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Flickering Ember · **06-29-2015, 04:25 PM**

I continue not to understand these seemingly arbitrary low level examples. Where do they come from? I don't think I have even role-played with a level 1 character or even any character under level 15.

No one is level 1 for that long. You can get to level 2 just by walking around! Level 15 is the minimum standard for a RP character you don't feel like leveling up. Not having access to all of the city state areas can be a bit crippling for RP.

What I am getting at is, I'm finding that these examples are so exaggerated that I can't empathize or understand them. I have trouble believing THAT many people run into pre-15s with power-gaming fetishes. The only time I run into a pre-level 15 character at all is if they are used for RP storylines in my circles.

I would be curious to see some non-'level 1' examples in this thread. Something not on the extreme spectrum? It just doesn't seem very realistic. What about level 20? Level 30? And so on.

I don't think anyone has given a straight example on what level a character needs to be to be seen as decently powerful--powerful enough to be a threat. How does one determine such power levels? By the time you're level 20, you've already killed a primal. If something like level 30 is average, what does that make a level 60? Or does a character need to be max level before they are considered a threat?

Do people only take this into account when fighting against the other character in RP combat? What about fighting together against an RP-monster together? What about in conversation, such as the character talking about what they do for a living?

Sahja Elahka · **06-29-2015, 04:54 PM**

That's part of the problem, there is no clear answer.Â Hearing all of the different viewpoints was the point of the thread (as far as I was aware at least)

Seems we're running the whole spectrum here in opinions.Â Which is kinda nice.

FreelanceWizard · **06-29-2015, 04:57 PM**

(06-29-2015, 04:25 PM)Flickering Ember Wrote: I don't think I have even role-played with a level 1 character or even any character under level 15.

(...)

I don't think anyone has given a straight example on what level a character needs to be to be seen as decently powerful--powerful enough to be a threat. How does one determine such power levels? By the time you're level 20, you've already killed a primal. If something like level 30 is average, what does that make a level 60? Or does a character need to be max level before they are considered a threat?

Do people only take this into account when fighting against the other character in RP combat? What about fighting together against an RP-monster together? What about in conversation, such as the character talking about what they do for a living?

Huh. While I don't run into a ton of level 1 "RP only" characters outside of storylines, I have run into some.

Anyway, the primary thing I use the "snap level judgment" for is the particularly rare (on XIV) situation of someone out of the blue deciding to start a fight with no OOC discussion at all. I think we can safely set that one aside for the moment, since it's a pretty uncommon circumstance.

I take level into account, as one of many factors, for the plausibility of anything a character might do. A level 20 arcanist, for instance, professing that they have the ability to summon three different types of egi and conjure fields of flesh-melting darkness starts pushing the boundaries of my acceptance, since they can't actually do any of those things in game. Now, if they provide supporting statements such as that they've been studying arcanima for years, or that they're a prodigy, or basically have some reasonable story that isn't "the blood of Bahamut runs through my veins and I was personally taught all these powers and more by Papalymo," we're probably square. Like I've said, level isn't a particularly important factor for me. It becomes more important to me as the level of claimed power rises and starts slipping into grey areas of lore, but even then, all the other elements of the character's story trump it. I'm sorry I'm not really giving a "bright line" answer, but for me, there simply isn't such a line. When it comes to implausible things, "I know it when I see it," so to speak.

In the context of mechanics to resolve things, relative power level may become a factor, in which case level can provide some tools in that regard -- but even then, I usually don't see that as all that necessary. Superhero balance logic can easily put everyone with the same general character concept ("adventurer") into the same bucket of power, in which case success or failure is up to chance alone.

Ultimately, for me, level only says you're a threat or not if there is no other information available. If you RP that you're an untrained civilian waiter at the Bismarck, then I don't care if you're level 60 in every class -- you've established in your RP that you're not a combat character (and to go back on that and whip out some of those level 60 powers, you'd better have a good reason!). Conversely, if you're only level 20 and you RP that you're a highly trained pit fighter, then you've established in your RP that you're combat-capable, and we can go from there on the "superhero balance logic" scale.

With all that said, though, I think the growth of characters makes for some good RP, so I personally think that there's a lot of value in playing your power closer to your character's level. Instead of playing the master assassin at level 20, try playing the assassin still learning the trade, and have your powers grow as you level. Perhaps this works better for those of us who RP as we progress (instead of leveling to max level and then RPing, or never leveling and only RPing), but I've found it quite rewarding.

So, that's what I mean when I say level "sometimes matters" to me. It matters when there's no other information available to assess another character. It can matter to determine relative power level, if all people agree to that. It can matter as a measure of your own character's growth in ability, if you want to do that. It can matter, in conjunction with other factors, as a way of deciding if some claim seems plausible or not. For me, it doesn't matter as a way of deciding who to RP with, or as an ultimate decider of who gets to play what or who gets to swing the largest stick.

Naunet · **06-29-2015, 10:19 PM**

(06-29-2015, 04:25 PM)Flickering Ember Wrote: I continue not to understand these seemingly arbitrary low level examples. Where do they come from? I don't think I have even role-played with a level 1 character or even any character under level 15.

I didn't really see any in this game - probably because of how strict the level requirements are to access the more rp-friendly aspects of the game. :/ But in WoW and Rift and TERA, I roleplayed with many level 10 and under characters, some of which had logged monthsÂ of /played time on those characters alone.

Perhaps it's these experiences of mine that make me so willing to be blind to level in RP. Someone presented a hypothetical situation of a level 5 character picking a fight with your own character. Personally, I would just take their IC actions at face value and roll with it. Any negative OOC reaction to the RP I may have is strictly based on things like "are they god-moding?"

My level capped characters have had their butts kicked by level 1s. xD

Flickering Ember · **06-29-2015, 10:44 PM**

To be honest, one of the reasons why I might not even notice the level is because the way Final Fantasy XIV's UI works is a lot different from other MMO's I have played. Other MMOs will place the level number front and center, especially WoW's. If you click on a character in WoW, you will know immediately what level they are. In Final Fantasy XIV it is not as obvious.

Sylentmana · **07-02-2015, 09:03 AM**

Personally, I prefer my in-game achievements to be a direct reflection of how powerful my character is. Â A character's level, weapons, armor, and other gear are all reflections of a character's power and accomplishments in the game's world.

When I see other people RPing a character who is supposedly "powerful" but their weapons, gear, and level do not reflect this, I have a hard time taking them seriously (I would like to point out that this does not apply to things like political power or other such intangible things). Â If they are not going to use the game's mechanics and are just going to throw text around, then it just seems like playing a game of "let's pretend." I have to wonder why they aren't just playing a tabletop RPG instead of a video game.

I realize this is kind of a controversial opinion to have within the RP community and as a result, I often have trouble finding people to RP with, but when I do I find the RP is more enjoyable for me, at least.

Gegenji · **07-02-2015, 09:16 AM**

(07-02-2015, 09:03 AM)Sylentmana Wrote: If they are not going to use the game's mechanics and are just going to throw text around, then it just seems like playing a game of "let's pretend." I have to wonder why they aren't just playing a tabletop RPG instead of a video game.

[Image: Here+you+go+_df56c6c682513c4dc47668eaa9524881.jpg]

Sorry, but I definitely need some clarification here on the part that I bolded. We're roleplaying. Isn't that, at its base, a game of "let's pretend"? We're pretending to be wizards and merchants and warriors and chocobo farmers and whatnot.

To go even further - our "character" in the game is the WoL, according to the mechanics presented. So aren't we playing pretend to not be that and to be something else other than what the game says we are for RP purposes? We're not actually Ul'dahn nobles or Ishgardian soldiers or Yellowjackets or a splinter-tribesman from a Sangoli Seeker tribe. We're someone from outside Eorzea who came in from elsewhere and became everyone's go-to Primal-butt-kicker and ultimate errand boy/girl. Everything beyond that is "playing pretend" - though, to be fair, to try to RP as the WoL would be playing pretend too, wouldn't it?

I'm sorry, I hope I don't seem dismissive or anything. I'm just curious about your stance here.

Sylentmana · **07-02-2015, 10:22 AM**

(07-02-2015, 09:16 AM)Gegenji Wrote:
(07-02-2015, 09:03 AM)Sylentmana Wrote: If they are not going to use the game's mechanics and are just going to throw text around, then it just seems like playing a game of "let's pretend." I have to wonder why they aren't just playing a tabletop RPG instead of a video game.

Sorry, but I definitely need some clarification here on the part that I bolded. We're roleplaying. Isn't that, at its base, a game of "let's pretend"? We're pretending to be wizards and merchants and warriors and chocobo farmers and whatnot.

To go even further - our "character" in the game is the WoL, according to the mechanics presented. So aren't we playing pretend to not be that and to be something else other than what the game says we are for RP purposes? We're not actually Ul'dahn nobles or Ishgardian soldiers or Yellowjackets or a splinter-tribesman from a Sangoli Seeker tribe. We're someone from outside Eorzea who came in from elsewhere and became everyone's go-to Primal-butt-kicker and ultimate errand boy/girl. Everything beyond that is "playing pretend" - though, to be fair, to try to RP as the WoL would be playing pretend too, wouldn't it?

I'm sorry, I hope I don't seem dismissive or anything. I'm just curious about your stance here.

Its no problem. I had a feeling after I posted it, that this phrase would cause some confusion. I should have better clarified what I meant. Tongue

Â First of all, you're right. Â We the players are ultimately engaged in a game of pretend, whether RPing or not. The phrase "let's pretend" was used for lack of a better phrase, but I really meant it within the context of being IC. Â When performing a wholly text-based RP, it seems to me as if the characters themselves are playing a game of "let's pretend." Like they came up to each other and one said, "Pretend I'm swinging my sword at you" or something similar. Â

It just makes me think of the characters themselves as if they are engaged in a child's game of pretend, chasing each other around, swinging invisible swords, and making swooshing and clanging noises. Â It all just seems a bit silly to me.

I hope this helps clarify what I meant. Also, your reaction pics made me laugh. Laugh

Dis · **07-02-2015, 10:33 AM**

(07-02-2015, 10:22 AM)Sylentmana Wrote:
(07-02-2015, 09:16 AM)Gegenji Wrote:
(07-02-2015, 09:03 AM)Sylentmana Wrote: -snip-

-snip-
Its no problem. I had a feeling after I posted it, that this phrase would cause some confusion. I should have better clarified what I meant. Â First of all, you're right. Â We the players are ultimately engaged in a game of pretend, whether RPing or not. The phrase "let's pretend" was used for lack of a better phrase, but I really meant it within the context of being IC. Â When performing a wholly text-based RP, it seems to me as if the characters themselves are playing a game of "let's pretend." Like they came up to each other and one said, "Pretend I'm swinging my sword at you" or something similar. Â

It just makes me think of the characters themselves as if they are engaged in a child's game of pretend, chasing each other around, swinging invisible swords, and making swooshing and clanging noises. Â It all just seems a bit silly to me.

I hope this helps clarify what I meant. Also, your reaction pics made me laugh.

The thing is, that MMO RP isn't all that much different from text-based RP. Â It's similar to my tabletop games as well, because I often let levels slide around when a player comes to me with a really good character concept (someone in one of my DM'd games is playing a princess who happens to be level three right now). Â You pretend to be something you aren't, and represent it in type because the MSQ/assigned story doesn't fit anything outside a particular niche (Warrior of Light from a far-away land not anywhere in the current city-states, like Gegenji pointed out).

There are currently a lot of character concepts seen in RP that aren't really represented in the game. Â Doman's, for example, would have to just be Ninja's, and would be pidgeonholed into that class because as far as we know, only Ninja/Shinobi come from Doma. Â I haven't seen much representation of other classes from Doma. Â But I've seen other Doman RPer's who are other classes, and use those classes as a representation of that other class (Gladiator for a swordsman, or Dark Knight come to mind). Â

You'd also have to dismiss a character who is void-touched or voidsent, because those aren't things we can technically represent through our characters and levels. Â There are a lotÂ of character concepts that you'd end up having to handwave away using this mindset, because either the players behind the screen just don't have time to level, or, like it was said way earlier in the thread, their main PvE character is on another server, and they primarily come to Balmung forÂ the RP, not the PvE. Â Viewing OOC character strength (and note that they call this OOC achivement in the thread title for a reason) as an indicator of IC power level has always seemed rather..Â

Well.. let's just call a spade a spade. Â Using OOC achivement to determine IC power level is technically what you'd call metagaming, because metagaming is using out of character knowledge (I know your character is level 10 because I targeted you and saw it OOCly) in an in-character context (My character won't take you serious despite the fact you say you're an active gladiator who has been in the arena for a few seasons, and are wearing gladiator gear and a sword, because I saw that you're level 10).

Flickering Ember · **07-02-2015, 11:05 AM**

(07-02-2015, 09:03 AM)Sylentmana Wrote: If they are not going to use the game's mechanics and are just going to throw text around, then it just seems like playing a game of "let's pretend." I have to wonder why they aren't just playing a tabletop RPG instead of a video game.

You know what? You're right. Better pack up my bags and unsubscribe folks. There's no reason for me to be here anymore. Why haven't I seen it until now?

....

No, but really. I play tabletop twice a week and play this game. If anything, tabletop successfully takes level into account for its RP much more than mmo RP ever could. The rulebooks have clear definitions for what each level means and how powerful it is. In MMOs, there is no clear consensus or agreement on what level means what for your character.

Why could I possibly want to RP in a mmo though? Large internet community filled with friends? A great game filled with consistent updates? RP that can be finished in a matter of hours as opposed to weeks and months? The feeling that I am literally playing in an open world thanks to immersive graphics? The ability to make and decorate my own character despite not having a pinky finger's worth of artistic ability? How about the fact that mmo RP is completely structurally different from anything that takes place in tabletop?

Is it worth mentioning that in the year and a half I've RPed here that not once has this topic ever come up in my RP?

No? Am I worthy enough to be able to RP in a MMO yet? Do I have your permission?

ArmachiA · **07-02-2015, 11:13 AM**

I don't think your OOCly level is that big of a deal if it's been agreed upon by everyone you RP with that is doesn't matter. For instance, I play bad guys for my FC, but all of them have only been level 23 or so. It was agreed by everyone to treat them to be at a certain power level. For instance, my Garlean was pretty strong but mostly relied on Garlean weaponry to survive while my Voidsent was VERY powerful. These were bad guys though, so it was good to get the FCs permission first. For player character, I personally never look at a characters level.

To me, there's a big difference between the world of FFXIV and the "Meta-game" of FFXIV. The Meta game is, of course, levels, being able to play any job, Fantasia potions, raiding in Coil, the Lightning Event, things are are there for ooc purposes and mechanics, while the "World" of FFXIV is how the characters live in it. Those are two very different things and I think they need to stay separate.

Sylentmana · **07-02-2015, 11:38 AM**

(07-02-2015, 10:33 AM)Glioca Sargonnai Wrote:
(07-02-2015, 10:22 AM)Sylentmana Wrote:
(07-02-2015, 09:16 AM)Gegenji Wrote:
(07-02-2015, 09:03 AM)Sylentmana Wrote: -snip-

-snip-
Its no problem. I had a feeling after I posted it, that this phrase would cause some confusion. I should have better clarified what I meant. Â First of all, you're right. Â We the players are ultimately engaged in a game of pretend, whether RPing or not. The phrase "let's pretend" was used for lack of a better phrase, but I really meant it within the context of being IC. Â When performing a wholly text-based RP, it seems to me as if the characters themselves are playing a game of "let's pretend." Like they came up to each other and one said, "Pretend I'm swinging my sword at you" or something similar. Â

It just makes me think of the characters themselves as if they are engaged in a child's game of pretend, chasing each other around, swinging invisible swords, and making swooshing and clanging noises. Â It all just seems a bit silly to me.

I hope this helps clarify what I meant. Also, your reaction pics made me laugh.

The thing is, that MMO RP isn't all that much different from Tabletop RP. Â You pretend to be something you aren't, and represent it in type because the MSQ/assigned story doesn't fit anything outside a particular niche (Warrior of Light from a far-away land not anywhere in the current city-states, like Gegenji pointed out).

There are currently a lot of character concepts seen in RP that aren't really represented in the game. Â Doman's, for example, would have to just be Ninja's, and would be pidgeonholed into that class because as far as we know, only Ninja/Shinobi come from Doma. Â I haven't seen much representation of other classes from Doma. Â But I've seen other Doman RPer's who are other classes, and use those classes as a representation of that other class (Gladiator for a swordsman, or Dark Knight come to mind). Â

You'd also have to dismiss a character who is void-touched or voidsent, because those aren't things we can technically represent through our characters and levels. Â There are a lotÂ of character concepts that you'd end up having to handwave away using this mindset, because either the players behind the screen just don't have time to level, or, like it was said way earlier in the thread, their main PvE character is on another server, and they primarily come to Balmung forÂ the RP, not the PvE. Â Viewing OOC character strength (and note that they call this OOC achivement in the thread title for a reason) as an indicator of IC power level has always seemed rather..Â

Well.. let's just call a spade a spade. Â Using OOC achivement to determine IC power level is technically what you'd call metagaming, because metagaming is using out of character knowledge in an in-character context.

Seems a fair enough argument. I would like to clarify that when I argued for using game mechanics as a part of RP, I didn't mean that you should use elements of the game's story as that would be unreasonable (since then everyone would have the same story and be the savior of Eorzea). Â Also, no one really likes the person who RPs the savior of the world, going around imposing that hefty title and background on everyone else.

While I do agree that using such knowledge as character and weapon stats while IC is considered metagaming, I do think that your character can look at another character and, through visual cues, get a basic of how powerful/skilled that character is. Â High-quality armor and weapons are a good indicator that a character has had a lot of experience fighting and has conquered some tough opponents. Â While this is not universally true, my characters would often think twice before engaging in combat with opponents that sport such visual cues.

As far as Domans being pigeon holed into just Ninja, I have to disagree. Â While I do think the Ninja is a profession that originated in Doma/Othard, I see all the basic classes/jobs that you choose in Character Creation to be common throughout the world. Â Just because they haven't been represented by NPCs yet, that doesn't mean they don't exist. Â As for RPing a voidsent, its true that those aren't represented by playable stats, but they aren't playable at all and it seems like it would be a bit lore-breaking to RP one. Bouncy

I would like to point out, though, that everything that I've said in my posts are my personal opinions Â and are how I preferÂ to play, nothing more. I don't refuse to RP with others just because they don't share these opinions and I don't think less of others just because they choose to play differently than I (though I don't engage in fights with other players either through RP text of PvP as I don't particularly enjoy either). Â I just thought I should throw that out lest anyone think I'm some sort of metagaming, godmodding, RP elitist as that is not how I try to play. Tongue

Â It's all just personal preference.

Dis · **07-02-2015, 12:55 PM**

(07-02-2015, 11:38 AM)Sylentmana Wrote: I didn't mean that you should use elements of the game's story as that would be unreasonable

Using the system mechanics is just as implausible. Â Your character can't see my level. Â Your character shouldn't treat mine a certain way because of level, the same way mine can't see your level. Â You just are what you RP that you are. Â I ran across a 50 Ninja in full AF, whose AF had been glamored into the trashy shepards tunic and worn pants. Â They passed as a commoner, but they obviously had training as a Ninja, and were a Ninja in disguise. Â I'd have no way of knowing that IC, and would be metagaming if I tried to state otherwise about their stance/etc when they gave nothing away.

(07-02-2015, 11:38 AM)Sylentmana Wrote: While I do agree that using such knowledge as character and weapon stats while IC is considered metagaming, I do think that your character can look at another character and, through visual cues, get a basic of how powerful/skilled that character is. Â High-quality armor and weapons are a good indicator that a character has had a lot of experience fighting and has conquered some tough opponents. Â While this is not universally true, my characters would often think twice before engaging in combat with opponents that sport such visual cues.

Glioca uses the Rainbow Shirt, hempen pants, sabatons, rimless glasses, and no shield when IC, and represents herself as a Mystic Knight, someone who combines spellcraft and swordplay. Â There is no current in-game representation of it, but Mystic Knight is canon in the Final Fantasy universe elsewhere, and was I want to say used similarly as a Rune Fencer in XI. Â Does this mean I can't use it in game? Â Despite the fact I think it's an interesting type of character and an interesting fighting style? Â That's very limiting and means I have to be one of the current character classes, none of which wholly fit her character concept. Â

Going into the bit about characters in fancy armor, even the low-leveled NPC Sultansworn wear the Paladin AF as a uniform. Â Including those less skilled than the captain of the Sultansworn. Â They're a more untrained individual in fancy armor. Â I point you to the newest Armorsmith quest. Â Blanstyr, the Roe we fought against in a smithing contest looks great in the armor he makes for himself, but has absolutely no skill and is saved by a party of low-level adventurers out in the fields around Lower La Noscea. Â

Armor/level doesn't make skill, it just helps in the game mechanic sense. Â Similarly, in an RP fight, a more heavily armored character might have an advantage against a non-armored character. Â Unless of course you're fighting a mage who sets your armor alight with fire and boils you out of it, but that's a whole other kettle of fish. Â Either way, I think you get where I was going with that.

(07-02-2015, 11:38 AM)Sylentmana Wrote: While I do think the Ninja is a profession that originated in Doma/Othard, I see all the basic classes/jobs that you choose in Character Creation to be common throughout the world.

We don't currently know what classes originated in what areas. Â We have some ideas based on Xaela lore (Dazkar are archers, for example), Â but Ninja can only be obtained by learning about it from NPC's from Doma. Â Reversing the above point, should non-Doman Ninja be dismissed as lore-breaking? Â Even if their character traveled to Othard as part of their backstory?

(07-02-2015, 11:38 AM)Sylentmana Wrote: Just because they haven't been represented by NPCs yet, that doesn't mean they don't exist.

But if we're going strictly off what we see in the game as far as classes and levels, that contradicts believing things not represented in the game. Â That's why there are so many issues. Â Picking and choosing means that you want to dismiss certain concepts and embrace other concepts, and while that's great on a personal level, that limits your RP and can potentially cause you to blow someone's cover, for example, if they're doing a certain thing with their character ICly and you make a comment about them not being a threat, or being overly skilled because of their gear. Â If that low level character is strong but slumming it (max level on another toon but representing a different class because of appearance gear), or if that high level character is game-strong but totally unskilled in RP

(07-02-2015, 11:38 AM)Sylentmana Wrote: As for RPing a voidsent, its true that those aren't represented by playable stats, but they aren't playable at all and it seems like it would be a bit lore-breaking to RP one

Voidsent RP is actually supported by lore and not breaking it, provided the character is possessed (most commonly seen). Â We see it in the Haukke Manor questline with Lady Amandine, and it's referenced in the Thaumaturge questline when Cocobusi is possessed by a voidsent as part of the quest chain.

(07-02-2015, 11:38 AM)Sylentmana Wrote: It's all just personal preference.

I understand that things like this are personal preference, but at the same time, if I was the RPer you derailed, I know I'd be upset. Â Especially because someone I was trying to interact with was metagaming on me. Â Most of us as players would be incensed if someone was attempting to metagame in an RP with us, but for some reason, OOC levels seems to be an acceptable place to metagame at for a lot of players, and I actually find that kind of disturbing.

Magellan · **07-02-2015, 01:49 PM**

It is interesting to note, nowhere in the Final Fantasy universe, does a characters gear denote strength. Think of the Scions. Do ANY of them wear armor? They wear very basic clothing.
Nor do we aS consumers of the story ever wonder about their 'level'. We accept they are strong, because of how they act, and the actions they perform.

Sure, you can point to several Garleans as being 'epically geared', but they ultimately lose don't they? They place their faith in the power of their science technology, instead of building the power within themselves. And personally, to me, they never really felt threatening.

You know who did feel threatening? Sephiroth. He wore a robe. Kefka. He looked like one of Lady Gaga's backup dancers.

Another example would be Steiner, from FFIX. He was dressed up as a tin can to serve as ironic comic relief.

This extends to books, movies and television. Rarely does a sense of a characters strength come from what they wear or sense of level. In instead comes from the actions they perform, and backstory. Gear as strength is a pve construct only, in that stronger gear allows you to clear higher level content.Â

A soldier in battle does not see the combatant in a cloth tunic as weaker. It might be the last mistake they make.

With all that said , if someone wants to use ooc pve achievement as a way to create and validate their characters strength and backstory, thats awesome and a really cool way to go about it. But it should NOT extend to how they view other RPers, as not all characters are created in the same manner. Many of us prefer completely IC narrative instead.

Sylentmana · **07-02-2015, 02:55 PM**

Sorry for the weird layout. I can't seem to figure out how to quote certain sections from a post like you did in your previous one. Â You make some good points, some of which I hadn't considered. Â The part about the Ninja with the glamour sounds really clever. Â I'll have to try that one myself sometime. Â

As for the part with the voidsent, when you first mentioned it, I immediately thought of people RPing as on of those big demons with the wings and the claws and the flying. Â The idea of playing a voidsent possessing a person never crossed my mind. That was my mistake I can see how someone would be able to play that way. Â

You make many other excellent points that I had not considered and I think it comes down to the fact that I failed to think outside of the box. Part of what you were talking about, the parts about glamour, is kind of what I'm arguing for. That's using the games mechanics as tool meant to enhance the RP experience instead of just ignoring it outright. That's why I didn't see a point in texting combat when you can just do it instead.Â

I had not considered the fact some may be RPing a class that is not represented in the game (yet, at least) or that a low level character might actually be an extension of a higher level character from another server. Again, these would be examples of my own failures.

However, the point I ultimately want to get across is this. All the things I have previously so clumsily argued for were meant to be an explanation of the views, limitations, and restrictions I placed upon my own character. Â While I understand that some may RP outside what is presented within the game, I prefer to play within and using the limitations the game has placed upon me.Â

I get more enjoyment out of it that way, but I do notÂ expect others to adhere to my self-imposed standards. Â I have not and would not derail another person's RP (doing so is just plain rude) just because they didn't create their character the same way I made mine or because their character doesn't operate under the same rules. I don't expect others to adhere to my own standards for playing my character.Â

I also don't RP with others using meta knowledge (at least not on purpose). All of this is what I meant when I said it comes down to personal preference. I know I've forgotten to mention something or address another point, but I can't remember and this post has gotten very lengthy anyways.

*Edit: This post was meant to address both Glioca's and Magellan's posts.*

Poll: How important is OOC level/Achievement? You do not have permission to vote in this poll.
Not important at all.	55.56%	60	55.56%
Somewhat important.	37.04%	40	37.04%
Very important.	7.41%	8	7.41%
Total		108 vote(s)	100%

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How important is OOC achievement when playing a powerful character ICly?

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