Hydaelyn Role-Players
The Stigma - Printable Version

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RE: The Stigma - Kieron Lohengrin - 12-18-2013

I have a simple personal rule when it comes to writing intimacy: I don't write anything I haven't actually experienced and done irl.

Which may be a bit odd, given that for all other situations we write about things like punching robots and riding giant yellow birds, but those are more fantastically escapist as opposed to the more personal escapism of intimate scenes.

Realism and plausibility has more weight and is key when it comes to writing physical or emotional intimacy, in tandem with being well-spoken and descriptive. You have the right to avoid genres/experiences you're uncomfortable with and dislike, but you risk limiting yourself as a writer. There's a broad spectrum of life experience out there, from the seedy to the inspirational.

Of course, the game's rules apply. Don't be publicly overt with language/actions that can be considered obscene and reported, that's just rude. There's plenty of skin and NPC innuendo on display in the game, so consider those your benchmark limit of what's allowable to describe in public chat.

As relations develop and it make story/plot sense for characters to become intimate, naturally, you can write that in the comfort and safe privacy of your own party/FC/LS. It is, like any other genre of RP, a collaborative process and a writing exercise.

Sometimes it turns out to be a collaboration between hyur and miqo'te, roegadyn and lalafell, goobbue and goobbue. Let's none of us judge. O:>

RE: The Stigma - Desmond Aryll - 12-18-2013

There is definitely a stigma on ERP. I am new to the whole RP in a game thing. I'd really only done RP on paper (written word only) and it is very apparent that ERP in all it's shapes and forms is frowned upon.

I believe being tasteless is bad and what is "bad" is subjective to each person. Personally I think jumping into a thread on a topic you don't care for specifically to say you don't like it is not polite at all. I would consider that more "bad" than R'mah's tongue in cheek post.

I use that post as an example since it was the impetus for this thread. Notice that the disagreement on the worthiness if the thread's existence/implications was really between only a handful of people altogether. Last I checked, the thread had over 1600 views in a handful of days. That means that topic itself IS interesting to many people on the RPC.

C'kayah's idea of having a reasoned discussion on ERP is valid. To those that don't care for ERP, that's perfectly alright and you do not need validation from those that do. The vice versa is also true.

There's no need to worry about RP's "reputation" amongst other players. We all know how eminently mature the internet is. They will find something to rail against and make fun of. Let's not worsen the problem by acting similarly.

Respect and tolerance.

RE: The Stigma - LandStander - 12-19-2013

(12-18-2013, 11:44 PM)Kieron Lohengrin Wrote: I have a simple personal rule when it comes to writing intimacy: I don't write anything I haven't actually experienced and done irl.

Let's play a game that I like to call "never have I ever" Tonberry

Edit: because I thought I would try to be constructive

On another note, I really don't care what people do. When I first started RPing last year in GW2 I joined a dark-themed guild because I was extremely curious (I still am, and I have currently found out how awesome GMing events is) about all sorts of different kinds of RP. Little did I know was that this certain guild was a widely known ERP guild. My second day, I got invited to our HQ for an "ERP party" and I had no idea what that was, and well...I found out lol.

There were people in the guild who only logged on to ERP and others who had stories that revolved outside of the setting. The people were really private and kept the chat in party, but some people still came out after them OOC and IC because of what the guild was based around which I thought was lame as most of the people there were nice and even took me in (a complete noob to the RP scene).

The funniest part of it all is that I would see some of these people on the forums who would speak out against ERP and yet they would see my characters guild tag and poke me for ERP when I didn't partake in the festivities xD.

If two adults want to talk about hoo-hahs and whatsits and as long as they are being mindful of others, then I am completely fine. Sometimes I get a little embarrassed typing out my character kissing someone (and not like typing out the details of an intimate kiss or anything) or having a romantic moment because I don't want people walking by, reading the chat log, and then rolling their eyes thinking I am trying to ERP in public.

RE: The Stigma - Qhora Bajihri - 12-19-2013

(12-18-2013, 05:07 PM)LiadansWhisper Wrote: I actually don't much care what someone is doing behind the computer screen (though, seriously, don't share that info with me, pls!).

Liadan, I have something to tell you.

(12-18-2013, 11:44 PM)Kieron Lohengrin Wrote: Sometimes it turns out to be a collaboration between hyur and miqo'te, roegadyn and lalafell, goobbue and goobbue. Let's none of us judge. O:>

I'm judging! Oh gods, how I'm judging! Oh wait, you didn't mean all six at once, did you?

I've long been of the 'play the character see where things go' camp, always keep tabs on your RP partners make sure you're not weirding them out. Many a year ago, I used only fade-to-black. Before that, back in the days when I swore I would never do anything so blush-worthy, I got labeled an ERPer anyway and harassed as such despite my protests and the part where I kept my distance from everything even slightly more heavy than PG.

So... at some point, I stopped giving a crap. I do whatever I want and generally just try not to offend people. I get embarrassed walking past people making out on park benches in real life, so I try to keep similar situations out of sight of poor other gamers.

Back in the last game I played, I decided to do something new and play a straight up, shall we say, courtesan. I had intended her to be kind of a joke, but she ended up being one of the most interesting characters I've played and, curiously, strongly monogamous, which made her very, very bad at her day job.

Just to say, ehhh, people who get their panties in a twist about panties should probably take a day off. And people who troll ERPers are just like any other brand of trolls and should be dealt with the same way, however you choose to do so. Not feeding them is the standard advice. We're here to have fun. Try not to stomp on other people's fun (whether that's by avoiding flashing strangers or avoiding throwing rocks at people holding hands, same concept) and get back playing?

RE: The Stigma - LiadansWhisper - 12-19-2013

(12-19-2013, 03:36 AM)Darien Cadell Wrote:
(12-18-2013, 05:07 PM)LiadansWhisper Wrote: I actually don't much care what someone is doing behind the computer screen (though, seriously, don't share that info with me, pls!).

Liadan, I have something to tell you.

[Image: 205813d1300740640-led-under-glow-led-str...400049.jpg]

Quote:Just to say, ehhh, people who get their panties in a twist about panties should probably take a day off. And people who troll ERPers are just like any other brand of trolls and should be dealt with the same way, however you choose to do so. Not feeding them is the standard advice. We're here to have fun. Try not to stomp on other people's fun (whether that's by avoiding flashing strangers or avoiding throwing rocks at people holding hands, same concept) and get back playing?

HeartHeartHeartHeartHeart

RE: The Stigma - Talathar Khalynn - 12-19-2013

Hi, I'm Tala, and I'm a roleplayer. I've been a roleplayer, in various forms, for more than half my life (about 25 years or so now, I think). So yes, I'm old, and perhaps have a little bit of an old fogy's perspective.

Part of the "stigma" I think does come from those who only want to "roleplay" solely in order to exchange illicit messages with another human being for the purposes of sexual stimulation and gratification. I think the label "cybering" does fit better for this kind of thing, rather than ERP.

There's also a bit of defensiveness for some RPers, who have had to explain to the average gamer what exactly roleplaying means in an MMORPG, and why anyone would bother doing that in a game anyway, aren't there chat rooms for that kind of thing?

*sighs at remembered frustration*

Anyway...

For me personally, I don't ERP, because I prefer not to. Not in my comfort zone. But I also have no problem with those who do ERP in game. I don't judge -- to each their own. And as a writer, I understand that grown-up characters will have grown-up relationships, and there will be grown-up activities that they may engage in. And so long as there are consenting grown-ups on both sides of the screen engaging in these private exchanges, I have no problem with it.

I do, however, have a problem with people purposely engaging in sexual "acts" in public, be it with in-game emotes, text emotes, or /say. There are minors playing the game, and they don't need to be exposed to that. Heck, *I* don't need to see it, either.

PG-13 in public, please. You wanna go NC-17, please take it to a private venue. Much thanks.

(Occasional mistells, however -- those are just entertaining. TongueP)

RE: The Stigma - ArmachiA - 12-19-2013

(12-19-2013, 12:33 AM)LandStander Wrote: Sometimes I get a little embarrassed typing out my character kissing someone (and not like typing out the details of an intimate kiss or anything) or having a romantic moment because I don't want people walking by, reading the chat log, and then rolling their eyes thinking I am trying to ERP in public.

I hate this so much XD. I know I shouldn't feel bad in my characters RP "boyfriends" kiss them on the lips in public, even if it's a long - not particularly tongue-y one - but I DO. I'm always worried people are going run by and be like "They be ERPin"

Armi taught her current beau how to dance off in a corner somewhere and in the scene they had to get close to do that but even PUSHING OUR CHARACTERS TOGETHER for it made me worried we would be seen as ERPING - even though the scene was in /say and it was clearly a dance lesson.

Armi's house is in Ul'dah and a lot of the time if someone comes over we'll just to go the Weaver's guild, head into /party and pretend we're in her house. I've taken a few people there and I always wonder if people think Armi is just ERPin with all of them, because EVEN I - when I see two characters together in party clearly saying stuff I can't see - go to the ERP place. "OH well those two be ERPin" *Cackled and walks off*.

At the end of the day though, I just can't be arsed to care that much. I obviously like RP or I wouldn't be doing it. I love RP, all of it. The dramatic, the violent, the sexy, the romantic, the hilarious. It's all pretty great.

Honestly, I'm way worse OOCly than I am ever ICly. I'm a horrible flirt and a terrible pervert. I feel bad for anyone who talks to me on the regular Tongue

RE: The Stigma - No Longer Exists - 12-19-2013

Ladies and Gentlespoons!

I love this thread, thank you, C'Kayah!

Think about the social dynamics, folks. We've all admitted that sex is a definitive motivator to many goals IRL and that transfers over to RP. RP mimics a "life", after all. Also remember though what happens when sex is put on the social table. Women become sluts. Men become cocks (prancing, I mean.) Just like some have said about worrying that passerbys will say "ZOMG, they're ERPing!" is the same social concern as doing your girlfriend or boyfriend in a public bathroom. It's just gotten out of hand cause we've all had to face it instead of socially avoid it. Your friends can look the other way and politely ignore the disheveled clothing, the afterglow, and the tousled hair.....but what if they didn't and all went "OOOoooooOOOooOOOOoooooOOOoo!" when you two walked out of the loo?

And that's what it is, social avoidance. If our inside voices were on the outside IRL, everyone would be terrified of getting near each other out of fear of stigmatism. Imagine, if you will, knowing that a move or choice you make can and will be publicly scrutinized by a forum of your peers. Scary thought unless you're part of the few who stand up and say "I regret nothing". 

It's been established that ERP isn't wrong or right, it's a choice. Demonizing it isn't particularly -fair-, but that is also a choice. Advertising for it? That's buckshot full of rocksalt, it may not hit everyone but those it stings are gonna be pretty annoyed. 

R'mah insinuated that it was for ERP then tried to take it back, bad form ol' girl. Own it and move on. I openly expressed issue with it when she broadcasted to our FC (at the time, I'm no longer with the harbingers) for miqo'te women to "entertain" a nunh too. To me, it's just crude. That's my opinion though.

So is there a fix? Nope. The cat is out of the bag already and she ain't going back in, so to speak. Unless folks let go, respect each other, and just chillax? We'll have this conversation again soon enough.

- Black Hat

RE: The Stigma - ansemaru - 12-23-2013

I don't ERP. I haven't ERPed before in my life, and frankly, I'm not terribly interested in it. I know people who do ERP, and I also know people who wouldn't touch it with a ten-foot pole, and I respect both categories equally. I want to see both sides feeling comfortable and happy with their situation in regards to RP on their server. So following some fairly simple guidelines for privacy as it is allowed by the game should neither be hard nor objectionable to anybody, right?

It's straightforward. Keep it out of public spaces/channels. /tell or /party are your friend, unless you've got an IC, ERP-friendly linkshell or free company to do it in. I find it unlikely that you do, but, well. Stranger things yet have to be seen. And if you're going to be getting characters undressed and up close and personal for the sake of it, there are private corners of the game's world where it's less likely you'll be stumbled upon by random adventurers. FC housing, once that is within your FC's price range. Spots like the Hermit's Hovel in Outer La Noscea- hot springs like Camp Bronze Lake, but without being an aetheryte/quest hub. The southern reaches of the Sagolii Desert- unless someone's going there to get a Cactuar Cutting minion, ain't nobody going to bother with that wilderness. Lots of spots and corners of Coerthas where the FATEs don't go. Some of the outer regions of Black Brush- there are buildings off to the side unrelated to the materia questline which are pretty much always empty. The Sanctum of the Twelve, if you're feeling sacrilegious. If you bother to look around the game world, there are many, many secluded spaces where you can do whatever you damn well want to without anybody intruding because they've got a quest or a FATE. Of course, you should still consider keeping it to a private channel, and think about moving if someone "walks in" on you.

It's not a question of morality or whether it's the right thing to do, RP-wise. Some people want to get their rocks off. Some people have characters in a relationship and they want to portray that bond. Sometimes it's a bit of both. I get it. The issue at hand is honestly the comfort level of others. Not everyone playing this game is over 18. Not everyone playing this game is comfortable seeing characters engaging in what is, textually, public space. Or hearing them do it. Some people have moral objections to ERP, and while I think they're ridiculous, it might behoove you to conduct your RP somewhere where they can't overhear, so they won't raise a fuss about it. Keep it private, and nobody has anything to complain about. And yeah, it's tacky to advertise for it in a public channel. This includes general RP forums. Be discreet. And don't drag someone into it if they don't have any interest in it.

RE: The Stigma - ArmachiA - 12-23-2013

(12-23-2013, 12:36 PM)ansemaru Wrote: Spots like the Hermit's Hovel in Outer La Noscea- hot springs like Camp Bronze Lake, but without being an aetheryte/quest hub.

Weird you bring this up! Yesterday my guild member (Lum, hi) had an event there about field medic training and after it was over some of us decided to just stick around because the zone was pretty. Eventually, it was just Armi and Armi's boyfriend hanging out inside the building and looking at the books and being cute with each other.
Two people were hanging on the roof and they ask "Be honest are you ERPING?" (Since we were talking in /party)

TURNS OUT that's a well known ERP spot and people go to watch other people do that stuff.

I was wondering why so many people showed up in groups up two, saw the medic thing and left.

I wouldn't go there! Not unless you want to watch all the antics. Which I do, now.

Lum is no longer allowed to pick locations. Cactuar

RE: The Stigma - ansemaru - 12-23-2013

Ah, looks like people were way ahead of my suggestions on this one. Desire and/or necessity breeds innovation, or something like that.

Good to know for the future, I guess. My Free Company has held meetings in some of those spots, and I'm sure we've driven off our fair share of ERPers by doing so.

RE: The Stigma - Raeletta - 12-24-2013

Never seen any myself, but I don't see anything at all wrong with it, assuming it's not in the middle of a city in open channels. and that's mainly because it's unrealistic, even for a game. Tongue  Out in the countryside somewhere, go for it. Could be interesting to stumble across.

Plus, sex is a part of life, why would you not RP it? I don't see the ick factor, but I don't really get bothered by all that much, only bored or interested.

[edit]

Plus, for my country, age of consent is 16, same as the games PEGI rating. The censoring idea isn't really applicable to me. (Though, I'd be interested to know if anatomy words are censored. First thing I did was nuke the filter, I hate them.)

RE: The Stigma - Lost River - 12-24-2013

Great post.

For me, I personally don't care what people have done or do. Roleplay is roleplay to me, be it a deeply intrigued plot about unmasking the coffee cake thief to that of a tussle in the sheets with a twin just to find out it was their sister/brother instead! (okay to many soaps).

I personally don't mind either of the sort of RP, but never try to force either on people who don't want it. As well, the adult sort of roleplay should be kept in Party/Tell or such due to the game is T rated (borderline M due to it's content) and that sort of conduct isn't allowed publicly. It isn't like Second Life, for example, who has Adult Sims and such; in short, consenting adults, have a blast; just be mindful.

RE: The Stigma - Ildur - 12-24-2013

(12-24-2013, 10:49 AM)Raeletta Wrote: Plus, sex is a part of life, why would you not RP it?

Going to the bathroom is also a part of life. Yet nobody roleplays that. Why? Because the specifics of going to the bathroom (or sex, for that matter) don't add anything to the story or your character.
I have personally never found any reason to have explicit sex scenes because whatever they would tell about the story or characters is always better conveyed by other means. But not everyone shares my findings (or lack of them).

As everyone and their grandma has said: if you are going to do something that has high chances of bothering people, you should keep it on a private channel.

RE: The Stigma - Naunet - 12-24-2013

(12-24-2013, 10:49 AM)Raeletta Wrote: Plus, sex is a part of life, why would you not RP it?

Maybe because we feel that sex is a private thing, and we don't want to engage in it with people not our significant other, even if it's only in words?

ERP all ya want, but don't go judging the folk who decline as though they're not RPing to the fullest.