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+--- Thread: Someone hates us! (/showthread.php?tid=4695)
RE: Someone hates us! - Cato - 10-03-2013
Having an official server for role-play would be largely redundant. It's nothing more than a useless tag that serves no purpose other than stating 'role-play is here' which is already accomplished by the various initiatives that encourage and spread awareness of the existence of role-play in MMO's that don't have a designated server for role-play.
Furthermore no modern MMO is going to employ people to look after role-players - they're not going to ban people for trolling us aside from in the most extreme cases, nor are they likely to ever adopt a firm stance to eliminate character names that are not considered immersive enough.
It also encourages a horrible 'us and them' mentality. I like role-play, but I like the other aspects that MMO's offer. I enjoy PvP and PvE. I find it fun to collect stuff and hoard things. We're not special: the tools we need to engage in role-play already exist. We have far more at our fingertips than other recent MMO's offer - GW2 didn't even let players have their character sit down in a chair whilst FFXIV allows my character to sit in 99% of the chairs he stumbles across throughout the game world.
We'd be better served asking for the inclusion of more emotes, more cosmetic armour/weaponry/clothing and features that will bring a direct benefit to role-play as we move forward. Most people already know that Balmung is the place to be for role-play in FFXIV, with Gilgamesh as the alternative for those who prefer a smaller community of role-players. I've seen threads on various sites related to FFXIV where people have asked 'is there rp in this game?' only to be directed to Balmung and Gilgamesh.
RE: Someone hates us! - Naunet - 10-03-2013
(10-03-2013, 09:22 AM)Theodric Ironheart Wrote: Furthermore no modern MMO is going to employ people to look after role-players - they're not going to ban people for trolling us aside from in the most extreme cases, nor are they likely to ever adopt a firm stance to eliminate character names that are not considered immersive enough.
I know modern MMOs that do just this, though the GMs aren't specifically assigned to look after roleplayers; it's just one of their duties to handle name reports and incidents of griefing. To say they don't is rather disingenuous.
I really don't understand the negative attitude towards RP-labeled servers that so many in this particular community have. I've never seen that elsewhere, and in the MMOs I played that didn't have an officially designated RP server, there was much complaint of wanting one. It's not a bad thing; it is a useful tool to solidify a community.
RE: Someone hates us! - Cato - 10-03-2013
(10-03-2013, 12:00 PM)Naunet Wrote:(10-03-2013, 09:22 AM)Theodric Ironheart Wrote: Furthermore no modern MMO is going to employ people to look after role-players - they're not going to ban people for trolling us aside from in the most extreme cases, nor are they likely to ever adopt a firm stance to eliminate character names that are not considered immersive enough.
I know modern MMOs that do just this, though the GMs aren't specifically assigned to look after roleplayers; it's just one of their duties to handle name reports and incidents of griefing. To say they don't is rather disingenuous.
I really don't understand the negative attitude towards RP-labeled servers that so many in this particular community have. I've never seen that elsewhere, and in the MMOs I played that didn't have an officially designated RP server, there was much complaint of wanting one. It's not a bad thing; it is a useful tool to solidify a community.
Many GM's don't seem to have a clue as to how to deal with the concerns expressed by role-players, even when they're rather valid complaints. There was a guy on the realm I used to play on back in WoW who used to have his character guzzle down size enhancing elixirs, ride around on a mammoth and constantly hit 'space' to make it roar for hours at a time.
He did this for around six months before getting dealt with. Countless people reported him and nothing was done about it. A few people were even banned for demanding that something was done about, since he'd show up almost every evening and target events and/or whoever he stumbled across indulging in a bit of random role-play. This wasn't an isolated case, either - I saw similar things happening in GW2 when I played that.
A tag for 'role-play' would just be there. It wouldn't serve much purpose, unless it was enforced - and it wouldn't be, since mainstream MMO's don't tend to want to actually deal with the problems that role-players bring up. I think role-playing communities thrive best when they're forced into making themselves known instead of relying on a tag. It encourages investment and people need to spend a bit of time and effort finding role-play, which means they're more likely to appreciate it more when it's not handed to them on a silver platter.
RE: Someone hates us! - Raccoon - 10-03-2013
(10-03-2013, 12:00 PM)Naunet Wrote:(10-03-2013, 09:22 AM)Theodric Ironheart Wrote: Furthermore no modern MMO is going to employ people to look after role-players - they're not going to ban people for trolling us aside from in the most extreme cases, nor are they likely to ever adopt a firm stance to eliminate character names that are not considered immersive enough.
I know modern MMOs that do just this, though the GMs aren't specifically assigned to look after roleplayers; it's just one of their duties to handle name reports and incidents of griefing. To say they don't is rather disingenuous.
I really don't understand the negative attitude towards RP-labeled servers that so many in this particular community have. I've never seen that elsewhere, and in the MMOs I played that didn't have an officially designated RP server, there was much complaint of wanting one. It's not a bad thing; it is a useful tool to solidify a community.
Most of the MMOs I've been in treat griefers the same way they treat any other harassment -- at most, they get a warning in an email every so often when the GM feels like it, with no limit on how many such warnings they can get. Naturally, this never dissuades them for long. So, in the end, RP servers just serve to paint a target on RPers. It's kinda like a LGBT group, or anything like that, announcing to the general public where they intend to have their meetings, so that protestors and the like can come harass them. You can call the police (GMs), but as long as the protestors don't do anything more than be obnoxious, they can't do anything to them. Same principle.
As for names, that actually gets handled a lot more than you'd think. It's just more obvious in games like CoH, where they were changed to "Generic Hero #", when reported, allowing you to keep apprised of just how many people have been Generic Hero'ed to date by the number by their name.
RE: Someone hates us! - Cato - 10-03-2013
(10-03-2013, 12:20 PM)Raccoon Wrote:(10-03-2013, 12:00 PM)Naunet Wrote:(10-03-2013, 09:22 AM)Theodric Ironheart Wrote: Furthermore no modern MMO is going to employ people to look after role-players - they're not going to ban people for trolling us aside from in the most extreme cases, nor are they likely to ever adopt a firm stance to eliminate character names that are not considered immersive enough.
I know modern MMOs that do just this, though the GMs aren't specifically assigned to look after roleplayers; it's just one of their duties to handle name reports and incidents of griefing. To say they don't is rather disingenuous.
I really don't understand the negative attitude towards RP-labeled servers that so many in this particular community have. I've never seen that elsewhere, and in the MMOs I played that didn't have an officially designated RP server, there was much complaint of wanting one. It's not a bad thing; it is a useful tool to solidify a community.
Most of the MMOs I've been in treat griefers the same way they treat any other harassment -- at most, they get a warning in an email every so often when the GM feels like it, with no limit on how many such warnings they can get. Naturally, this never dissuades them for long. So, in the end, RP servers just serve to paint a target on RPers. It's kinda like a LGBT group, or anything like that, announcing to the general public where they intend to have their meetings, so that protestors and the like can come harass them. You can call the police (GMs), but as long as the protestors don't do anything more than be obnoxious, they can't do anything to them. Same principle.
As for names, that actually gets handled a lot more than you'd think. It's just more obvious in games like CoH, where they were changed to "Generic Hero #", when reported, allowing you to keep apprised of just how many people have been Generic Hero'ed to date by the number by their name.
That's a pretty good analogy! It's a shame, but that's really just how it is. Maybe the GM's want to do more but their hands are tied? That's pretty likely, since I noticed that as time went on the GM's and moderators became increasingly bound by restrictions back in WoW and seemed to be a lot less efficient at tackling the root of harassment issues.
RE: Someone hates us! - K'dath - 10-03-2013
My experience in playing on 'designated' RP servers is: "These guys are a bunch of make believer faeries.... let's move our SUPER COMPETITIVE HARD CORE guild to their server so we get top ranked/world firsts." And when not telling everyone how bad they are in BGs, these guys hang out in trade and troll/shame RPers left and right.
And that's about it. There are more degenerates getting hung up over PvP on Moon Guard than there are on Illidan. And Illidan is legendary for its PVP 'community' it so graciously shares with us.
RE: Someone hates us! - Cato - 10-03-2013
(10-03-2013, 12:34 PM)X Wrote: My experience in playing on 'designated' RP servers is: "These guys are a bunch of make believer faeries.... let's move our SUPER COMPETITIVE HARD CORE guild to their server so we get top ranked/world firsts." And when not telling everyone how bad they are in BGs, these guys hang out in trade and troll/shame RPers left and right.
And that's about it. There are more degenerates getting hung up over PvP on Moon Guard than there are on Illidan. And Illidan is legendary for its PVP 'community' it so graciously shares with us.
Argent Dawn EU had a fair few 'PvP heroes' who really weren't all that great, yet insisted that they were. I used to find it hilarious that they'd make excuses as to why they didn't want to play on a server more inclined to catering to RP-PvP or even outright PvP instead.
RE: Someone hates us! - Naunet - 10-03-2013
(10-03-2013, 12:20 PM)Raccoon Wrote: So, in the end, RP servers just serve to paint a target on RPers. It's kinda like a LGBT group, or anything like that, announcing to the general public where they intend to have their meetings, so that protestors and the like can come harass them. You can call the police (GMs), but as long as the protestors don't do anything more than be obnoxious, they can't do anything to them. Same principle.
And in both situations, I would say: We should not feel as though we have to hide.
RE: Someone hates us! - Cato - 10-03-2013
(10-03-2013, 12:48 PM)Naunet Wrote:(10-03-2013, 12:20 PM)Raccoon Wrote: So, in the end, RP servers just serve to paint a target on RPers. It's kinda like a LGBT group, or anything like that, announcing to the general public where they intend to have their meetings, so that protestors and the like can come harass them. You can call the police (GMs), but as long as the protestors don't do anything more than be obnoxious, they can't do anything to them. Same principle.
And in both situations, I would say: We should not feel as though we have to hide.
Oh, definitely! Though we shouldn't feel exclusive, either. I don't want to play on a server full of role-players. I want to play on a server with a healthy mix of role-players and players who are passionate about dungeons, raids and whatever else is added to the game in the future.
RE: Someone hates us! - Naunet - 10-03-2013
(10-03-2013, 12:51 PM)Theodric Ironheart Wrote: Oh, definitely! Though we shouldn't feel exclusive, either. I don't want to play on a server full of role-players. I want to play on a server with a healthy mix of role-players and players who are passionate about dungeons, raids and whatever else is added to the game in the future.
The RP tag doesn't mean those folks won't come there. A lot of PvE and PvPers go to RP-tagged servers not to RP but because they like the atmosphere. The presence of an RP tag and the diversity of a server are not correlated. What an RP tag does do is give us recourse when being griefed and serve as a beacon for anyone picking up the game and interested in RP (or the atmosphere of an RP server).
Ultimately though, this is a moot argument. Squee has clearly made their decision. Though I strongly disagree with it, it is what it is.
And my this thread has gone off topic.
RE: Someone hates us! - LiadansWhisper - 10-03-2013
(10-03-2013, 12:34 PM)X Wrote: My experience in playing on 'designated' RP servers is: "These guys are a bunch of make believer faeries.... let's move our SUPER COMPETITIVE HARD CORE guild to their server so we get top ranked/world firsts." And when not telling everyone how bad they are in BGs, these guys hang out in trade and troll/shame RPers left and right.
And that's about it. There are more degenerates getting hung up over PvP on Moon Guard than there are on Illidan. And Illidan is legendary for its PVP 'community' it so graciously shares with us.
Ahahah...I wish I could disagree with this... Â But it's true. Â LOL
Most of them would throw a fit and rage quit, tho, if they were on an actual PvP server.Â
RE: Someone hates us! - Asyria - 10-09-2013
Clarification.
I don't.
Cut myself off.
From RP.
UNLESS!
It makes sense for the current situation.
It's not even happened yet.
Context, people. CONTEXT.
I'm not speaking Chinese, here.
I'm simply defending a very valid point that a whole lot of people seem hellbent on hammering down as being bad.