get tiring re-iterating and re-establishing "yes, I am a miqo'te" all the time, and, to be honest, there's a chance it'd be just as tiring to read.

SilverWolfIMHP · **01-28-2015, 09:48 AM**

I'm tossing in my two Gils here. Â Why well it's kind of connected to why I chose to turn my Fortune teller from a Miqo'te to a Lalafell. Â But first...

Long long time ago in a RP far far away... NO NOT THAT ONE! Â Way back when I used to Rp in the AOL chatrooms. Â Yeah that how old I am AOL was cool at one time back when DSL was the fast new thing and you still had the dial up sounds. Â

Where was I? Â Oh yeah well there were some RP chat rooms where there was the CAT GIRL. Â Cute playful humans with ears and tail. Â Me being more RPer then CyberRPer I turn the tables. Â I made a Male Cat man. Â I also RPed him more of a beast then human. Â Wild, hunted and ate raw meat, growled and normal grunted instead of talked. Â

Sound familiar? Â I also RPed a Khajiit on the Elder Scrolls Online Beta I was in. Â Again I went with a natural born hunter a stalking predator.

So back on topic I first was going to make a Miqto'te because I played a Human/Beast before. Â Ears twitch claws tapping on tables, feeling claustrophobic in cities you name it. Â Then I thought how to play the Fortune teller who took the time and focus to become a master of Divination. Â Things didn't fit.

Maybe if I made him OLD letting age guide him along the path to that level of focus. Â Didn't quite work either so I change his race to Lalafell. Â Will I play a Miqto'te Heck yea! Â Not as a fortune teller but as a hunter, a predator, survivor living on whit, skill, and cunning.Â

Now here is a real question involved with this topic. Â How much Beast is in a Miqto'te? Â The Art of them they are more or less Human with cat ears and tail, where a Khajiit are bi-ped felines. Â How savage could a Miqto'to life be? Â There bound to be trade with non-Miqto'te they have weapons and training enough to go toe to toe with the Guardians. Â Equipment made by Miqto'te is on par with what you can get elsewhere. Â They are even moving into other culture's cities. Â

Speaking about WOW Kellach I played a Peon Orc. Â With the whole "Me not that kind of ORC!" line.

Warren Castille · **01-28-2015, 10:08 AM**

(01-28-2015, 09:48 AM)SilverWolfIMHP Wrote: cat stuff

There's nothing specifically precluding you from having a bestial, feral miqo'te but there's not much support for it, either. Miqo'te are still considered a race of "man" and they do not have pads or claws, just fingers and toes. Could you play a savage miqo'te who has never seen civilization before? Probably, but there's a fairly large language barrier in the way. Raw meat is another question mark; There's nothing to say you couldn't digest it but the implied dietary habits of the races of man are stock across Eorzea - we cook our food.

You could play a miqo'te that way, but it would be just as plausible as someone playing a lala, roe, elezen or hyur that way.

A'vlan of Sharlayan · **01-28-2015, 10:14 AM**

(01-28-2015, 09:48 AM)SilverWolfIMHP Wrote: Now here is a real question involved with this topic. Â How much Beast is in a Miqto'te? Â The Art of them they are more or less Human with cat ears and tail, where a Khajiit are bi-ped felines. Â How savage could a Miqto'to life be? Â There bound to be trade with non-Miqto'te they have weapons and training enough to go toe to toe with the Guardians. Â Equipment made by Miqto'te is on par with what you can get elsewhere. Â They are even moving into other culture's cities. Â

Personally, I imagine they're somewhere inbetween - and it seems to vary from tribe to tribe. They're descended from hunter tribes that crossed the frozen sea long ago, after all, and they still have their many tribes, so they haven't exactly left that lifestyle. Yet, there's plenty of clearly intellectual ones, and they don't seem lacking in intelligence in general.

Then again, I'm probably biased, being that I RP a Scholarly type more than anything else. I figure you could play a Miqo'te as savage as you liked - nothing wrong with some individuality.

Clover · **01-28-2015, 10:16 AM**

I'm a bit confused. I thought this thread was about the miqo'te lore, not so much about miqo'tesÂ seldom or often mentioning their tails and ears. At least my post was about the lore itself. A characters' body language is a matter of personal choice, I think, and not everyone is equally descriptiveÂ in their writing, so this point shouldn't really be a problemÂ (?). That or I've completely misunderstood it.

Warren Castille · **01-28-2015, 10:18 AM**

I was aiming for more or less discussion over the "Most miqo are hyur in cosplay" commentary. I don't think it's fair to slap that on because folks don't emote smelling or waggling their ears.

Bopdoot · **01-28-2015, 10:19 AM**

It's nice if people put time into adhering to lore, but as long as someone doesn't make a character (regardless of race) strictly to be an ERP magnet, I really have no complaints lol..

As for Highlanders maxing out sliders, I made Amelia shorter!..... lol but I did max muscles because of her chosen main class (GLA/PAL) and her personality. Lord knows she'd probably faint if someone called her a sex symbol, assuming she even know what they were talking about xD.

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