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cuideag · **05-12-2015, 01:12 PM**

(05-12-2015, 01:05 PM)Melodia Wrote:
(05-12-2015, 01:00 PM)Graeham Ridgefield Wrote:
(05-12-2015, 12:41 PM)Zyrusticae Wrote:
(05-12-2015, 12:12 PM)cuideag Wrote:
(05-12-2015, 12:07 PM)Graeham Ridgefield Wrote: I don't get angry. I don't rant - I pick myself up and work on finding a way to complete it. Usually that involves making use of the party finder, asking for help from some friends or even making it known on this very site that I'm eager to get a particular bit of content over and done with.

Thiiiiis. When all else fails, make friends. I believe we even have some linkshells showcased here on the RPC specifically for helping folks clear content.
"make friends"

I'm sure that's easy and simple for all you social butterflies out there, but for someone like me you may as well ask me to climb the friggin' moon.

You may then (rightfully) ask me why I am playing an MMORPG, but then I would have to retort that this is the closest thing to a modern remix of the original Final Fantasy games we've had in close to a decade now and there are many reasons to play an MMORPG besides social interaction.

And also, what Melodia said.

I wouldn't class myself as a 'social butterfly'. So no, it's not easy. If people are shy then that's something people can sympathise with but if they want to do group content then...they're going to have to interact with other people. Especially if they don't want to rely on the duty finder.

I think you'll be hard pressed to find a player that doesn't have issues to deal with. At the end of the day, though, there's plenty of routes to go down when it comes to finding groups to tackle content. It might take time, effort and more than a few failures but that applies to most aspects of life.

I do interact with people. Daily. So my question for you and the community maybe is, when PF groups repeatedly fail or fail to form, and friends won't help, and DF is impossible (I am looking at you FCoB)....what does someone in my shoes do? Just suck it up and accept that I won't get a clear?

You can give up, or you can give it another go. How far you make it through content is wholly up to you. The help is out there. It really is! Heck, hit me up if you need help with things. I'm not in any of those clear LSes but I love doing Primal Extremes, for example.

Zyrusticae · **05-12-2015, 01:12 PM**

(05-12-2015, 01:00 PM)Graeham Ridgefield Wrote: I wouldn't class myself as a 'social butterfly'. So no, it's not easy. If people are shy then that's something people can sympathise with but if they want to do group content then...they're going to have to interact with other people. Especially if they don't want to rely on the duty finder.

I think you'll be hard pressed to find a player that doesn't have issues to deal with. At the end of the day, though, there's plenty of routes to go down when it comes to finding groups to tackle content. It might take time, effort and more than a few failures but that applies to most aspects of life.

"Shy" is one thing, but I have crippling social anxiety stemming from a severe and irrational fear of rejection from failure that prevents me from taking any positions of responsibility that includes especially leading any parties through difficult trials where everything going wrong is on my head AND THINGS WILL GO WRONG.

When I am only responsible purely for my own performance, I excel. That's enough for me. When I am responsible for the livelihood of others, I stop having fun. It reminds me of going through group projects in school and having to deal with the pressure of having to perform, only to learn that the other group members aren't pulling their weight and I am doomed regardless because I cannot possibly carry the group to an A on my own and - let's be serious here, why in the Seven Hells would I WILLINGLY, VOLUNTARILY subject myself to that kind of hardship? Why, why, why would I do that when this is supposed to be fun and recreational and relaxing and not a bloody struggle to the finish?

I mean, I already avoid raiding anything close to current Coil specifically for these reasons (and more), so why should I be forced into it in a mandatory story dungeon that gates an entire expansion's worth of content?!

If anything, I would want them to remove the requirement to clear SoF entirely so I can just move the hell on with my life and do things I actually ENJOY doing!

All I ask from my mandatory group content is that it be easy and simple enough to not turn into a frustrating slog, and Steps of Faith has been the exact opposite of that, earning my ire and hatred forevermore. Even after nerfs, I doubt I'm going to find any enjoyment out of this.

Cato · **05-12-2015, 01:12 PM**

(05-12-2015, 01:05 PM)Melodia Wrote:
(05-12-2015, 01:00 PM)Graeham Ridgefield Wrote:
(05-12-2015, 12:41 PM)Zyrusticae Wrote:
(05-12-2015, 12:12 PM)cuideag Wrote:
(05-12-2015, 12:07 PM)Graeham Ridgefield Wrote: I don't get angry. I don't rant - I pick myself up and work on finding a way to complete it. Usually that involves making use of the party finder, asking for help from some friends or even making it known on this very site that I'm eager to get a particular bit of content over and done with.

Thiiiiis. When all else fails, make friends. I believe we even have some linkshells showcased here on the RPC specifically for helping folks clear content.
"make friends"

I'm sure that's easy and simple for all you social butterflies out there, but for someone like me you may as well ask me to climb the friggin' moon.

You may then (rightfully) ask me why I am playing an MMORPG, but then I would have to retort that this is the closest thing to a modern remix of the original Final Fantasy games we've had in close to a decade now and there are many reasons to play an MMORPG besides social interaction.

And also, what Melodia said.

I wouldn't class myself as a 'social butterfly'. So no, it's not easy. If people are shy then that's something people can sympathise with but if they want to do group content then...they're going to have to interact with other people. Especially if they don't want to rely on the duty finder.

I think you'll be hard pressed to find a player that doesn't have issues to deal with. At the end of the day, though, there's plenty of routes to go down when it comes to finding groups to tackle content. It might take time, effort and more than a few failures but that applies to most aspects of life.

I do interact with people. Daily. So my question for you and the community maybe is, when PF groups repeatedly fail or fail to form, and friends won't help, and DF is impossible (I am looking at you FCoB)....what does someone in my shoes do? Just suck it up and accept that I won't get a clear?

Well, like I said earlier it'd be worthwhile making a thread on this site asking if there's people willing to team up and try and get through a particular bit of content together. There's a high chance a lot of people are in the same boat.Â

If that doesn't work then you'll just have to repeat the various methods of getting a group together and hope for the best.

Edda · **05-12-2015, 01:14 PM**

(05-12-2015, 12:52 PM)Nako Wrote: sorry, second page then:

(05-12-2015, 09:29 AM)Merri Wrote: It's dependent on the primal music in question. If it has phases, it's the post astral flow music from what I've seen. For example, on Gullfaxi, it starts Titan's theme right after he uses Earthen Fury. Where as with Xanthos, it just starts with the beginning of Garuda's theme since there's no transitions.

I imagine Shiva's and Leviathans start post astral flow, and Ramuh and Ifrit are the full songs.

Imagine is a profoundly powerful word.

(05-12-2015, 01:05 PM)Melodia Wrote: I do interact with people. Daily. So my question for you and the community maybe is, when PF groups repeatedly fail or fail to form, and friends won't help, and DF is impossible (I am looking at you FCoB)....what does someone in my shoes do? Just suck it up and accept that I won't get a clear?

No. Honestly, this is probably the most predictable advice ever, but I do really believe it. You will get a clear. What is important is that you don't stop trying. Balmung is a huge server, so it is really only a matter of finding the right people - the people who mesh well with your attitude and how you play, and who share the same interest in clearing and helping with content. Remember, you can't win if you don't play, but if you give up you will most certainly never clear anything.

There is an abundance of tools for you to use at your disposal. The official and fan forums. Party Finder. Shout. Hell, I've gotten tons of clears just by whispering people in PF who are looking for 'experienced players only,' despite not having much experience myself. Just keep trying dude, you'll get it.

Kage · **05-12-2015, 01:20 PM**

(05-12-2015, 01:04 PM)Kellach Woods Wrote: Honestly if I were to monk it up in this instance I'd ask for a cannon position - less of a chance to screw up rotation and I can probably be more useful that way.

Once cannons aRe down you can also actually dps without him moving. Lb may be different

You might ask friends "when arent you busy? " You might ask on these forums, setting up a doodle getting 6-7 others to say they will help you. You don't give up. You give up you're done.

I've repeatedly mentioned on these forums and in other linkshells that I. Queue. Into. steps. Or. Join. PFs. I see when bored to help people with Steps.

I've found others who do the same thing. I mean my weekend is busy with my brother's wedding and a friend's wedding but if you and others can find a time, do it. The worst part is finding people who give up quickly.

Warren Castille · **05-12-2015, 01:35 PM**

I spent weeks wiping to T5 in DF because somehow everyone but me seemed to die to Twisters. I spent a lifetime of grueling hells dying to Titan EX because somehow everyone but me seemed to die to Landslides.

These fights blow. If you don't arrange a party to help you clear it, you bleed yourself on the grindstone and hope it works out before you're out of parts to grind.

Kellach Woods · **05-12-2015, 01:37 PM**

never bothered with the EXes. guess I should just to learn them

Aaron · **05-12-2015, 03:07 PM**

(05-12-2015, 12:20 PM)Warren Castille Wrote: * Warren Castille gets back on the elitist soapbox.

Saying "This game is easy" should automatically link your raid and EX achievement lists.

Edit: Along with what % of Echo you cleared them with.

I've cleared all the Ex and can reliably farm them but I stopped coil after T9 because SOMEONE RUINED THE ENDING FOR ME!

s-still S-Senpai notice me please? ;_; I-I want to make you proud D:

Warren Castille · **05-12-2015, 03:15 PM**

(05-12-2015, 01:37 PM)Kellach Woods Wrote: never bothered with the EXes. guess I should just to learn them

That's the tricky part: DFing those fights requires not only you to have learned the encounters, but for seven other people to have as well.

(05-12-2015, 03:07 PM)Aaron Wrote: I've cleared all the Ex and can reliably farm them but I stopped coil after T9 because SOMEONE RUINED THE ENDING FOR ME!

s-still S-Senpai notice me please? ;_; I-I want to make you proud D:

I'm just venting. I'm about as casual as they come, but I don't think this game is "easy." I've done my time raiding in WoW and had a lot of success in FFXI and it's very simple to mistake learning something and executing something for it being, well, simple.

I think it's a holdover of my younger days: People who weren't doing the content we were doing would repeatedly tell everyone struggling on it how "easy" things were, based on the truly elite having overcome it in a faster frame of time. If you don't have the experience, the actual experience of having met something, defeated it and overcome it (hence my call for "farm status") I think it's dismissive to declare something simple because you know so-and-so from world-first-FC managed to get past it in the first day.

I know you've got legit raiding chops, Aaron.

Kellach Woods · **05-12-2015, 03:57 PM**

(05-12-2015, 03:15 PM)Warren Castille Wrote: That's the tricky part: DFing those fights requires not only you to have learned the encounters, but for seven other people to have as well.

The worst part I think would be learning the necessary tankswaps assuming I'm going as WAR. If not, it's standard DPS fare of don't stand in shit.

Hyrist · **05-12-2015, 05:13 PM**

Steps of Faith is all about Logistics.

Getting the right people together ,getting the right communication down, making sure all of the check points are made. Sure, it feels fine when everything mixes together well, but that mix of all the right component isn't as easy as everyone claims it to be.

There's the bit that's hard to swallow: SE has the statistics for this, they know the time it takes for an average SoF queue to pop, they know the average abandon rate.

Seeming participation in Heavensward hinges on getting this trial completed? No. It wasn't wrong for them to nerf it. I do agree that providing more incentive would be nice.. but, honestly, what incentive is there for the Hard Mode Ramuh, Shiva, and Crystalis? Does SoF need its own Triple Triad Card?

Kellach Woods · **05-12-2015, 05:26 PM**

(05-12-2015, 05:13 PM)Hyrist Wrote: Seeming participation in Heavensward hinges on getting this trial completed? No. It wasn't wrong for them to nerf it. I do agree that providing more incentive would be nice.. but, honestly, what incentive is there for the Hard Mode Ramuh, Shiva, and Crystalis? Does SoF need its own Triple Triad Card?

The word is Desynthesis.

Qhora Bajihri · **05-12-2015, 10:57 PM**

I was one of those people who did the SoF duty finder on the first day, got a group that went "Oh, no, not this again!" and then asked "Who's been here before?" and then delegated cannons and important things to the people who had, and it was smooth and simple and fast.

But I stopped doing Trial Roulette because of The Chrysalis because that was too hard for most DF groups.

However, I apologize profusely if anyone was in SoF the day I went in as a tank. I tried to join a group of friends by intentionally queuing in progress, and of course, it was not the group I was trying to get in, but rather than just arrive and ditch, I thought I'd at least try and help out this poor bunch of complete strangers who were tank-waiting. Unfortunately, I'm sure I did more harm than good. I didn't have a clue what I was doing, hadn't played the class in oh six months, tried to do what I thought they did on the day SoF launched when I was healing, instead got stomped on, didn't understand at all how to dodge anything, just an absolute mess. I left without even explaining myself in shame, pretty much sure I was causing them more problems than they would have had 7-manning it. That being said, if you end up with someone like me in there getting stomped on, not knowing where the adds come from to pick them up, generally flailing, I'd wager it's still going to be rough going even with these new nerfs.

Telluride · **05-13-2015, 12:24 AM**

RANT GET!

You elite raiders complaining about this move can go eat Moogle poms. SOMETHING needed to be done about SoF. Maybe not what they did, but something.

As I said before and will say again, a game needs hard content, but...

You Do Not Gate Your Main Story With Mechanics That A Pug Cannot Handle.

Do. Not. Do. It.

Make raids hard. Make dungeons hard. These reward people with loot. SoF was a kick to the crotch and a badly-timed design choice. People who have gone from the game will be coming back for the expansion, minus a good chunk of change from their wallets, and the first thing they'll hit is SoF... right when they are relearning the game. And wanting to see the new zone they paid for. And wondering how the hell to do this thing... and getting no loot or nothing after it, just a thumbs up from SE to let them get to the new content.

This is a textbook example of gating, and doing it wrong. Wildstar did this. Wildstar suffered deservedly for it. Carbine tried to make a game for Da Leet Folkz, and... smack.

No, I don't wanna hear about your 1337 Skillz. You did it fine? Fine. You've been playing nonstop for months. This isn't your issue. It's the issue for hundreds of people who want to get what they paid for, are returning to the game, and find this monster of an instance gating them.

Don't mess with people who have just put money in your hands when they are still in the "oh, lookie!" phase, and quite willing to take it back.

END RANT.

We now return you to your regularly scheduled Bard.

Cato · **05-13-2015, 12:42 AM**

Comparing Steps of Faith to Wildstar's gating isn't fair in my opinion. Nor does it have anything to do with 'elitism' for people to not want content to be made simple to the point where it becomes very trivial.

I can understand why they did it but it risks setting an unfortunate trend. We've already seen Pharos Sirius hit with the nerfbat and that was completely optional. It wasn't tied to the main scenario quests.

Wildstar's 'gating' was criticised so heavily because it literally involved completing every dungeon within a strict time limit, lots of grinding and a reliance on gathering thirty nine other players who had gone through the attunement process to even enter a raid in the first place.

From what I've hear they've since changed that but...a slightly challenging mandatory instance just doesn't compare as far as I'm concerned.

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