Hydaelyn Role-Players
White Mage Lore - Printable Version

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RE: White Mage Lore - LiadansWhisper - 08-21-2015

Berrod, I replied the way I did because I'm on my phone and too lazy to get out of bed. It wasn't really to you specifically, more in response to the whole, "the elementals just made that shit up" and some previous comments.  I'd quote you again in response but that quote tree is murder. I'll try to edit out your post when I turn my computer on.

Also, lore stuff was percolating from a chat with Lore Kitty ™.

Edit: Me and my auto correct are going to have a Come-to-Jesus-Talk.


RE: White Mage Lore - Berrod Armstrong - 08-21-2015

(08-21-2015, 01:31 PM)LiadansWhisper Wrote: Berrod, I replied the way I did because I'm on my phone and too lazy to get out of bed. It wasn't really to you specifically, more in response to the whole, "the elementals just made that shit up" and some previous comments.  I'd quote you again in response but that quote tree I'd murder. I'll try to edit out your post when I turn my computer on.

Also, lore stuff was percolating from a chat with Lore Kitty ™.
Oh! Oh don't worry about it, there's no problem. I was just really unsure and seeking to clarify.


RE: White Mage Lore - Kage - 08-21-2015

(08-21-2015, 01:28 PM)Berrod Armstrong Wrote:
(08-21-2015, 01:20 PM)Kage Wrote: Curious, but how much of the white mage lore comes from in-game books/texts or word of mouth?
How much -could- be "deliberate misinformation" by the devs?
*Puts on tin foil hat* 

They're withholding information because of critical story points in the next expansion that features white magic and elementals. They elementals get mad and flood the world again.
Elementals just want the world as they see it. Controlling powerful magic and thought, one of the easiest ways to do so.

Koji Fox has already said that they've deliberately misinformed to make the world more realistic in a way. If all our information is through word of mouth, left mostly by the 'victors' the Elementals who want the world to continue in whatever image they want, is it possible?

It's just some things to think about. NPC word isn't infallible.


RE: White Mage Lore - LiadansWhisper - 08-21-2015

(08-21-2015, 01:20 PM)Kage Wrote: Curious, but how much of the white mage lore comes from in-game books/texts or word of mouth? It seems like a lot of it is more word of mouth (in context of the game) then say... established by something. For example the Lamia assumption from Sastash HM that is misinformation vs Lamia being examples of manufactured weapons by the Allagan.

How much -could- be "deliberate misinformation" by the devs?

It's possible, though these devs have less of a history of putting out contradictory lore than, say, Bethesda (in the Elder Scrolls world, pretty much everything you encounter is suspect because history is written by the victors, and they blatantly lie repeatedly).

But even texts themselves could be contradictory.  Consider the last set of the Hildebrand questline (I'm guessing you did it!).  History is written by the victors, even in Eorzea.


RE: White Mage Lore - LiadansWhisper - 08-21-2015

(08-21-2015, 01:41 PM)Kage Wrote: Elementals just want the world as they see it. Controlling powerful magic and thought, one of the easiest ways to do so.

Elementals just want their one little patch of land that was given to them by Nophica.  Seriously, that's all they care about.  If blowing up the rest of the world didn't impact their little forest, I'm not sure they'd give two shits.  They're withholding White Magic because the last time Mortals got a hold of it, they almost destroyed the world.  Again.  For like, the sixth time.

Quote:Koji Fox has already said that they've deliberately misinformed to make the world more realistic in a way. If all our information is through word of mouth, left mostly by the 'victors' the Elementals who want the world to continue in whatever image they want, is it possible?

It's just some things to think about. NPC word isn't infallible.

It's not infallible, but I'm not sure there's a case that the Elementals have ill/malicious intentions with regards to this.  The Elementals for sure want the world to continue, and they for sure think that Mortals are a problem that threatens the continuance of the world...but given the history of mortal man, can you really disagree with them?


RE: White Mage Lore - Kage - 08-21-2015

Are you an Elemental?

To say such things as 100% truth. How do you know their motivations?

The lore?

The lore given to us through word of mouth that stems from the Elementals?

Edit: What I'm positing is not "THIS MUST BE FALSE!!!! THIS IS HOW IT HAPPENED" but to have a fun discussion with the possibilities that we have been given and explore past what we have decided to "accept" as lore.


RE: White Mage Lore - LiadansWhisper - 08-21-2015

(08-21-2015, 01:58 PM)Kage Wrote: Are you an Elemental?

To say such things as 100% truth. How do you know their motivations?

The lore?

The lore given to us through word of mouth that stems from the Elementals?

Edit: What I'm positing is not "THIS MUST BE FALSE!!!! THIS IS HOW IT HAPPENED" but to have a fun discussion with the possibilities that we have been given and explore past what we have decided to "accept" as lore.

Of course it's all just a conspiracy on the part of our sentient wind chime overlords.  Smile


RE: White Mage Lore - Sounsyy - 08-21-2015

(08-21-2015, 01:58 PM)Kage Wrote: Are you an Elemental?

To say such things as 100% truth. How do you know their motivations?

The lore?

The lore given to us through word of mouth that stems from the Elementals?

Umm... who better to tell us the motivation of the elementals than an elemental? More specifically Oha-Sok who is the elemental's desires made manifest. In a sense, she is the elemental's primal.

Raya-O-Senna Wrote:Oha-Sok is the collective fury of the elementals given form. Their suffering summoned her forth, and in her turn she stokes the fire of their rage with her keening.



I'm working my third straight 14hr shift right now. Gimme a few hours to get home and I'll work on putting up all WHM/elemental lore ever in here for you guys to fight over.


ADDED: 1.0 WHM questline has been added in its entirety. I've separated the different parts of each quest with individual Quote boxes. So first quote box = Part I, second quote box = Part II, etc. There might be spelling errors. There's a lot of hyphenated padjali words going around.

1.0 WHM Quest Text
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RE: White Mage Lore - rainichan - 08-23-2015

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OBj0umj3K3M

^ That's the entirety of the bonus blu-ray that came with the 2.0 collectors edition. While it doesn't really go over the War of the Magi in huge detail, the opening does say this:

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It continues on with what the Sixth Umbral Era brought:

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There's a blurb later on that mentions the Pact of Gelmorra as well:

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Further, the Padjal (from my understanding) were born during the time, made essentially by the elementals as their bearers of the knowledge of White magic. The blu-ray doesn't specifically name the elementals as the ones that flooded everything, but they were likely the ones who flooded the Shroud, giving birth to Oha-Sok in the process. Seeing how the elementals are seen as one with Hydaelyn, it is in their best interest to silence what was essentially an... appendage-waving contest between the Mhachi and the Amdapori in who could overpower the other in terms of magic and abusing having the ability at all was what was killing of Hydaelyn, flooding everything after warnings from the Archons was what happened in response.

Another thing worth mentioning is that, in order to keep people in line in the Shroud, at least in 1.0 (as it seems it's mentioned in passing but is never enacted) was the use of Greenwrath/Woodsin. Oh, you didn't get permission from the elementals to kill that bird for food? You're now inflicted with Woodsin, and if you don't purge yourself of it, the forest/elementals come to attack you.

That said, the blu-ray is still nothing but lore/history, and an interesting watch to be sure. My guess is also that with the fact that the Mhachi have finally been named, we're going to have some more lorebombs dropped on what actually happened during that time, how White/Black magic came to be, how everything got flooded, etc. This was more hard lore about what caused things without giving up too much, though I suspect they'll be giving us more in the future with subsequent updates to the core game itself on what really happened beyond the Mhachi being colossal jerks and summoning voidsent to destroy opposition and sending plagues to their other enemies. If you piece this together with what's in-game knowledge, it does give more lore with fewer holes, at least. If you were curious on 1.0 events, it gives that history too, complete with relevant cutscenes starting with when Ifrit is first summoned, beyond the Battle of Silvertear Falls.

HELLO YES I really like the lore for the War of the Magi and I'm curious how this knowledge, the knowledge in-game, and whatever future knowledge will put together a full picture of the past.


RE: White Mage Lore - Sounsyy - 08-25-2015

Huge thanks to Kage for posting this on the RPC!

Fernehalwes Wrote:Here, we run out of time, and are unable to talk about the Long Climb, but before we teleport to Gridania, we talk about the floating ruins of the Invisible City─remnants of the now destroyed city of Nym (which is covered heavily in the Scholar quest line), and how the city of Nym has ties with the cities of Amdapor and Mhach...and how we’ll be learning more about their little Fifth Astral Era spat in the very near future.



RE: White Mage Lore - rainichan - 08-25-2015

YES I saw that and did a Happy Lore Sway. It also gave the location of where the Mhachi were located in the realm:
Fernehalwes Wrote:Oda-san talked a bit about how the ruins are from Belah’dia, and how Belah’dia was originally founded by the survivors of Mhach (a city of magic that thrived in the Yafaem Saltmoor─a currently inaccessible region to the northwest of Mor Dhona─during the Fifth Astral Era).

There's now some speculation going on that the locations the Void Ark is seen is floating above this area but higher up so you can't see it from Mor Dhona. If it IS Mhachi, Nym, or Amdapor origin... well, it's possible that's what he means. Alternatively the Scholastate in Ishgard and its new quests coming in 3.1 might be the source of the lore... or something else entirely.

Still hoping for a Lost City HM in the coming patches...

Edit, while I'm thinking about it: And Ferne's wording of "Currently Inaccessible" makes me wonder if it will be in the future, hm.