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Naunet · **09-08-2013, 10:12 AM**

(09-08-2013, 12:01 AM)LiadansWhisper Wrote:

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SpoilerIn the White Mage questline, you learn that you're the first non-Padjal White Mage in hundreds of years, perhaps longer, because non-Padjal have been deemed "too risky" to be given the knowledge of the Art of Succor.

With that in mind, you'd have to have convinced one of them that you were worthy (which would seem to be no small task), and then hidden the fact that you were a completely selfish, self-serving person during the training itself. Â And then if you were to succeed in all of that, you'd still have to consider that the Padjal would be unlikely to be okay with you running around abusing your power. Â It's highly likely they'd send someone (or multiple someones) to prevent you from further abusing it.

So while I'm not saying that it's impossible by any means, I think that for it to be believable, you'd have to take the consequences of such a situation into account, as well.

Honestly, I think this is just far too restrictive to be taken at face value. AllÂ of us can become White Mages OOC if we wanted. Simply by nature of it being an available class/job, there absolutely needs to be a way for one's character to be ICly said job without skirting the line of the "Chosen One" story. The Padjal can't possibly personally train all of the potential White Mages out there; it's absolutely unrealistic. So acknowledging that, there needs to be some give in how one becomes a White Mage.

Jove · **09-08-2013, 10:22 AM**

(09-08-2013, 09:48 AM)Siobhain Wrote: And I'm not sure what they did. Like I said, I'm thinking immortality. The only other thing I could imagine doing with White Magic is necromancy but I haven't seen any such thing relating to that so I doubt it even exists. I also imagine torturing people to death and rezzing them over and over again until they forfeit. That's a way to abuse dem White Mage powers!

It's interesting that you mention Necromancy, because you're right I haven't seen it mentioned any where either, but you only have to go to the Deepcroft to see the undead shambling about.

Restless spirits, trapped in a corporeal form maybe, but it seems likely they were raised by Cthulhu's son and his cultists, which makes me wonder if corrupted white magic was used to raise these dead. After all, healers can use the raise spell on the almost dead, so what happens if a particularly powerful mage forces it on the long dead?
Is it possible that white magic becomes corrupted when used for unnatural purposes? I could easily see the corrupted white mages of old drawing on the aether to extend their physical life, or to bring loved ones back from the dead, like you say.

(Torture is also a good suggestion! Fling a man with Aero, break his bones every time he's smashed against the wall while slinging cures at him. Gruesome)

FreelanceWizard · **09-08-2013, 10:40 AM**

(09-08-2013, 10:12 AM)Naunet Wrote: Honestly, I think this is just far too restrictive to be taken at face value. AllÂ of us can become White Mages OOC if we wanted. Simply by nature of it being an available class/job, there absolutely needs to be a way for one's character to be ICly said job without skirting the line of the "Chosen One" story. The Padjal can't possibly personally train all of the potential White Mages out there; it's absolutely unrealistic. So acknowledging that, there needs to be some give in how one becomes a White Mage.

I'd suggest that the easy generalized approach to this is that the current crop of White Mages are the first ones being trained by the Padjal and their trusted associates in hundreds of years (as opposed to the PC being the only one). It's a very minor change, IMO. Of course, one can always learn in other ways -- once the Padjal teaches someone the Art, there's nothing stopping that person from teaching others or using the magic for more nefarious purposes.

To the OP's question, as long as you have a lore-friendly, plausible explanation for why your character was able to progress sufficiently as a Conjurer and learn the Art of White Magic, you're good. Maybe your character's an excellent liar. Maybe he was trained by someone else with less scruples than the Padjal. Maybe the stress of constant battle makes him ultimately cynical and self-serving ("All this pressure and what do I get? Nothing? Godsdamn that!").

And corrupted white magic? Oh, there's all sorts of things. Torture is the most obvious application, but you could also harm the environment to your own benefit, overuse magic (a city where no one ever dies or gets injured), manipulate minds, abuse the elements... the possibilities are endless. I'd suggest reading through a bit of the Exalted information on their First Age; First Age Solars had both significant magical power and unbridled hubris, and they're a great example of how even seemingly "nice" powers can be bent to oligarchic, abusive evil.

Sigyn Shieldbreaker · **09-08-2013, 10:42 AM**

(09-08-2013, 10:22 AM)Jove Wrote:
(09-08-2013, 09:48 AM)Siobhain Wrote: And I'm not sure what they did. Like I said, I'm thinking immortality. The only other thing I could imagine doing with White Magic is necromancy but I haven't seen any such thing relating to that so I doubt it even exists. I also imagine torturing people to death and rezzing them over and over again until they forfeit. That's a way to abuse dem White Mage powers!

It's interesting that you mention Necromancy, because you're right I haven't seen it mentioned any where either, but you only have to go to the Deepcroft to see the undead shambling about.

Restless spirits, trapped in a corporeal form maybe, but it seems likely they were raised by Cthulhu's son and his cultists, which makes me wonder if corrupted white magic was used to raise these dead. After all, healers can use the raise spell on the almost dead, so what happens if a particularly powerful mage forces it on the long dead?
Is it possible that white magic becomes corrupted when used for unnatural purposes? I could easily see the corrupted white mages of old drawing on the aether to extend their physical life, or to bring loved ones back from the dead, like you say.

(Torture is also a good suggestion! Fling a man with Aero, break his bones every time he's smashed against the wall while slinging cures at him. Gruesome)

I didn't realize that there were undead about! I haven't gotten far enough in. So yes, very likely, that could be connected too! Interesting...

They gave a dark side to those chubby little Lalafell with their white robes on.

(I can see you and I are going to get along.)

LiadansWhisper · **09-08-2013, 02:44 PM**

(09-08-2013, 10:12 AM)Naunet Wrote:
(09-08-2013, 12:01 AM)LiadansWhisper Wrote:

Show Content

SpoilerIn the White Mage questline, you learn that you're the first non-Padjal White Mage in hundreds of years, perhaps longer, because non-Padjal have been deemed "too risky" to be given the knowledge of the Art of Succor.

With that in mind, you'd have to have convinced one of them that you were worthy (which would seem to be no small task), and then hidden the fact that you were a completely selfish, self-serving person during the training itself. Â And then if you were to succeed in all of that, you'd still have to consider that the Padjal would be unlikely to be okay with you running around abusing your power. Â It's highly likely they'd send someone (or multiple someones) to prevent you from further abusing it.

So while I'm not saying that it's impossible by any means, I think that for it to be believable, you'd have to take the consequences of such a situation into account, as well.

Honestly, I think this is just far too restrictive to be taken at face value. AllÂ of us can become White Mages OOC if we wanted. Simply by nature of it being an available class/job, there absolutely needs to be a way for one's character to be ICly said job without skirting the line of the "Chosen One" story. The Padjal can't possibly personally train all of the potential White Mages out there; it's absolutely unrealistic. So acknowledging that, there needs to be some give in how one becomes a White Mage.

Anyone can potentially be a White Mage, and apparently this has been the case for centuries, but no non-Padjal has been one in all of that time. Â *shrugs* Â The White Mage questline is why I ultimately decided not to RP my character as a White Mage. Â It would seem to beggar belief that there would suddenly be hundreds of non-Padjal White Mages when just getting yourself accepted was an epic effort in and of itself. Â

You're free to feel it's restrictive. Â I personally wish that they'd gone about the questline another way, because I also see it as a mite restrictive. Â But it's the Lore they've gone with. Â *shrug*

(09-08-2013, 10:22 AM)Jove Wrote:
(09-08-2013, 09:48 AM)Siobhain Wrote: And I'm not sure what they did. Like I said, I'm thinking immortality. The only other thing I could imagine doing with White Magic is necromancy but I haven't seen any such thing relating to that so I doubt it even exists. I also imagine torturing people to death and rezzing them over and over again until they forfeit. That's a way to abuse dem White Mage powers!

It's interesting that you mention Necromancy, because you're right I haven't seen it mentioned any where either, but you only have to go to the Deepcroft to see the undead shambling about.

Restless spirits, trapped in a corporeal form maybe, but it seems likely they were raised by Cthulhu's son and his cultists, which makes me wonder if corrupted white magic was used to raise these dead. After all, healers can use the raise spell on the almost dead, so what happens if a particularly powerful mage forces it on the long dead?
Is it possible that white magic becomes corrupted when used for unnatural purposes? I could easily see the corrupted white mages of old drawing on the aether to extend their physical life, or to bring loved ones back from the dead, like you say.

(Torture is also a good suggestion! Fling a man with Aero, break his bones every time he's smashed against the wall while slinging cures at him. Gruesome)

Raya-O-Senna tells you that Succor (White Magic) is every bit as destructive as Black Magic when it's misused.

However, I don't think it has anything to do with Necromancy or raising the long dead. Â There's nothing about the spell Raise or the lore surrounding it (via the Conjurer questline) to suggest that it's more than something that brings you back from the brink of death. Â I honestly don't believe that it would work on something that was actually dead.

E-Sumi-Yan tells you that Conjurers draw upon the power of the elements and nature for their abilities. Â Apparently Conjurers access a part of Succor, but are restricted by the Elementals. Â White Mages can access the full power of Succor.

E-Sumi also tells you that the power Conjurers draw upon cannot be taken, only borrowed, and must be returned. Â Others have speculated (in other threads) that the power the Conjurers are drawing from is the Aether streams, though they know it by another name. Â If we follow that line of speculation, then White Mages would be drawing even harder on that same power source.

Now imagine if hundreds, or even thousands, of White Mages were drawing on the Aether streams of the world at a rate never before seen. Â We know that when Aether is stripped from an area, it becomes barren, because the Aether is a lifeforce not unlike Mako in FFVII. Â So to me, the most likely explanation for "how did White Mages almost destroy the world by misusing their power" is that they drew so hard on the Aether streams with their abilities that they nearly drained those Aether streams.

(09-08-2013, 10:40 AM)FreelanceWizard Wrote: To the OP's question, as long as you have a lore-friendly, plausible explanation for why your character was able to progress sufficiently as a Conjurer and learn the Art of White Magic, you're good. Maybe your character's an excellent liar. Maybe he was trained by someone else with less scruples than the Padjal. Maybe the stress of constant battle makes him ultimately cynical and self-serving ("All this pressure and what do I get? Nothing? Godsdamn that!").

Definitely wasn't trying to suggest that it was impossible. Â I don't think it's a bad idea, necessarily. Â I just think that it would be more believable if consequences were factored in, and I personally find it much better for RP when I completely think about the factors affecting my character. Â Having set down, if only in my mind, the steps that led to my character being where she is currently helps me immensely in portraying her.

Quote:And corrupted white magic? Oh, there's all sorts of things. Torture is the most obvious application, but you could also harm the environment to your own benefit, overuse magic (a city where no one ever dies or gets injured), manipulate minds, abuse the elements... the possibilities are endless. I'd suggest reading through a bit of the Exalted information on their First Age; First Age Solars had both significant magical power and unbridled hubris, and they're a great example of how even seemingly "nice" powers can be bent to oligarchic, abusive evil.

Was not really talking about that. Â I've also read quite a bit about the Exalted - used to play the game! Â Kinda miss my character. Â D: Â But that wasn't really where I was going with the mention of "corrupted white mage."

Sigyn Shieldbreaker · **09-08-2013, 09:50 PM**

Succor, to clarify for anyone reading this thread who doesn't know, is giving aid or assistance in times of hardship and distress. That's the actual word not the FF version of it. When they said the 'art of succor' I was thinking the 'art of giving aid' but I guess it's actually the name of their magic.

Many games make a playable class or race 'rare' in lore but totally accessible for you as a player. Mostly because they're not caring so much about a roleplaying community that'll use their lore as weapons or shields against one another so much as the gamers who want to play through the story line. There's nothing stopping someone from being a master of all the arts they offer, and some people might carry that over into character. Likewise, there's nothing that prevents you, lore-wise, from being no more than a simple merchant or a dancer since many RPers don't want to take classes or abilities into account any more than level or gender or restrictive hair styles.

We basically pick and choose what is acceptable for ourselves and (sometimes in some not-so-great cases) for other people out of the mechanics, the lore, and the gameplay.

That being said, it -is- a bit weird that they chose to define White Mages this way for FF. Many of the other groups have an origin definition, like Dragoons, Paladins, Pugilists, etc. that don't really make it absolutely necessary that you come from the area where the profession was at its peak or was best known for. White Mages, on the other hand, are restricted as a class to being a lot of Padjal (whom I think many RPers on this forum in an old thread suggest that you not try to RP) or people who are directly accepted by the Padjal (which is still pretty shiny. It's like saying you were trained to be a ranger by a Dark Ranger in Warcraft, which is enough to make most people roll their eyes). Yes, we can try to wheedle our way around them by using loopholes and not going the 'I'm a sparkly magic person that was so great the Padjal made me one of the raaaaare Whiiiite Maaaages....' route but the base-line is still a pain in the bottom.

I'd have thought, knowing there'd -be- RPers and knowing that -many- -many- people are going to choose the main healing class, they would've given something a bit more broad or something with a bigger number.

All the same, I'm personally ready to accept any reason for a White Mage. I think it's acceptable to play a character who has innate healing potential. Maybe nothing as classy and refined as a full blown White Mage but someone who is just naturally proficient at bending aether in small feats of healing. Maybe we should concentrate more on offering other ideas for how people can play -Healers- and not specifically -White Mages- for the benefit of our fellow RPers.

LandStander · **09-08-2013, 10:51 PM**

(09-07-2013, 11:54 PM)Devin Farraday Wrote: I would (If Balmung weren't locked out right now - stupid server closures). It seems like it might fit more, but I do like the aesthetic of a White Mage.

Log in between like 2-6am pst in Balmung, character creation is open during the ass crack of dawn. I just made a character this morning.

E'irawen · **09-08-2013, 11:09 PM**

The way this was explained to me is... Necessarily speaking, being a white mage doesn't mean you can't work for the empire. But the powers you are granted are to be used "for good" in the sense that you are not supposed to harm another person with white magic, lest the elementals/etc. get kind of pissed at you and you end up leaving their good graces.

Cota Orben · **09-09-2013, 09:11 AM**

... Wow, I think I love all of you guys. This thread has really opened me to a lot of ideas, including some that I've since incorporated into RP.Â

As I have it now, and keep in mind this is liable to change, is that this character is a Scholar (A bit more neutral, healing - essentially - through arcane geometry) who passes as a Conjurer when doing some of his Imperial work; I've had him mention how difficult it is to handle Stone, Fluid Barrier and other Conjurer/WHM exclusive abilities.Â

Though that raises a whole 'nother can of worms, when one wonders whether Scholars are exclusively from Nym? It seems like any place that has access to Arcanima and Conjury would be able to pull it off, but the background lore goes into rather exhaustive detail about Nym. Which, from what I can understand, is still around and not an Imperial territory...Â

Unless the only thing really stopping Eorzeans from attempting to turn their cloaks is this sort of universal hatred of the Garlean Empire... Would it be possible for someone from Nym, possibly under duress, perhaps not, to ally with the enemy and thus bring over knowledge exclusive to one location? I know my friend wants to play a Dragoon, something that's apparently Ishguard - exclusive, but at the same time... if Garlean had some way to learn the mechanics of it, they could make good use of soldiers designed to fight dragons.Â

Any thoughts?

Iseldia Wells · **09-09-2013, 10:13 AM**

I wanted to thank everyone posting the White Mage lore in this thread too. It has really helped me polish out my alt White Mage and even gave me more RP opportunity to have her strive to to becoming a White Mage instead of being one at start.

While I don't normally want to be a "sparkly magic special person" I will still be making her a White Mage at some point, regardless of how restricted and rare they are "supposed" to be.

Back on topic: Good luck with your character background Devin. It is definitely a unique look at using specific classes.

As for the Dragoon, Iseldia is from Ishgard and her main strive will be to become a Dragoon, however as others have recommended in this thread. Not every Dragoon HAS to be Ishgardian. Your friend could have encountered one in travels or even on a darker side: the Empire could have kidnapped a Dragoon and forced him to train your friend (and other Imperials) in the arts.

Sigyn Shieldbreaker · **09-09-2013, 10:15 AM**

Ahhh, Scholars are another one I wonder about. I mean 'scholar' itself, and what they did for Nym doesn't seem like it should be restricted to a place; it's fairly general.

â€œIn an age long past, when mankind flourished under the radiance of arcane mastery, the island of Vylbrand was home to a city-state called Nym. Though the history of that age tells of countless wars waged with earth-shattering incantations, it was the brilliant strategic maneuvering of Nym's scholars that allowed their mundane army of mariners to throw back would-be conquerers time and again. These learned men and women defended the freedom of their tiny nation with their unique command over spell-weaving faeries, utilizing the creatures' magicks to heal the wounded and bolster the strength of their allies.â€

But their method includes fairies. I don't know how exclusive that might be. I mean, a scholar/magic user might be from anywhere and I'm sure they've since dispersed to other places in Eorzea and could teach what they know. I assume they know some spells of their own but I imagine most of what they do is like Orihime from BLEACH; their power lies in their relationship with the fairies they use.

I notice that in a lot of these Game Descriptions, it includes 'In an age long past' 'A long time ago' etc. and that gives me the impression you could pick it up from someone, virtually anywhere, so long as you had the mind to dedicate to it.

If I rolled a Scholar character, I'd probably have a character with an initial lust for knowledge, who learned as much as they could as an Arcanist before witnessing a Scholar in action and begging to be taught.

I -like- making my classes make sense and FFXIV gives you the beeeaaautiful capacity right there in the mechanics to start a character off as a gladiator or a conjurer or an arcanist or any of the starting classes and finding an RPer who's more advanced to teach you their skill. I haven't gotten a chance to do this but if, by some slim... slim hope... Miqo'tes get a little less popular and, say, Siobhain dies (*knocks on wood*) I'd probably take this route and seek out RPers who are playing advanced classes as their main class. There's not really a shortage of them, so much as people who are actually RPing anything to do with a class and not a merchant or a dancer or a general mercenary.

While on one hand I don't see everyone as being a novice at everything unless they're rather young and naive, on the other hand I always get a nice sense of validation and development by starting out with a young or otherwise inexperienced character and finding others to help me develop throughout the course of the game rather than coming in, on like Sio, and feeling obligated to at least get to a level where I -am- a Paladin, in some form of Paladin gear before I start strutting around and calling myself one.

My main downfall is that I wrote waaaaay too much about her. She's extremely detailed for one of my characters.

@ Iseldia: 'While I don't normally want to be a "sparkly magic special person" I will still be making her a White Mage at some point, regardless of how restricted and rare they are "supposed" to be.'

I hope I didn't put the thought in your head that you have to be or not be super, special, or sparkly. I mean, obviously I didn't because you're going to do it, but I've said before and I'll say again-- Don't let the lore-fanatics tell you what to do. The lore is great, it's enjoyable, it's helpful, but what it's -not- is refined. As many pitfalls as we find in the lore and as many dead ends as there are, not completely covering all there is that we want to know, this isn't a game like WoW where you get definitive answers for any tiny questions anyone might have. People are forced to resort to using the skeleton of lore that we've been offered to -try- and disprove or validate ideas but most often we resort to real life and what we know and relating past experiences from reality or other games to this one. It doesn't always work out well.

So I'm glad you're choosing to do one, knowing full well how rare they may (or may not, considering how many I've seen so far) be. No one should let the opinions of others scare them out of doing what they want to do and finding the most logical course of action for it.

FreelanceWizard · **09-09-2013, 12:40 PM**

(09-09-2013, 09:11 AM)Devin Farraday Wrote: Though that raises a whole 'nother can of worms, when one wonders whether Scholars are exclusively from Nym? It seems like any place that has access to Arcanima and Conjury would be able to pull it off, but the background lore goes into rather exhaustive detail about Nym. Which, from what I can understand, is still around and not an Imperial territory...Â

One of the complications you may have unintentionally raised here is that the lore of the actual job quest line doesn't always line up with the lore on the site. As others mentioned, there's a lot of "a long time ago" or "in ages past" in the main site lore; that tells me that while, yes, the Scholar came into being in Nym, how a current PC becomes one isn't necessarily "go to Nym and learn from the masters there." It's much how you needn't go to Japan to learn how to make sushi, or travel to Southern California to learn how to write software. Smile

All that said, the important thing is that you have a narrative conceit that's compatible with lore for how your character knows what he knows. Learning the ways of a Scholar from a current Garlean, for example, wouldn't be lore-compatible due the Garleans' well-known ineptitude with magic (at the very least). Learning it from a traveling mystic, however, would be, as would be a "genericized" version of the actual SCH quest.

Cota Orben · **09-09-2013, 05:27 PM**

I'd sort of addressed the ineptitude already; my character, and his friend, are both from occupied territories. They're not of significant rank within the army, in fact their main goal is to serve as more or less bounty hunters. The current RP hook I've worked out with -another- mutual friend is that they're trying to hunt her character down because she's a member of an influential family who fled to avoid submitting to brainwashing.Â

Which is how this character can do Arcanima in the first place. I'd played around with the idea of having him be a Thaumaturge, then nixed it because my friend's going to be one, who used some sort of Magitek device to simulate Thamaturgy, but I don't think the same logic would work for Arcanima. So no pure blooded Garlean heritage.Â

((And to be quite honest, from a completely OOC standpoint, I want to play a healer/support person. I like the idea of coordinating attacks with the DPS instead of trying to out-flash them, and the idea of a Lalafell tank is somewhat hilariously adorable))

Jove · **09-10-2013, 02:44 PM**

(09-08-2013, 10:42 AM)Siobhain Wrote:
(09-08-2013, 10:22 AM)Jove Wrote:
(09-08-2013, 09:48 AM)Siobhain Wrote: And I'm not sure what they did. Like I said, I'm thinking immortality. The only other thing I could imagine doing with White Magic is necromancy but I haven't seen any such thing relating to that so I doubt it even exists. I also imagine torturing people to death and rezzing them over and over again until they forfeit. That's a way to abuse dem White Mage powers!

It's interesting that you mention Necromancy, because you're right I haven't seen it mentioned any where either, but you only have to go to the Deepcroft to see the undead shambling about.

Restless spirits, trapped in a corporeal form maybe, but it seems likely they were raised by Cthulhu's son and his cultists, which makes me wonder if corrupted white magic was used to raise these dead. After all, healers can use the raise spell on the almost dead, so what happens if a particularly powerful mage forces it on the long dead?
Is it possible that white magic becomes corrupted when used for unnatural purposes? I could easily see the corrupted white mages of old drawing on the aether to extend their physical life, or to bring loved ones back from the dead, like you say.

(Torture is also a good suggestion! Fling a man with Aero, break his bones every time he's smashed against the wall while slinging cures at him. Gruesome)

I didn't realize that there were undead about! I haven't gotten far enough in. So yes, very likely, that could be connected too! Interesting...

They gave a dark side to those chubby little Lalafell with their white robes on.

(I can see you and I are going to get along.)

Oh yes, you can find them in Thanalan too! Where you go to face a certain Primal for the first time. Probably a few other places, but I need to level up also so I can go exploring. After all, Logan is the sort to seek out ancient ruins and recover long forgotten trea-archaeological relics, so he'll probably encounter these kinds of things fairly often.

Also Lalafell are always sinister. Always.

(A friendship forged by the abuse of arcane arts, necromancy and torture. Awesome Moogle

)

(09-08-2013, 02:44 PM)LiadansWhisper Wrote: Raya-O-Senna tells you that Succor (White Magic) is every bit as destructive as Black Magic when it's misused.

However, I don't think it has anything to do with Necromancy or raising the long dead. Â There's nothing about the spell Raise or the lore surrounding it (via the Conjurer questline) to suggest that it's more than something that brings you back from the brink of death. Â I honestly don't believe that it would work on something that was actually dead.

E-Sumi-Yan tells you that Conjurers draw upon the power of the elements and nature for their abilities. Â Apparently Conjurers access a part of Succor, but are restricted by the Elementals. Â White Mages can access the full power of Succor.

E-Sumi also tells you that the power Conjurers draw upon cannot be taken, only borrowed, and must be returned. Â Others have speculated (in other threads) that the power the Conjurers are drawing from is the Aether streams, though they know it by another name. Â If we follow that line of speculation, then White Mages would be drawing even harder on that same power source.

This is a very interesting point, and reminds me of an FF staple that I completely forgot about.

White magic is super effective on the undead, in previous games, cure would do a decent amount of damage and a phoenix down (a potion that revives party members) would in most cases kill them outright.
I haven't seen any evidence to suggest that this staple is in FFXIV, but it's a pretty consistent theme throughout the game, along with the magic which you can read about here.

There's not really much lore for it though, they're just another form of monster, although in FFVII you encounter a group of vengeful spirits who didn't merge back into the lifestream when they died, which is more or less how a lot of general fantasy zombies and ghosts are created.
But this does make me think in regards to what LiadansWhisper said above, it makes me think that Conjurers and White Mages have to maintain a balancing act of receiving and giving back to the aether, which doesn't take much speculation to see why white magic would be so powerful against the undead, because the undead seem to be in direct conflict with maintaining the aether (all take, take, take and no giving back).
Of course that's assuming the undead are inhabited by souls from the aether and not just a kind of puppet. Also there's nothing in FFXIV to support any of this, including game mechanics... but I find this whole concept pretty interesting to think about.

However it throws the whole necromancy thing out of the window, which begs more questions such as which field of magic could be responsible for that, unless it's a naturally occurring event.

But hey the torture is still valid! I also think LiadansWhisper hit the nail on the head with the whole 'too many White Mages drawing on the aether would create a barren landscape' in regards to what harm white magic could do. It's easy to see a cataclysmic event arising from a whole nation of people constantly rejuvenated by white magicks only for the earth beneath them to die.

Which again, leads back to the whole "Can white magic prolong someone's life unnaturally?". If not, then that's the limitation of White Mages today, if yes, then we're going back into necromancy territory.

The reason I say today, is because I think it's important to take a history lesson here. Current White Mages from Gridania are not the same as the White Mages from 3000 years a go, during the Fifth Astral Era.

Quote:The Fifth Astral Era is said to have begun approximately three millennia ago. The ice age that ushered in the Fifth Umbral Era made the land a barren and merciless place, and man was pushed to the limits of his resourcefulness in the struggle to survive. Yet survive he did, through the discovery of magic as we know it - an event which marked the dawning of the Fifth Astral Era.

At first, man was well pleased just to keep the cold at bay and compete with the other races. But man is nothing if not an ambitious beast. It was not long before he sought mightier magicks, hoping to win greater glory. It was this desire that brought forth black magic, the arcane art of destruction, into the world. In order that this force of chaos be kept in check and balance preserved, at roughly the same point in history, white magic, the arcane art of succor, came into existence.

Emboldened by magic, man went on to reach the zenith of glory. But his hunger knew no bounds. Over time, even they who donned the white began perverting their powers for the sake of self-gain, and in this single minded pursuit scrupled not to sully the sanctity of the Twelveswood. In his pride and avarice, man brought down the wrath of the Elementals upon himself. A great deluge was sent to cleanse the land of his wicked presence, in the wake of which the forest rose to swallow up all that was not washed away. Thus did the Sixth Umbral Era begin.

This is my theory. Current White Mages trained by the Padjal are given their power through the Elementals, it's the Elementals that keep them in check so a White Mage can't abuse their power. What kind of powers? No one actually knows, except beings that have been around for thousands of years (such as the Elementals and other ancient beings).
I'm thinking though, that before white magic was regulated, back 3000 years a go, when White Mages would just draw their power recklessly from the aether, things such as necromancy, prolonging life, preventing souls from going back to the aether etc were possible. The spells and the knowledge of this however have been lost to time, except to a few.

This is why White Mages don't have this kind of power now (e.g Raise only working on the still living), the Elementals would never allow it, even hint of it's existence because they full well know the devastation it causes. However, ancient and dark beings (such as the summoned Cthulhu faced cultist) know of these powers and actively use them, which gets us his undead guards.

It's the same as the difference between modern Scholars and the Scholars from Nym, the modern day examples are similar, but different from their origins.

(Sorry for the convoluted wall of text, but I've been reading up on this as I was writing this post and this is pretty much my thought process.

And yeah, reading it now I feel like conspiracy theorist - Those Elementals, hiding dem truths!)

Anyway, to go back on topic (sorry OP) I think Scholar is a good choice! You've got a book to write down all of those bounty contracts and a fairy, which will put people off guard.

As for being a Garlean, I think you shouldn't have any trouble there. It's not unreasonable for Garlemalde to have families that emigrated there long before the Empire and hell, it's only most pure blooded Garleans that have an ineptitude for magic, so even if you had a little Garlean blood in you, it doesn't completely rule out magic.

Also I'm pretty certain it's only conscripts from conquered lands that have a sort of brainwashing happen to them (although I don't know what kind of brainwashing, or even if that's the right word, it could just be an onslaught of patriotic propaganda) and I believe it was only Nael van Darnus that introduced his men of the VIIth Legion to slaughtering an animal each day (because to be totally honest, 75000ish animals being slaughtered each day seems a bit ridiculous, and it was probably just Nael's front line troops).

I know you didn't mention the above, but they get thrown out a lot when Garlean lore comes up and personally, I think of Garlemalde being made up by your average none evil citizens. I mean just imagine, you live in a backwards country that suddenly is boosted by all of these technological advancements, lives become less of a hardship, there's industry, growth, a sense of purpose. Of course they'd elect the man who made it all happen and of course they'd rally behind him if he said Primals were evil (big scary monsters, of course he's right!) and that other nations are holding Garlemalde back, or that we need the space or need to enlighten them (we have magitek, we're the best!).
My only advice for RPing a Garlean is maybe to be subtle about it, even a Garlean citizen with no military background would probably be a target for a lynch mob in some parts of Eorzea and I'm certain they'd know it.

Cota Orben · **09-10-2013, 06:01 PM**

Jove,Â

I'm sorry to respond to only -one- bit of this amazing post (I'm framing it, I really am) but I read it at a bad time... as in, one foot out the door for a night class. My friend and I are, of course, going to be very subtle about things; only going after targets in full hoods and cloaks and masks, unless they're absolutely certain they can win.Â

As for the fairies, Selene's going to come in really handy with silencing their target, who's a mage.Â

I'd been sort of jumping between Summoner and Scholar for a bit, but your post clinched it. If Garleans think Primals are evil, even a deep cover one wouldn't summon an Egi. Hell, his best friend was nearly killed in the Calamity.

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Can Someone be a Self-Serving White Mage?

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