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Serenity · **10-18-2016, 12:57 PM**

Hey all
I'll keep it brief, I'm hoping to have Serenity join the ranks of the summoner, but I had some questions about it. I'm no lore buff and I don't have access to the lore book. Hopefully I can get some help so I'm not dashing the game lore over my knee.Â

So, so far Serenity... Procured... A soul gem from a group of Arcanist researchers and expeditioners, and has been doing lots of research with tomes found from all over Eorzea.Â

She also is conducting her own expeditions based on her research... She goes into dungeons and around the world trying to find old summoner relics. She found the summoner relic horn in the sunken ruins of qarn, and I'd on the lookout for more.Â

My questions are:

#1 - have I messed up with any lore already?Â
#2 - can Serenity gain the powers of a summoner (minus actually calling egis) simply by having her soul gem react to the relic garments she finds?Â
#3 - what are alternative methods of learning to summon primal egis?

Kilieit · **10-18-2016, 01:05 PM**

Here is the new stuff from the lore book. I've only skimmed it, but you can have fun devouring it as it's relevant to your RP!

#3: As far as I'm aware, you must have been present at the defeat of a Primal in order to summon its egi. No primal defeats under your belts = no egis. Full stop. No alternative methods.

I believe anyone who was in Eorzea during the most recent Calamity has the ability to enter Dreadwyrm Trance (and the Teraflare limit break), but that's its own level of difficulty... like it's probably more feasible than an egi for a character who isn't part of the Scions or one of the Primal-killing squads the Grand Companies evidently have (at least the Immortal Flames do), but since it's so late on in the quests/levels I'm wondering if it isn't all kinds of tough?

#2: Most basic SMN abilities are actually from the ACN class, so you're good there. Anyone familiar with arcanima would probably be able to gain a grasp on them.

You probably want someone who actually RP's a summoner (vs. just being familiar with the lore) to advise you on the rest, haha.

**Unnamed Mercenary** · **10-18-2016, 01:06 PM**

1) That seems fine so far. The 30-50 SMN quests seemed to show there were a fair amount of soul stones around. Access to someone with some good archeology skills possibly required. (But who's to say there isn't someone with a family heirloom or something?)

2) I can't remember if someone screencapped the section for it, but when I was reading the lore book, it had a good soul stone piece. Basically, while a soul stone contains all those memories and experiences, a person can't just grab one and know everything. IT still takes work, study and training to tap into the potential stored in them. (Think of it as resonating with the stone). In that sense, yes, it's possible that by putting in enough work, your character could gain access to some of those spells.

3) AFAIK, none. Egi is a word taken from the Allagans that roughly translates to "essence of." So a Garuda-egi is a being that is the essence of Garuda, and so on. Egis are different from say, carbuncles, which are arcanist geometries shaping aether being passed into a gemstone, which then yields the sparkly creatures we all know and love.

Serenity · **10-18-2016, 01:11 PM**

Wow ok, so I'm actually staying pretty well within the lore thus far...Â

My next question would be... How can I get Serenity to be present at the slaying of a primal? Is it even possible?

**Unnamed Mercenary** · **10-18-2016, 01:15 PM**

(10-18-2016, 01:11 PM)Serenity Wrote: Wow ok, so I'm actually staying pretty well within the lore thus far...Â

My next question would be... How can I get Serenity to be present at the slaying of a primal? Is it even possible?

Is she echo-enabled and/or does he have Hydaelyn's Blessing?

We do know that the beast tribes are constantly trying to summon their primals, especially the tempered ones. But again, there's the issue of getting tempered by a primal. I have seen some people skirt around that by being around, but not actively engaged in battle with a primal, but I'm not familiar with how often primals are in the open-world vs being in their trial lair things.

Kilieit · **10-18-2016, 01:18 PM**

Does your character have the Echo?

If YES: She could approach the Scions of the Seventh Dawn, likely via the Sons of Saint Coinach or another academic contact, and ask to be allowed to participate in a future defeat of a primal. OR: If she knows she's immune to tempering, then she might have the confidence to place herself in a position where she'll be kidnapped for tempering by a primal's followers. There's still the very likely chance the primal would kill her, though, if she was going in alone.

If NO: Bit trickier. Tristan's backstory seems to imply the Immortal Flames, at least, have a "primal-killing squad" who are dispatched whenever a new incarnation of Ifrit is summoned. I can only imagine the other grand companies have similar squads... who are basically suicide troops. Everyone is always VERY reluctant to go to battle with a Primal, because if they aren't killed, there's a high likelihood they'll be tempered/drowned/etc and THEN killed. By their own people. Out of necessity. Primal battles are always very high casualty for people without the Echo. I can only imagine someone actively asking to join one of these suicide squads would be viewed with "uh, why, we need you elsewhere" and/or "sure if that's what floats your boat", depending on the exact commanding officer, how well-known the character is to the grand company, and other factors.

That's my take on it anyway!

Serenity · **10-18-2016, 01:18 PM**

(10-18-2016, 01:15 PM)Unnamed Mercenary Wrote:
(10-18-2016, 01:11 PM)Serenity Wrote: Wow ok, so I'm actually staying pretty well within the lore thus far...Â

My next question would be... How can I get Serenity to be present at the slaying of a primal? Is it even possible?

Is she echo-enabled and/or does he have Hydaelyn's Blessing?

We do know that the beast tribes are constantly trying to summon their primals, especially the tempered ones. But again, there's the issue of getting tempered by a primal. I have seen some people skirt around that by being around, but not actively engaged in battle with a primal, but I'm not familiar with how often primals are in the open-world vs being in their trial lair things.

She's neither.Â

Hmmm... I'll have to do more research... Maybe the knowledge in her soul gem eventually lets her duets residual aether...

Sounsyy · **10-18-2016, 02:33 PM**

Kilieit already linked the SMN Lore Book pages, but if you need more information and lore about Summoners, you can find it in my Summoner Lore Compilation.

Hope this helps! ^^ Summoner is a tricky thing to work around though. You'll need to have at least been present at the defeat of a Primal, not necessarily striking the killing blow, but present and close enough to get the taint of its essence. You've already got a soulstone, which is the easiest part. The trickiest is figuring out how you survived the fight without the Echo. There are of course people who've done it before - the Company of Heroes for example and several grand company suicide squads, but 90+% fatality rate against a Primal encounter generally makes these victories a rare thing in lore.

Jana · **10-18-2016, 03:41 PM**

Hello, I play a character with SMN experience. My character has had the Echo to protect her from tempering. Most everything I could say has already been touched on by the other people who responded, but I'll add that it's OK if you want to give your character the Echo too. While it's a rare skill compared to the general population, it's not so rare that only the WoL and his 7 best friends can have it. (I'm at work and can't link specific resources though.)

**Unnamed Mercenary** · **10-18-2016, 03:55 PM**

(10-18-2016, 03:41 PM)Jana Wrote: Hello, I play a character with SMN experience. My character has had the Echo to protect her from tempering. Most everything I could say has already been touched on by the other people who responded, but I'll add that it's OK if you want to give your character the Echo too. While it's a rare skill compared to the general population, it's not so rare that only the WoL and his 7 best friends can have it. (I'm at work and can't link specific resources though.)

^this.

Before FFXIV 2.0 launched, Minfilia's entire point was to try to gather up as many people who had the echo as possible. (Louisoix's Circle of Knowing and them later merged to make the Scions).

Having the Echo is rare, but not unheard of. Sounsyy has a good write up of it....somewhere. It get linked fairly often, but I'm not on my main computer with bookmarks and links to things.

Sounsyy · **10-19-2016, 09:09 AM**

(10-18-2016, 03:55 PM)Unnamed Mercenary Wrote:
(10-18-2016, 03:41 PM)Jana Wrote: Hello, I play a character with SMN experience. My character has had the Echo to protect her from tempering. Most everything I could say has already been touched on by the other people who responded, but I'll add that it's OK if you want to give your character the Echo too. While it's a rare skill compared to the general population, it's not so rare that only the WoL and his 7 best friends can have it. (I'm at work and can't link specific resources though.)
Having the Echo is rare, but not unheard of. Sounsyy has a good write up of it....somewhere. It get linked fairly often, but I'm not on my main computer with bookmarks and links to things.

No worries, I got you~

-Echo Lore Compilation

Towards the bottom of the post are a few relevant links to other discussions on the topic, but the Echo spoiler tab at the bottom has the write up on all lore we had on the Echo pre-Encyclopedia. Hope it helps! ^^

TinyRedLeaf · **10-19-2016, 02:13 PM**

Most of the questions have already been tackled, so I thought you might find a few more details useful for fleshing out your character's background.

Y'mhitra, the summoner trainer, specifically asked for someone with a background in arcanima (and requisite experience in defeating a primal) because of the discipline's affinity with summoning.

Arcanima is essentially the "science" of manipulating the aether of objects through arcane geometry. The "summoning" of carbuncles is the most vivid example of arcanima in practice, but the discipline works in other ways too. Arcane geometry can, for example, be used to trigger aetherochemical reactions within objects, causing debilitating, entropic effects that are likened to "diseases" (bio, miasma, etc).

(Later in the main quest line, especially in the post-Heavensward story, you'll encounter other uses of arcanima, like the creation of powerful magic barriers.)

Arcanima can also create "dams" within an individual's life force, allowing an arcanist to hold a portion of his aether in reserve, and then release it in an explosive burst (ie, aetherdam, aetherflow).

And while it has never been explicitly stated in the game's lore, I've long believed that an arcanist's aetherdam ability was essential to the revival of Allagan summoning. That's because, unlike arcane summoning, Allagan summoning requires the summoner to power the egi with his own aetheric life force (and this in turn explains why the summoning of more powerful egi is impossible; no mortal summoner has enough life force to do so).

It should be further noted that Allagan summoning, in its current form in the Seventh Astral Era, is still very much a work-in-progress. It's not entirely clear that the original Allagan summoners used "disease"-related spells the way the modern arcanist-summoner does, for example. You could think of the current summoner template as one in which your "arcanist researchers" filled the archeological gaps with modern arcanima.

By-the-by, it appears that arcanima, like astromancy, is very much a niche discipline. Most magic-users in Eorzea appear to practise either conjury or thaumaturgy. The branch of arcanima practised in Limsa Lominsa is said to have originated from the inhabitants of the southern islands (and I like to imagine that it may have evolved from the mathematical calculations for sea navigation). The Sharlayans appear to be the only other major practitioners of arcanima, with major NPCs like Alphinaud, Alisaie and Urianger being arcanists in the Sharlayan tradition.

Hope you find the above useful. Smile

Summoner lore?

RPC has moved! These pages have been kept for historical purposes