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+--- Thread: Worship of Thaliak and Althyk (/showthread.php?tid=19680)
Worship of Thaliak and Althyk - Alastair Helyous - 06-07-2017
As we know, its very clear how the clerical body of Halonic worship functions in Ishgard. Nophica worship is quite well represented, albeit a little too open to headcanon interpretation is still good enough to allow one to imagine how it works. Rhalgr worship is sure to be much more developed now in Stormblood and Ul'dah, mainly on 1.0, already laid an awesome foundation of how one woships Nald'thal. Oschon's sigil can be seem on Nymian ruins and we know Lominsans worship Llymlaen and mention her frequently.
Now, some deities seem to be rather bizarre or obscure on their worship. My character, as someone who is deeply interested in studies is bound to be attuned to Thaliak the Scholar. What do we know of his cult? How does it work? What are his values?
On Althyk its mostly a curiosity thing, since he is god of time, I'd like to have it a little more expanded if possible.
Can you guys help me?
RE: Worship of Thaliak and Althyk - Miah Gamduhla - 06-10-2017
I've always assumed that worship of Thaliak revolved around the pursuit of knowledge, though I've never seen any canon mention on what that entails (ceremony and whatnot).
While I wouldn't say that Miah worships Thaliak, her main drive in life is to gain knowledge on as much things as she can by experiencing them first hand, no matter how minute and insignificant the experience may be - something that she believes Thaliak would approve of. This is her own way of being devout while not belonging to a church like many who worship Halone would be.
Thaliak is the patron of Sharlayan though, and its pretty safe to assume that much of their society (and likely that of The Circle of Knowing / Scions) is the way it is because of their reverence to him. "Knowledge Seeks No Man" is a line thats written on a slab of stone in Idyllshire, located in the Dravanian Hinterlands where the Sharlayan (the city state) was located before they evacuated.
I hope that this helps.
RE: Worship of Thaliak and Althyk - Virella - 06-10-2017
I had really hoped the lorebook would go how the Twelve individually get worshipped in detail.
Hopefully Sounsyy catches the signal and can help you further with your question, because I really don't know much about Thaliak and Althyk, so I can't help you.
At best you can try to search their names in this http://xivdb.com/lore-finder and hope something comes out of it o/
RE: Worship of Thaliak and Althyk - Alastair Helyous - 06-10-2017
(06-10-2017, 07:15 AM)Virella Wrote: I had really hoped the lorebook would go how the Twelve individually get worshipped in detail.
Hopefully Sounsyy catches the signal and can help you further with your question, because I really don't know much about Thaliak and Althyk, so I can't help you.
At best you can try to search their names in this http://xivdb.com/lore-finder and hope something comes out of it o/
Thank you for the link. By the way, who would Sounsyy be?
RE: Worship of Thaliak and Althyk - Momo - 06-11-2017
(Sounsyy is our resident Lore expert expert, like there are lots of lore experts, but none come close to the amount of time and effort put into his work~)
While we do not know how Thaliak and Athylk are worshiped, we can infer a few things if you would like to have something to add into your RP. They aren't really given lore, but some of the best religious RP practice, is going to be the practices that RPers come up with themselves using the clues we get.
In the Dravanian Hinterlands, runs the Thaliak River. It is likely no coincidence that Sharlayan lands bare the name of the Scholarly God of The Twelve running through them, and that the people of this nation of seekers of knowledge built one of their greatest collections of knowledge on the banks of it: The Great Gubal Library. I am not sure we can really infer that the Sharlayans truly worship Thaliak, only because they are of very advanced knowledge and it is likely they know more about the Twelve than we know and that they do not view them as gods to be worshiped. We could infer however, that all scholarly pursuit, the discovery of new lands, the revelation of secret knowledge, and the workings of life in all forms are all major pursuits of someone who dedicates their life to Thaliak as their patron. I have some ideas on rituals or common practices of religious people of Thaliak if you would like to hear them, note me~
Althyk, The God of Time, has many things attributed to him in the lore of the Twelve in the game. As the god of time, he is viewed not only as one who can recall all time, present, past, and future, but also a god of creation and destruction, with particular focus on him in death rites. Therefor we could probably infer that he is a god which is called upon at both birth and death, to ask for longevity of life and also safe passage for all time in the afterlife. Trials of memory and also any of those told by bards are often summoned up by a call to Althyk. Honestly there are lots of ideas that one could derive from these things, hope that any of this helped!
RE: Worship of Thaliak and Althyk - Alastair Helyous - 06-12-2017
(06-11-2017, 01:31 PM)Momo Wrote: (Sounsyy is our resident Lore expert expert, like there are lots of lore experts, but none come close to the amount of time and effort put into his work~)
While we do not know how Thaliak and Athylk are worshiped, we can infer a few things if you would like to have something to add into your RP. They aren't really given lore, but some of the best religious RP practice, is going to be the practices that RPers come up with themselves using the clues we get.
In the Dravanian Hinterlands, runs the Thaliak River. It is likely no coincidence that Sharlayan lands bare the name of the Scholarly God of The Twelve running through them, and that the people of this nation of seekers of knowledge built one of their greatest collections of knowledge on the banks of it: The Great Gubal Library. I am not sure we can really infer that the Sharlayans truly worship Thaliak, only because they are of very advanced knowledge and it is likely they know more about the Twelve than we know and that they do not view them as gods to be worshiped. We could infer however, that all scholarly pursuit, the discovery of new lands, the revelation of secret knowledge, and the workings of life in all forms are all major pursuits of someone who dedicates their life to Thaliak as their patron. I have some ideas on rituals or common practices of religious people of Thaliak if you would like to hear them, note me~
Althyk, The God of Time, has many things attributed to him in the lore of the Twelve in the game. As the god of time, he is viewed not only as one who can recall all time, present, past, and future, but also a god of creation and destruction, with particular focus on him in death rites. Therefor we could probably infer that he is a god which is called upon at both birth and death, to ask for longevity of life and also safe passage for all time in the afterlife. Trials of memory and also any of those told by bards are often summoned up by a call to Althyk. Honestly there are lots of ideas that one could derive from these things, hope that any of this helped!
(I see! I will really enjoy it if he shares the contents of the well of his knowledge <3 )
To be honest I'm not so sure the Sharlayans don't worship Thaliak in a literal way. I picture the Egyptians who had a very extensive knowledge of everything and still were as zealous with their gods as possible.
On the major pursuits of someone who worships him, it sounded very similar to D&d 3.5 God Boccob. Would they then be similar deities on philosophy and methods of worship?
RE: Worship of Thaliak and Althyk - Crystal Chronicler - 06-15-2017
Oh, Sounsyy! Wherefore art thou? Knowledge is required and thus we summon thee!
I too want to know more about Althyk worship. He's my favorite god to choose because I never see him represented.
RE: Worship of Thaliak and Althyk - Vexander - 06-15-2017
To be fair, Worship can also differ based on which culture is doing the worship.
During my time on Balmung I spent almost a full year with a Moonkeeper Clan FC, and each month they had an, 'Esbat,' which was a formal ceremony of sorts worshiping one of the Twelve in different ways. At the time I was RP'ing a Sharlayan, so part of the Esbat for Thaliak came across as proper and respectful to him (giving thanks to teachers and sharing what was learned), and the other part shocked him to his core as a tremendous act of sacrilege against Thaliak (Sacrificing a live Owl).
I mean, Moonkeeper Clans are largely hunters, so for them, it would seem logical to make an offering to Thaliak of a creature known as a symbol for Wisdom.
For a Sharlayan it was barbaric and anathema to the very essence of what Thaliak stands for, as Death marks the end of learning as our aether returns to the lifestream and our conscious existence ends. Trying for a compromise he suggested for the next year they prepare early, acquire an Owl Egg, hatch it, raise it, teach it, and at the next Esbat, release it into the wild as a gesture of giving knowledge to the world through what they taught the Owl.
Anyways, my point is, I think different cultures will worship in different ways.
RE: Worship of Thaliak and Althyk - Teadrinker - 06-15-2017
(06-15-2017, 07:05 PM)Vexander Wrote: Anyways, my point is, I think different cultures will worship in different ways.
This makes sense to me as well. It's perhaps why the lorebook didn't define any particular one way to worship a deity.
RE: Worship of Thaliak and Althyk - Momo - 06-17-2017
(06-12-2017, 12:34 PM)Alastair Helyous Wrote:(06-11-2017, 01:31 PM)Momo Wrote: (Sounsyy is our resident Lore expert expert, like there are lots of lore experts, but none come close to the amount of time and effort put into his work~)
While we do not know how Thaliak and Athylk are worshiped, we can infer a few things if you would like to have something to add into your RP. They aren't really given lore, but some of the best religious RP practice, is going to be the practices that RPers come up with themselves using the clues we get.
In the Dravanian Hinterlands, runs the Thaliak River. It is likely no coincidence that Sharlayan lands bare the name of the Scholarly God of The Twelve running through them, and that the people of this nation of seekers of knowledge built one of their greatest collections of knowledge on the banks of it: The Great Gubal Library. I am not sure we can really infer that the Sharlayans truly worship Thaliak, only because they are of very advanced knowledge and it is likely they know more about the Twelve than we know and that they do not view them as gods to be worshiped. We could infer however, that all scholarly pursuit, the discovery of new lands, the revelation of secret knowledge, and the workings of life in all forms are all major pursuits of someone who dedicates their life to Thaliak as their patron. I have some ideas on rituals or common practices of religious people of Thaliak if you would like to hear them, note me~
Althyk, The God of Time, has many things attributed to him in the lore of the Twelve in the game. As the god of time, he is viewed not only as one who can recall all time, present, past, and future, but also a god of creation and destruction, with particular focus on him in death rites. Therefor we could probably infer that he is a god which is called upon at both birth and death, to ask for longevity of life and also safe passage for all time in the afterlife. Trials of memory and also any of those told by bards are often summoned up by a call to Althyk. Honestly there are lots of ideas that one could derive from these things, hope that any of this helped!
(I see! I will really enjoy it if he shares the contents of the well of his knowledge <3 )
To be honest I'm not so sure the Sharlayans don't worship Thaliak in a literal way. I picture the Egyptians who had a very extensive knowledge of everything and still were as zealous with their gods as possible.
On the major pursuits of someone who worships him, it sounded very similar to D&d 3.5 God Boccob. Would they then be similar deities on philosophy and methods of worship?
I apologize that I haven't gotten back to you until now, I took a little bit of time to read over the god you mentioned as I am not well-versed in DnD lore, but it seems he would be similar yes!
Not to be too spoilery...but the point I was trying to make, is that we do not know exactly who The Twelve are by standards of gods and primals and in the company of Hydaelyn and the like. The Sharlayans, above even the Allagans as far as we can tell, have come to closest to touching realms beyond our own and collecting knowledge of the deeper workings of the world. From what we have gathered, a major piece of the lore being revealed in HW by Tiamat specifically if I remember correctly, seeks to undermine the place of the Twelve as actual gods, and there is a good chance that the Sharlayans understand this, and as such wouldn't really "worship" Thaliak as much as they would pay respects to all that he stands for, and perhaps even keep archaic practices alive to show respect to the path of the scholar.
I agree with Vex, likely things such as sacrifice would be viewed as barbaric and unneeded and perhaps even if it were something that was once part of their culture, they would likely have dropped live sacrifice for rituals involving more symbolic and metaphoric forms of sacrifice. The solemn vow of the Sharlayans to learn of the world, but try not to affect it as it is still living, is something that would probably steer how they see and practice their rituals as well.
Either way? This is a really fun and interesting topic, the pursuit of knowledge and the fine edge of the blade, which may fall to the side of breaking a vow or keeping, but always strikes some sort of blow, is an endearing and alluring prospect, and one that certainly makes for interesting RP!
RE: Worship of Thaliak and Althyk - Lizzo - 06-17-2017
Though not really answering the question at hand, my main Parker Connor (female highlander), is roleplayed as a 'worshiper' of Althyk.
As most highlanders are wont to adhere to Rhalgr - as can be seen by practically every npc highlander, especially those in the Little Ala Mhigo/Stormblood storylines, Parker was taught to give precedence to Althyk by her father Wulver (who will be brought into her story more as SB continues).
Originally creating these characters way back in 2.0 launch, and being quite interested in Classical Mythology - namely of the Greek and Roman variety, I likened the Twelve to the most powerful gods of those beliefs. Even though Ares was the god of war, he still obeyed his father/king Zeus. So, when I created Parker I figured that as Althyk was the king/leader of the Twelve, no matter how powerful the other 11 were, they would always obey him.
I created the explanation for this credence given from father to daughter as:
"Destruction comes to all, pup, but only when Time wills it."
Thought it was an interesting tangent for a highlander, to make her a bit more unique.