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Amnesia as a plotpoint - Maril - 04-13-2017
I am looking for opinions and examples of/about using amnesia as a plot point/element in your characters story, be it in the background or in the present situation. Less about viability, but more along the lines of how would you react if you came across a character with amnesia? Do you believe it is something that can be done "Right" and if so, what would you do to the element to make it work and perhaps let it seem a little bit less like the cliche it has become. Is it an element that has become worse or better as the years have ticked on for your roleplay experience? Is there a flaw/fault that people always end repeating when it is done?Â
I'm also thinking about what difference if any it makes to you, that such an element is placed in a character's background versus being done in for example a year-old character. Does the latter end up seeming more like a "lazy" retcon?Â
It's been a heck of a long time since I've actually debated amnesia with anyone, so I figured why not give it a go here. Thoughts?
RE: Amnesia as a plotpoint - Gegenji - 04-13-2017
I'm of a mind that anything can pulled off well if enough care and flair given to it.
With amnesia, I think that I would want the person using it to... well, it's hard to put into words but... give it proper gravitas and weight to it, I guess? I would expect it to have some sort of solid relevance to the character and their development. Like, how they handle it - does it nag them to no end and so a lot of their waking time is trying to figure out what they've forgotten, or do they decide to start anew and leave that forgotten past behind them?
In the case of both, I would figure there'd also be plot points at some juncture where someone from that past shows up. Shake things up a bit - either helping (or misleading) the prior type that wants desperately to recover their lost history or throwing a wrench in the works of the person who's just trying to move on. But in either case it would need to be a slow, building thing - not a new blast from the past every week or something.
I guess, in the basest sense... I have no issue with a character having amnesia. It's how they resolve that fact - what they do with it and what comes from it. And that it plays a hefty role in the character in general, since what is a person but a summation of their experiences?
RE: Amnesia as a plotpoint - Kilieit - 04-13-2017
I feel like it bugs me, either as a backstory point or a current plot device, when it's researched badly. I just can't disengage the part of my brain that's saying "it doesn't work like that! Nothing works like that! The plot device you are trying to use doesn't exist! This storyline has no verisimilitude!" for long enough to enjoy it. Unfortunately, this issue encompasses 90% of pop culture representations of amnesia, and as a knock-on effect... a good portion of RPers' amnesia storylines, too.
I guess it's kind of difficult when the world doesn't make first-hand stories from people with different types of amnesia very easy to access, but I feel like the amnesia storylines I've touched on in the past in RP have all been the same "they lost their memory and can't remember their name and have to rebuild from the bottom up and reclaim their old life!" storyline that... well, there's only so many variations you can make on it. Especially when similar RL examples are very difficult to come by for inspiration... because that type of amnesia doesn't really... exist. At least, not in significant numbers.
I think it kind of rings of disrespect in a way? Like people forget that amnesia is a real thing, that affects real people, and not just a thing that happens in fiction (like truth serums, or mind control spells, or werewolf/vampire transformations). So they treat it like a prop or a trope that you can just make stuff up about because there's no real life equivalent, so you may as well just do whatever, right? Except there is a real life equivalent this time.
tl;dr Do your research, make your storyline ring true, and resist the temptation to just copy other works of fiction.
RE: Amnesia as a plotpoint - Ellmida - 04-13-2017
I'm going for the default answer of "it depends" I think the situation of Amnesia is actually more preferred in situations where you're having trouble pinning down a back story or need to buy time to read up on lore and I've done this a few times before with previous and current characters, Ellmida is a good example of this actually, where all her memories prior to the calamity are vague and blurred together.
I personally have no issue with amnesiac characters save for situations where it's just used as a half baked contrivance for some quick drama, as in if it's treated as a serious situation which is automatically improved with little explanation why. As for how my characters deal with these types..... depends on the character.
In situations with year old characters, I think it can be done even for a retcon but I would think you would have to take more care than with characters that were brought in with it, probably better in situations where those you usually do with are not currently playing to mess up the retcon with... Knowing you.
RE: Amnesia as a plotpoint - Verad - 04-13-2017
I use amnesia as a plotpoint for Verad in the sense that he has a long and storied history he doesn't remember with only a memoir full of outrageous lies and a hint of truth as a guideline. It's a convenient way to slot in storylines related to dumb adventures from his past as the mood strikes, and, his personality being what it is, lets me focus on RPing his actions in the present instead of focusing overmuch on his backstory. It's also a convenient way for players I trust to create adventures of their own, leading to one of the few times I've been genuinely surprised by something somebody else created in RP.
Whether it's respectful or not to sufferers of amnesia isn't particularly relevant or interesting to me; I am pretty insensitive to the trend of only portraying issues like mental illness in highly-researched formats for the sake of didacticism. Knock yourself out if you care to do so, but the actual effect it will have on amnesia sufferers is minimal to nonexistent one way or the other.
RE: Amnesia as a plotpoint - Kilieit - 04-13-2017
(04-13-2017, 01:06 PM)Verad Wrote: Whether it's respectful or not to sufferers of amnesia isn't particularly relevant or interesting to me; I am pretty insensitive to the trend of only portraying issues like mental illness in highly-researched formats for the sake of didacticism. Knock yourself out if you care to do so, but the actual effect it will have on amnesia sufferers is minimal to nonexistent one way or the other.
I think my main issue is how difficult the disregard makes it to suspend disbelief. Like with a mind control spell working a certain way it's easy to say to yourself "well I guess it could work that way", since there's no IRL equivalents to compare to. But when an IRL equivalent exists, and is ignored or contradicted, there's that "huh? What? I thought you said this was [thing]? This isn't working like [thing] works at all?" that certainly takes me a hot minute to work past, if I'm invested enough to work past it at all.
I don't think researching what it's like to, for example, have a broken leg before you RP your character having a broken leg would be described as "for the sake of didacticism" - so I don't know why applying the same diligence to mental illness or brain injury would be, either.
The respect is a separate issue, and broader. Like I say, I think the issue originates in general pop culture and is only expressed through people's choices for their RP storylines. I do think it's important to remember that you don't know anything about the other people behind the screen. As a general litmus, I think if you'd be embarrassed to run your storyline in front of a real person with amnesia, maybe you should go back and refine it before you run it.
eta: nixed useless clause
RE: Amnesia as a plotpoint - Verad - 04-13-2017
(04-13-2017, 02:13 PM)Kilieit Wrote: I think my main issue is how difficult the disregard makes it to suspend disbelief. Like with a mind control spell working a certain way it's easy to say to yourself "well I guess it could work that way", since there's no IRL equivalents to compare to. But when an IRL equivalent exists, and is ignored or contradicted, there's that "huh? What? I thought you said this was [thing]? This isn't working like [thing] works at all?" that certainly takes me a hot minute to work past, if I'm invested enough to work past it at all.
This is a highly subjective response. My suspension of disbelief is pretty flexible; if things don't work the way they're supposed to IRL, I remember I'm not IRL, and that my goal in RP isn't necessarily to simulate IRL. I suspect this is true for many other RPers, and that even those who value verisimilitude still have some level at which they are willing to overlook the unreal or the unrealistic for the sake of getting on with things or because the other player has a writing style interesting enough that they don't mind.
Quote:I don't think researching what it's like to, for example, have a broken leg before you RP your character having a broken leg would be described as "for the sake of didacticism" - so I don't know why applying the same diligence to mental illness or brain injury would be, either.
Because (so the argument goes, as this is not mine), having a broken leg isn't part of a culture which stigmatizes (or, depending on circumstance, romanticizes) that particular ailment due to fictional portrayals thereof. I use mental illness specifically because of the frequency with which I've seen the cry of "do your research and portray this as realistically as possible" applied to mental illness as part of a kind of grassroots push to remove that stigma them through realistic but nevertheless sympathetic portrayals.
It's all well and good if your complaint is "I need it to be realistic in order for me to enjoy the portrayal." Some people like pineapple on their pizza after all. However, that complaint is often extended beyond the realm of subjective taste by adding that a lack of realism is somehow immoral.
Quote:The respect is a separate issue, and broader. Like I say, I think the issue originates in general pop culture and is only expressed through people's choices for their RP storylines. I do think it's important to remember that you don't know anything about the other people behind the screen. As a general litmus, I think if you'd be embarrassed to run your storyline in front of a real person with amnesia, maybe you should go back and refine it before you run it.
In such a circumstance, I'd be more embarrassed to be dressed as a six foot tall blue-grey elf.
RE: Amnesia as a plotpoint - Thraask - 04-13-2017
My problem with Amnesia is that it kind of just becomes central to the character, which isn't great. It's okay, but when you ever RP with a person using the amnesia thing, most of the time it just comes up so often, you know? It's kind of like... in your face all the time "I can't do this because of amnesia. I don't know that because of amnesia. I can't remember that thing because of amnesia." It's often almost tiring to RP with those types of people. It just sort of becomes that character's one single defining characteristic.
That's not to say that I don't think it can be done well, but I've yet to experience a truly compelling amnesia story. I think that if you really want a character that doesn't really know much about Eorzea because OOCly, you're not familiar with the lore. I think you should just go ahead and do that. Have them grow up in a secluded village and venturing out into the wider world for the first time. Most of the time amnesia is tried it just feels lazy to me.
RE: Amnesia as a plotpoint - Verad - 04-13-2017
(04-13-2017, 02:30 PM)Thraask Wrote: My problem with Amnesia is that it kind of just becomes central to the character, which isn't great. It's okay, but when you ever RP with a person using the amnesia thing, most of the time it just comes up so often, you know? It's kind of like... in your face all the time "I can't do this because of amnesia. I don't know that because of amnesia. I can't remember that thing because of amnesia." It's often almost tiring to RP with those types of people. It just sort of becomes that character's one single defining characteristic.
In my experience, I saw that approach done not with amnesia, but with "My character is from Doma and your ways are strange and foreign to me." I wonder how that will change with Stormblood, if at all.
RE: Amnesia as a plotpoint - Ellmida - 04-13-2017
I'd say anything can be done poorly and anything can be done well and I'd say a lot of that has to do with the experience and skill of the player. The problem is that this along with vampires, werewolves immortals and such are also a fall back hook for a lot for those who may be the opposite of either or both and a stigma develops.
RE: Amnesia as a plotpoint - Oyuu - 04-13-2017
I agree with Gegenji that it can be done well if you properly consider the weight and affect amnesia would have the character, and what matters is how your character deals and reacts to the fact they suffer from amnesia.Â
The only times I've interacted with characters with amnesia that really stuck out to me were experiences in the Quicksand. The character would mention it casually to the age old question of "Oh, where are you from?" and my character would respond "Well, shit, are you ok? Have you tried finding out what happened?" to be met with a playful shrug and a shake of the head. It did come across as lazy "I haven't thought of a backstory so I'll make it up as I go along" type deal.
But that doesn't mean it can't be done well! Kilieit made a good point about doing your research into real life cases of amnesia to try and figure out how it would truly affect your character and how you could work that into a story. I think a mysterious and unknown past could be a really great plot device. Discovering what had really happened to the character can bring some sweet, sweet angst and development not just with your own, but others she has met before too!Â
I don't think roleplaying a cliche is a bad thing at all and you should fully explore it if it's a route you're seriously considering. Heck, I've considered using amensia for a character backstory too by making the main character concept about discovering the truth... but it's not all that simple. Anyways, good luck in your roleplay!
RE: Amnesia as a plotpoint - TK Hikaru - 04-13-2017
When it comes to amnesia, I feel like it can be done very sloppily or very well. Which is why I also agree with researching cases of amnesia to see how it works in real life and how it can be played.
Quote:I'm also thinking about what difference if any it makes to you, that such an element is placed in a character's background versus being done in for example a year-old character. Does the latter end up seeming more like a "lazy" retcon?
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It really depends on how you use it. For example, I've played Chouwa for almost over a year now. When I gave her the amnesia, I wasn't intending on retconing anything that had happened to her prior to the memory loss.Â
Everything that had happened still happened, Chouwa had forgotten certain events. All the characters who knew her still knew her, she just wouldn't remember some faces.
If you play your cards right, amnesia can be a good plot tool. For example, Chouwa was recently remembered someone who she was very close with before the amnesia, someone she had treated like a stranger after her accident. The next time she meets him again she's going to apologize.
Do your research, plan out how your character is going to react, and if you're giving it to a character who's already out in the world, make sure to let roleplay partners know the amnesia is a thing.
RE: Amnesia as a plotpoint - Kerrath - 04-13-2017
i always sorta feel like when people say their character has amnesia, what they mean is that they're too lazy to write. which, even that's fine--the best RP is completely improvised.
the real way to do amnesia right is honestly to make it very clear that you're not using it as an excuse to avoid writing. all of the plot points of their life should exist. just because the character doesn't remember what happened, doesnt mean there's no physical evidence of what happened. maybe someone else knows your character's past. maybe they get brief glimpses of memory. there should also be a solid reason why they have amnesia.
RE: Amnesia as a plotpoint - Nebbs - 04-14-2017
My main problem with things like this is when it becomes the main focus of someones RP. So with any affliction or disability, try to make it about the character first. And most people with affliction defined characters don't want it fixing, which kind of puts a knife in any RP progression.
I also see such things as over used, and almost loose the will to carry on when I meet yet-another-<insert affliction> character.Â
That said, it could be useful for a one off plot. You could be creative about it, such as:
- Having a memory stealing wizards at large
- Someone is possessing people getting them to do things and then wiping their memory somehow
- You have someone else's memories of an event and they have yours, due to some shrunken monkey head curse
- Drinking a herbal tea that make you a bit absent minded
RE: Amnesia as a plotpoint - Valence - 04-14-2017
Be it well and interestingly done or not, it remains mostly part of your own character backstory or ongoing story.
What does it bring to other players you are RPing with? Quests to help your character find their memory back?