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+--- Thread: General Lore Questions (/showthread.php?tid=4766)
RE: General Lore Questions - Valence - 07-31-2017
I don't think there is any definite and specific lore on that (maybe hidden in some quest tidbits?), but the way I see it obviously is that from an OOC development standpoint, they weren't going to model cities the size of all the wards combined together with unique plots for every house. I mean, you even have subwards that are the same as their parent ward but with a 90° rotation so... yeah, it's instanced.
I see it like the Goblet for example having 12 wards (it was 8 before), being just a city with 12 districts inside. Since it was specifically created for adventurers (like all housing areas), it's not that dissimilar to IRL modern suburbs where all the plots more or less follow the same patterns.
RE: General Lore Questions - Arashin Kujqai - 07-31-2017
(07-31-2017, 03:33 AM)Valence Wrote: I don't think there is any definite and specific lore on that (maybe hidden in some quest tidbits?), but the way I see it obviously is that from an OOC development standpoint, they weren't going to model cities the size of all the wards combined together with unique plots for every house. I mean, you even have subwards that are the same as their parent ward but with a 90° rotation so... yeah, it's instanced.Oh it was? I thought Goblet was just the general housing area, not just for adventurers lol. That's how I see it too, though I do wish it was all one map like Aion's housing had it <3.
I see it like the Goblet for example having 12 wards (it was 8 before), being just a city with 12 districts inside. Since it was specifically created for adventurers (like all housing areas), it's not that dissimilar to IRL modern suburbs where all the plots more or less follow the same patterns.
RE: General Lore Questions - Sounsyy - 07-31-2017
(07-31-2017, 06:19 PM)Valic Wrote: Oh it was? I thought Goblet was just the general housing area, not just for adventurers lol.
All of the Residential Districts in game are for Adventurers only, per the lore. And they're all more or less relatively recent constructions compared to their attached city-states. So residents actually do all have their own residential districts inside the city, but they're in areas that we don't have access to for the most part.
Imme Wrote:Have you heard the news about the Goblet? All that quality land, so desperately coveted, is to be auctioned off to bidders, regardless of their origins! Even adventurers have the right to participate. Just imagine─the entire area could end up owned by wealthy foreign─ Ah, beg your pardon, miss. It isn't that I dislike adventurers, far from it. But when you consider that Ul'dah is still struggling to accommodate countless refugees, the idea that this land is being sold for profit is...not surprising whatsoever, come to think of it. Still, the least they could do is give preferential treatment to hardworking Ul'dahns like me! I've been saving for years, just waiting for an opportunity like this to come along!
Momoraji Wrote:Aye, 'tis true─in an effort to encourage immigration to our great nation, all lands within the Goblet are to be set aside for adventurers like yourself. Tragic, some might say, that only adventurers will be permitted to settle within its wards. But such decisions were made by men wiser than I.
Goblet Guide Wrote:Beg your pardon? An Ul'dahn woman asked you to learn more about the auctions? Oh dear. As you may have heard, these plots are reserved exclusively for adventurers. Since your friend is an Ul'dahn citizen, she is ineligible to participate.
And all of the residential areas are like this, even Shirogane. Though Shirogane is strictly for "foreigners" instead of "adventurers" like the Eorzean residential districts.
Tsurubami Wrote:You see, word has it the lord bugyo of Kugane has established a new residential district especially for foreigners. Having long dreamed of a home to call my own, I couldn't help but find myself wanting to know more. I would like very much to see the district for myself, but as I am not a foreigner, I fear I would be turned back before all and sundry. The embarrassment would be too much to bear.
District Official Wrote:Ever since Kugane opened its arms to the world, the number of visitors continues to grow. And among those who come, no few remain here for extended periods. Such lodgings as are available in the city no longer suffice to meet demand. In order to address the accommodation shortage, the lord bugyo has established a residential district upon the nearby isle of Shirogane. Plots of land on the isle are being released exclusively to foreigners, who may build homes upon them as they see fit. A tidy solution, I'm sure you will agree.
Like I said though, this isn't truly a huge issue for most Eorzean residents (Ul'dah and its refuge population being an exception), as there are residential districts within the city-states themselves.
Kokobi Wrote:The Fronds? Look no further–you’re in them friend. The richest of the rich live here, counting the gil in their mansions on Emerald Avenue and Ruby Road. It is also home to some of Ul'dah’s greatest architectural feats, and is located directly below the royal palace. There’s water to be had, and even plants to be seen. Quite lovely, actually.
The Dunes, is it? Yes, well, it is the common area of the common folk, and lies just beyond here. There you will find both the Merchants Ward, compromised of the homes and workshops of both crafters and merchants, and the Market Rows, where peddlers and traders gather to sell their wares. The Merchants Ward lies on the far side of the Dunes, and serves primarily as a residential district for both craftsmen and traders. There are educational and religious centers, as well. Aye, its quite a bustling little area, and has a charm to it. The market rows lie on the near side of the Dunes, and are host to the most lively bunch of shops and bazaars you’re like to find in Eorzea. It is the only place you need visit if you have a mind to spend your gil─well, there and the pillowhouses, of course.
RE: General Lore Questions - Arashin Kujqai - 07-31-2017
Thanks <3
Also, has here ever been a device or item in the game that would inhibit or render someone's aether/spells useless? Not like a silence spell in particular but something that could induce the effect of silence or perhaps just limit use of aether? Like a physical item or potion or etc?
Also, side note that's probably dumb... Assuming the animations we go by with potions where we just flick our arms and sparkles go everywhere... Are potions just something you an sprinkle on yourself to apply the effect/healing? Or just lazy animating for the idea of drinking a potion physically? Or can you do both?
RE: General Lore Questions - Sounsyy - 07-31-2017
(07-31-2017, 11:04 PM)Valic Wrote: Also, has here ever been a device or item in the game that would inhibit or render someone's aether/spells useless? Not like a silence spell in particular but something that could induce the effect of silence or perhaps just limit use of aether? Like a physical item or potion or etc?
Sure! There's items, ingredients, and alchemical potions that could do that.
Blowfish Wrote:A saltwater fish that, when provoked, blows up to three times its normal size to intimidate the would-be attacker. It is also known to have an organ which contains a potent silencing poison.
Tarantula Wrote:A deadly forest spider from whose venom can be extracted a potent silencing poison.
Silencing Potion Wrote:A concoction which induces temporary loss of voice.
Though just as there are materials and soft metals which can amplify aetherial conductivity, there are also materials which can dampen its affects. Many of these are developed by Garlemald, but similar techniques exist elsewhere - such as those once employed by the Duskwights of Gelmorra.
Encyclopedia Eorzea Wrote:Garlean uniforms are made from revolutionary materials, such as carbon fiber and cermet alloys. The armor of Garlean officers is particularly ingenious, as it is coated with a substance that decreases aetherial conductivity, and therefor protects the wearer from magic attacks. The selfsame contrivance prevents the use of offensive spells, yet this hampers the pureblood Garleans little.
Gilded Magitek Armor Mount Wrote:It only took a few heated skirmishes with the allied city-states for Garlemald to realize that the magicks wielded by the realm's mages were too much for even the thickest of magitek armor plating. Alloyed gilding has since been discovered to dampen the effects of elemental charges and is now standard issue.
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As for the potion animation... I wouldn't put so much stock in it. Splashing a potion on yourself would be a highly ineffective way of administering poison or medicine. Not to mention a waste of whatever excess drips off or just hits the floor.
Though strictly speaking from a medical standpoint, the body can absorb medicine through the skin, given relatively prolonged exposure/contact. Administering a poison in this manner would be feasible if it was fast acting, though again, it's still not the most effective way of poisoning someone, versus needles, ingestion, spells, etc where the dose and concentration needed to affect the body can be ensured.
In short, you're gonna want to be ingesting these potions. Save absorption through skin for patches, poultices, or bandages.
RE: General Lore Questions - Arashin Kujqai - 08-01-2017
(07-31-2017, 11:45 PM)Sounsyy Wrote: *snip*
Interesting... So while we have defensive plating/armor/material that can to a degree block or reduce the effects of spells or aether... How about a physical item like a gem or crystallized aether that would apply these effects? Anything of physical/solid nature really or something that would stop a person from casting teleport?
I'm trying to avoid detail as to giving away potential plot for an RP colleague of mine; say you needed an item to covertly prevent someone from casting or disappearing on you, without them noticing the item was preventing this in the first place. Like slipping a stone or slip of paper into their pocket or something that was draining or preventing their casts rather than a liquid/potion?
RE: General Lore Questions - Valence - 08-01-2017
Bearing that the lore usually primarily features artifacts and stuff that actually tremendously enhances, gathers or multiply aether (like Seal Rock's Horn stolen by Stahlmann/Travanchet, or Tupsimati, etc) rather than the opposite (especially since all life is aether, so removing it is basically killing stuff), but it doesn't mean such things don't exist though I have nothing special that comes to mind right now. I think you can be creative through different means.
I know it's an easy copt out way of doing things but the Void is often a good way to create many afflictions since most voidsent or void created artifacts directly consume, or suck on aether like nothing. Basically, Void stuff is a very convenient way of messing with magicks.
We know that the Void Mages of Mhach used to seal their summons through poweful magicks of control, akin to bindings. Allagans do the same with the elder primal Bahamut inside Dalamud. Omega does the same to Shinryu with menacles. So it's within the realm of possibilities to prevent things to move, use their magicks, or anything, though artifacts of various kinds. I don't know of anything subtle enough for that though, but why not? I mean, something able to just disturb specific magic waves like a teleport doesn't sound too stretched to me.
If it was a full magical barrier preventing or even nullying magic under its radius, you would bet that garleans would use such a portable, innocuous marvel. Most of those powerful barriers or forcefields we have seen so far are generally created by bulky and static generators (Magitek forcefields or Allagan impregnable barriers like around Crystal Tower or Azys Lla), and I don't recall anything specific just annhilating magic inside a certain radius.
But something just messing with specific magics? I don't see why not. The RDM quest also seems to introduce the concept of runes that can mess with people to the point of controlling them as puppets. Magical seals or at least magical inhibitors of various kinds as a concept, are thing.
Might need more sources to investigate on that, I'm mostly speculating through indirect means here.
Edit: now that I think of it, another approach could be through aspected crystals, that tend to disturb highly the aetherial composition of everything they touch.
RE: General Lore Questions - Arashin Kujqai - 08-01-2017
(08-01-2017, 06:46 AM)Valence Wrote: *snip*@the Edit, permanantly? And does that include a person rather than just common objects and metals used in crafting?
Edit: now that I think of it, another approach could be through aspected crystals, that tend to disturb highly the aetherial composition of everything they touch.
RE: General Lore Questions - Sounsyy - 08-01-2017
(08-01-2017, 12:33 AM)Valic Wrote: Interesting... So while we have defensive plating/armor/material that can to a degree block or reduce the effects of spells or aether... How about a physical item like a gem or crystallized aether that would apply these effects? Anything of physical/solid nature really or something that would stop a person from casting teleport?
Ummmmmmm, the closest thing that comes to mind (besides the aforementioned items in the last post) would be amber. While not a true gemstone, it is most often worn to enhance one's earthly energies. However, raw amber can be used to dispel enchantments and incantations. It's not exactly what you're looking for, but you're getting into territory where you'll probably need to handwave a few things anyways?
Maerwynn Wrote:Oh, and do remember to rub the soulstone against a sufficiently large concentration of amber, say, amberscale Rock in the Central Shroud. Short of petitioning a mage versed in golem magicks, that is the only way I know to dispel the enchantments woven into a true heart. Eh? Why are you looking at me like that? I had relations with a thaumaturge once, if you must know.
Though, if the goal is ultimately stopping someone from teleporting, there's really a variety of methods given the complicated nature of how teleporting works in the first place. This post goes into a bit more detail on some of the dangers of teleportation under duress and why it'd likely be infeasible to attempt teleportation in any unsafe situation.
In short:
1- A person must be taught how to teleport. It's a learned skill/spell.
2- The person must have sufficient spiritual energy (anima) to teleport. The greater the distance, the more anima expended.
3- A person's aether and anima can be adversely affected by poor health, duress, fatigue, etc.
4- Teleportation and Return require lengthy incantations and intense, uninterrupted meditation.
5- Botching a teleport incantation or teleporting while fatigued (low anima) can prove fatal.
Encyclopedia Eorzea Wrote:It can be assumed that a young man of sound mind and body will possess a high concentration of aetherial energy in his humours, whereas an older man, or one inflicted with corruption, will not. Some scholars have expanded upon this hypothesis saying that the consumption of food serves not only to fill the belly, but to provide the body with aether lost through exertion.
That said, unless both parties in the RP are aware of these limitations or are roleplaying so strictly by the lore, than the above is kind of moot and having an additional, physical deterrent is good to have on standby while DMing. So for this, I'd point you to the suggestions above: amber, magitek dampening field generator, lacing food or drink with a potent silencing potion, etc. If all else fails, handwave! Make up an item or structure that produces the effects you need for the scene. The predecessors of the Red Mages figured out a way...
X'rhun Tia Wrote:Did I mention that it was our forebears in the art who constructed the Ziggurat? It was built to suppress the unstable weather that was whipped up in the wake of that era's Calamity─a sort of dampening weight that slowed the land's raging currents of aether to a trickle.
Valence's post also reminded me of 1.0 Toto-rak quest and that the magitek device seemed to have adverse affects on A-Ruhn and the moogles when they interacted with it, though the device itself was not specifically purposed to do such.
A-Ruhn-Senna Wrote:Oh, and here - you can have this. The moogles removed it from that magitek device there. I'd take it back with me, but it…it is so…heavy. I feel it weights me down…somehow. Take it, please. I cannot carry it a moment more. This is a strange thing indeed. The elementals tell me that it is attempting to measure the flow of aether through the Maws - though I cannot fathom why a magitek user should deem the stuff sufficiently interesting to warrant such an invention…
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(08-01-2017, 04:11 PM)Valic Wrote:(08-01-2017, 06:46 AM)Valence Wrote: *snip*@the Edit, permanantly? And does that include a person rather than just common objects and metals used in crafting?
Edit: now that I think of it, another approach could be through aspected crystals, that tend to disturb highly the aetherial composition of everything they touch.
I think Valence is referring to this passage from the lore book:
Encyclopedia Eorzea Wrote:When a living entity dies, the aether remaining will normally leave the body and return to the world's aetherial currents (also known as the Lifestream). When a living entity, however, experiences death-inducing trauma, such as a mortal wound in battle, the resulting sudden release of its most heavily-aspected life energy will oft times manifest corporeally before it can return to the Lifestream - a phenomenon we know as crystals. This can also occur when a wound is dealt to the very land itself, and is a reason why crystal deposits are found throughout the land.
The elemental aspect of the energy trapped in these crystals can be harnessed and used in a myriad of manners. Applying fire crystals to a forge can increase its internal temperature, assisting in the smelting of ore. The cooling properties of an ice crystal can assist a grocer in maintaining the freshness of meat or produce. That said, due to the extreme concentration of aspected aether within a crystal, direct consumption of a crystal by a living being can severely alter the aetherial balance within its body, ultimately resulting in severe injury or even death.
Though this is more heading in the direction of overloading the body with ambient or corrupted or over-aspected aether to the point of aether sickness.
RE: General Lore Questions - Arashin Kujqai - 08-01-2017
Hmm, ty for all the information <3. I think it'll give me enough to play with for a little bit. I can't imagine a person just taking a crystal and shoving it down their throat xD. I guess if anything, maybe potions like silencing potions can be taken in through smell/air into the body as a form of consumption. Gives me ideas I could go about, ty!
EDIT: Unrelated question to all of this... Do we have a form of RP dictionary that lists some specific terminology or words used in FF14's universe. Something to help a person create an accent that would sound like a member of the maelstrom or words used by ancient researchers etc? Or perhaps tribal terms/language etc?
RE: General Lore Questions - Valence - 08-02-2017
Most of the accents specifically tailored in the game that come to mind are mostly to my memory:
- Ye old english, "thou shalt blablabla", mostly used in old books, prophecies, or spoken by wyrms and dragons, and Urianger cause he's weird like that.
- Noble talk: not a proper accent with specific words per se, but generally very pompous and long winded. Formal and elevated.
- Commoner's talk: more or less the normal way of talking I would say. Can lean towards a more vulgar version when used by Brume people like Hilda (she swears a lot).
- Sailor's talk: mostly Lominsan. Explicit. You can find a hardcore version of it at the Rogues' guild, basically, the same patterns of speach but with a specific glossary of words like "cove" and whatnot.
- Hingan language: pretty normal (with very humble tones to it), and the occasional smattering of japanese specific words like "Ijin" (gaijin), etc. Unsure if it's the same for Domans as Hien doesn't seem to use anything specific.
- Sciencey talk: just add a lot of science words and a modern, scientific way of talking. Mostly used by Garlean engineers, or eorzean scientists or alchemists.
- Corporate talk: mostly heard from allagan nodes and all their science/modern corporate system. And also from Garlond's executive girl.
But yeah I don't know any dictionnary of sorts and honestly I don't think you would need one for most accents you have.Â
Swearing and curses could indeed make for a specific glossary since Eorzea actually has a lot of specific curses like "Thal's Balls", "Seven Hells", etc, for the most famous/common of them. They tend to transcend accents and classes.
You of course also have all the eorzean specific measures and units like the calendar (they forget here sennight and fortnight for the week and 14 days) and their non metric system.
I don't know of any Hingan dictionnary yet, but there was a thread compiling some of them around here...
RE: General Lore Questions - Yian Kutku - 08-02-2017
To add on a bit more trivia:
(08-02-2017, 03:57 AM)Valence Wrote: - Noble talk: not a proper accent with specific words per se, but generally very pompous and long winded. Formal and elevated.
I find it more or less a more "modernized" version of 17th to 18th century English; the most famous example I can think of is Samuel Pepys's diary. Using modern words like "has" instead of "hath", for instance, but the sentence structure and grammar is similar.
Oaths and swears tend to call upon the Twelve, but not go much farther than that. There seems to be a bit of bowdlerization.
Quote:- Commoner's talk: more or less the normal way of talking I would say. Can lean towards a more vulgar version when used by Brume people like Hilda (she swears a lot).
I notice a lot of dropping of the "g" in words ending in "-ing" and such (eg "hangin'", "bloomin'"), as well as "yer" and "ye" for "your" and "you". It kind of reminds me of the more non-London areas of the UK, and possibly some accents within London as well. The sort usually stereotyped in media as "low-class".
Oaths and swears are a lot more vulgar, including calling on various bodily parts of the Twelve.
Quote:- Sailor's talk: mostly Lominsan. Explicit. You can find a hardcore version of it at the Rogues' guild, basically, the same patterns of speach but with a specific glossary of words like "cove" and whatnot.
Lominsan has a lot of stereotypical pirate speak, ie West Country as performed by Robert Newton. Other than that, it bears a lot of similarity to the "Commoner's talk" mentioned above.
The Rogues' Guild slang is pretty much Thieves' Cant, watered down to be more comprehensible. You can find dictionaries of it online, or possibly in print. As with many languages, there are a zillion variations, so a term that isn't in one dictionary may be in another. The one I use is the 1811 dictionary by Francis Grose (available on Project Gutenberg, also amusingly slightly censored).
Like, I'm almost sure you can do a search-and-replace of Jacke's speech, and it will turn out to be fairly normal.
RE: General Lore Questions - Unnamed Mercenary - 08-02-2017
Also helpful: Encyclopedia of Canon Terms (last updated for Heavensward)
RE: General Lore Questions - Kilieit - 08-02-2017
(08-02-2017, 03:57 AM)Valence Wrote: You of course also have all the eorzean specific measures and units like the calendar (they forget here sennight and fortnight for the week and 14 days) and their non metric system.
It's worth noting that "fortnight" ("fourt(een) nights") in FFXIV actually refers to 16 days, because the week (referred to erroneously as "sennight", "se'en nights") is 8 days.
So... the words are etymologically wrong, but...
I think that's because while "octnight" is a bit weird-sounding but otherwise passable, "sexdecnight" wouldn't go down so well with the EN community. xD
Okay, that was a joke, because I don't think they're using those prefix schemes. But I do think it is just to do with how clumsy it would be to try and invent similar words for eight and sixteen nights. Better to use the recognisable words for 1/2 weeks and hope no one thinks about it too much.
(08-02-2017, 07:03 AM)Yian Kutku Wrote:Quote:- Sailor's talk: mostly Lominsan. Explicit. You can find a hardcore version of it at the Rogues' guild, basically, the same patterns of speach but with a specific glossary of words like "cove" and whatnot.
Lominsan has a lot of stereotypical pirate speak, ie West Country as performed by Robert Newton. Other than that, it bears a lot of similarity to the "Commoner's talk" mentioned above.
The Rogues' Guild slang is pretty much Thieves' Cant, watered down to be more comprehensible. You can find dictionaries of it online, or possibly in print. As with many languages, there are a zillion variations, so a term that isn't in one dictionary may be in another. The one I use is the 1811 dictionary by Francis Grose (available on Project Gutenberg, also amusingly slightly censored).
Like, I'm almost sure you can do a search-and-replace of Jacke's speech, and it will turn out to be fairly normal.
Seconding thieves' cant - they really did their research with Jacke and more or less everything he says is translatable using real-life dictionaries of thieves' cant from the time period FFXIV draws on (16th-18th century). I think this is an earlier edition of the dictionary you were referring to - A Classical Dictionary of the Vulgar Tongue (Grove, Francis), Third Edition, 1796? It's one of my favourite non-FFXIV-originated FFXIV resources. Definitely worth flicking through if you play a character who has cause to use Lominsan slang.
RE: General Lore Questions - Arashin Kujqai - 08-02-2017
I notice people will use words like "jest" instead of joke or kid around. As well as some common ones being naught and aught, if I had a gil for every time I heard "is aught amiss?". The spectrum for words stretches between old speak but also to more modern it seems.