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Verad · **11-01-2016, 06:09 PM**

So a couple of nights ago I ran a Halloween haunted mansion event for some of my Fate-14 players. They found themselves dealing with the spirits of a fallen Ishgardian house that had a very serious and, to anyone who has played the MSQ, wrongheaded approach to rooting out heresy - they would secretly feed captive Ishgardian commoners dragon's blood to test their purity and then kill the resulting dragon as proof of their sin.Â

When the ghostly head of the house explained all of this to the players, I had to immediately inform them OOC that trying to correct the ghost if they were playing their characters as knowledgeable about the events of the MSQ would have been unwise, because they would have instantly said "That's not how dragon's blood works, dipshit" (paraphrasing here), and probably gotten themselves stuck in a tough fight with limited resources. After all, why would a centuries-dead ghost know that Ishgardians at large all had draconic heritage? And why would a ghost - a being stuck in its ways - care about that kind of thing if it were told to them, and not dismiss it as lies?

Now I freely admit I metagamed this for their own safety, but that's not the point of the post. The speed with which the players were about to correct the NPC as to the "right" lore and stick their feet in their mouths, coupled with the recent discussion on Au Ra origins from a few weeks ago, has had me thinking about how frequently we position our characters as generally being correct about the setting. This has nothing to do with subjective character opinions like politics or discriminatory attitudes, but more to do with how we don't like our characters to be wrong about the "bones" of the setting. When it comes to how the various magic systems work, or the history of the setting, or how to make magitek function, characters either don't know how to do it and admit as such, or they know the facts and know them in correct and proper fashion. We may have racists in-game, but we tend not to have Flat Earthers.

So to dispel that notion for myself because RP is a wide and varied place, I'm putting these questions to all of you:Â

1.What do your characters believe that you know, OOC, to be fundamentally incorrect about the setting?

2.How do you address people trying to "correct" your character about these misconceptions, especially if it's very important to your character concept? And how often does it happen?

McBeefâ„¢ · **11-01-2016, 07:12 PM**

1) My Character Evangeline firmly believes that the twelve aren't 'real' gods in the sense of powerful holy beings. She views them as not different to the Beast Tribe 'Gods', as in they are just legends, albeit legends that may have some power (As they feed off of the people like primals).Â

2) A lot of characters get in a lot of arguments with her (always ICly) as aestheticism is a relatively normal concept for most people OOCily. People understand the concept of not believing in a god, and I've never caught any flak for it.Â Evangeline however, gets preached at constantly.

There are other things she believes, like that she caused the Republican 'revolution' in Ishgard, and that she is the true Empress of Garlemald. All of which tend to get treated with eye rolls.

I think misinformation works best when it is involving things that involve myth, legend and hearsay in the game. Something like:

"The Syndicate has 8 people in it"Â (It actually has 6 for the record) doesn't work that well, and causes OOC arguments. Almost any character could easily find out the number of people on the syndicate easily if desired.

"The Syndicate are actually all the Sultana's Many Lovers." is better, as it's lurid and the sort of thing people would repeat and knowingly treat as fact.

I think the OOC issues with 'incorrect beliefs' are less about your character being misinformed, and more of the dilemma is causes. If you have a character who is supposed to be relatively worldly and of average intelligence, yet they swear Limsa is to the east of Ul'dah... it kind of stretches plausibility. It makes it seem like suddenly basic geography is some esoteric knowledge.

Oli! · **11-01-2016, 07:28 PM**

Oliwat believes he's a nice guy with decent opinions.

Koen · **11-01-2016, 08:40 PM**

I think it's less a character being correct about everything as it is that most characters tend to come across situations where their knowledge on random topics is tested unless they're an adventurer or some kind of student. A PC alchemist who never stepped foot out of Gridania would obviously know a lot about potions, but if questioned on the current happenings in Ul'dah, they wouldn't have the foggiest. Meanwhile in real life, people have access to so much knowledge through books and the internet that they can have all kinds of odd interests.

As for Koen, he knows what he's experienced and, while not the smartest guy, can figure out basic details of related events. He was there when the Monks were wiped out, and he knows they were labeled as heretics, but he realises they probably pissed off the King of Ruin at some point and that the attack was more political than anything. On the other hand, if he somehow came across some kind of Sharlayan ruin, he wouldn't be able to tell you anything about it, and would just shrug if someone asked his thoughts.

Obviously there are more things than not in the lore that he's completely unaware of, but as for ideas of his that are entirely wrong, it's nothing too major. To give a few examples: he thinks Elezen's pointed ears are just decoration to make them look less like stretched out Hyur; he thinks volcanos are mountains that grew too high and got melted by the sun, and he's positive that most Gridanians walk around in their underwear.

The majority of this misinformation is just because he doesn't have anything other than hearsay and guessing to go off of. He's never been to Gridania, so when someone tells him they walk around mostly naked to be closer to nature, he figures that makes sense and believes them and probably will do so until someone argues otherwise, if it ever gets brought up in a conversation.

Caspar · **11-02-2016, 01:01 AM**

Honestly the number of things my character believes that are right are probably more uncommon than the things that are wrong.

If you spend your entire childhood and teenage years isolated on a small island directly downloading every bit of insight towards killing people you can from a seriously disturbed woman, you tend to have a very particular sort of world view. I spend more time RPing the consequences of this "lack" than I do its "reward."Â My character, for instance, thought marriage was something akin to a sparring partnership.

If there's one in particular, Virara views the Â Chakra as nothing more than another learned "internal technique." For comparison's sake, she has none of the insight Erik shows towards its true nature, or the sense of respect for tradition Widargelt possesses. Simply thinking of the opening of gates as something you can just brute force or learn through dumb perseverance is hindering her progress as a martial artist, as well as her understanding of her own body's limitations.

Virara thinks the Au Ra are related to lizards, and that dragons are merely scalekin as well. Despite the fact that it is incredibly rude, she doesn't see anything wrong with referring to their scales and lizard-like qualities, as she's incapable of racial malice. Miqote are much the same.

Chompie · **11-02-2016, 03:23 PM**

Arblis is chock-full of esoteric worldly trivia, and even the things she doesn't understand, she can often make up a plausible explanation that makes it seem true.

However, there are some pretty major gaps in her knowledge.
She has almost no grasp on Ishgardian history, which really isn't helped by the current upheaval of the whole darn society. Ishgardians are under some kind of blood-curse or something..? And that's what makes them so sarcastic? Why are the nobles nobles again..?

She also- and this one's definitely more in the spirit of the thread- doesn't believe the Elementals are a natural force. She's fairly certain the Padjals created the Elementals as a defensive ward for the Shroud, to try to keep the place how they wanted it. After all, they're just blobs of aether with a purpose, right? That's not much different from a magitek guard or a warding spell or an intruder-detecting void-summoning circle!

Maia · **11-02-2016, 04:02 PM**

Maia believes that talking conversationally to plants will keep them from "turning bad" and attacking her. Gotta keep the would-be treants happy!

She thinks that every huckster in the Ul'dah markets genuinely has her best interests at heart.

To her, "Cait Sith" is a cute doll that's fashioned after a mythological cat who wears a cape and crown, who in turn must be a ruler of... something. She hasn't really figured out the details yet.

---

Trade believes that Eorzeans ride horsebirds because they double as both a traveling mount and an emergency food supply. How practical, these Eorzeans!

He also believes in "Samurai Claus," after mishearing the tale of Starlight. In his version, Samurai Claus poses dramatically on rooftops and delivers swift judgment to children who are naughty.

He also believes he's an expert on Eorzean culture.

Once he was asked to do a "strip show" and proceeded to take off his shirt and describe said shirt in detail. He was very indignant upon being corrected that it didn't mean stripping and then showing off his clothes.

---

I haven't really gotten much flack since most people I RP with generally know how these two are. But I imagine they wouldn't really mix well with everyone, or maybe not even most. XD

Warren Castille · **11-02-2016, 05:19 PM**

I was actually thinking about this kind of topic while driving home sometime last week, and then a song came on and I abandoned it. I got nowhere near as thought-provoking as the OP, though.

I realize reading the rest in this thread that I'm definitely the sort of person to lean on the "ignorant on a subject" vehicle instead of coming up with more creative misunderstandings in the lore. On the subjects of deities and magitek and MSQ revelations I tend to just have my characters shrug and admit to not knowing anything, instead of coming up with reasonably immersive beliefs or explanations.

This has given me a lot to think on.

Aya · **11-02-2016, 05:39 PM**

Aya believes in a whole host of folk lore, some of which (in FF) is admittedly based on reality, but she definitely prescribes to the veracity of almost all of it. She's not terribly well informed on the "revelations" of this expansion, and despite her hostility to Ishgardian Orthodoxy as an institution still holds most of its teachings to be truth. In other words, although nefarious inquisitors abused doctrine and the social iniquity of Ishgardian society for their own wicked ends, that in no way means that Heresy was any less dangerous than they claimed.

Her beliefs regarding the Dragonsong War are more in-line with that ghost, than with the adventurers the OP meta-gamed down. And she is deeply cynical about the supposed change in Ishgard (since to her mind they have not thrown out the bad with the good, but instead thrown out the good (the faith) while keeping the bad (the social structure that enabled the wickedness, and more specifically the individuals who compose it)). In the end, its probably all a draconic trick made possible through heretical agents, and the Fury will not be pleased.

She also believes the Ala Mhigan resistance is a romantic but wasteful effort, another belief likely to be annihilated by an expansion Smile

Though she will gladly lend them her moral support: may they have courage, for their cause is just! It is just that we'd probably all be better off if we focused that energy on improving our lives in the rest of Eorzea.

Melkire · **11-02-2016, 06:32 PM**

Osric has developed, over the course of nearly three years' worth of roleplay, from an agnostic to a non-practicing believer in some of the Twelve. Putting aside whether they ever actually existed, his mental image of them is that of the Archons associated with each... which we know for a certainty to be wrong. Many of his beliefs or suspicions are unorthodox (Nymeia is a cruel-hearted bitch, Llymlaen is a NOT a fickle mistress, Halone is an Ishgardian invention that borrows from Rhalgr and Byregot)... and he doesn't recognize the mother crystal. Any mention of Hydaelyn is met with open disbelief and mockery; the Echo he attributes to a rare naturally-occuring phenomenon rather than a gift from a specific deity.

Tengri, on the other hand, is a full-fledged atheist who refutes the existence of any and all divinities, though he makes a public showing of belief in Azim and Nharma. His background, coupled with first-hand experiences of both the Lifestream and the aetherial sea, forms the basis for his atheism. He chooses instead to believe in such constructs as Fate and Fortune... which is to say coincidence and circumstance.

I treat any and all in-character objections to these beliefs as appropriate: I react in character, as my characters would react. If those objections transition out of character, they are met with sarcasm and more mockery. "My characters can be wrong, you know, and it's my right to play them to whatever degree of ignorance I so wish."

Sometimes I get innocent OoC questions from concerned individuals checking to make sure that I'm aware of my own characters' ignorance. Those, I humor.

K'nahli · **11-02-2016, 11:29 PM**

Both my Xaelan Au Ra believe that all Raen are docile, contemptible beings unworthy of any respect whatsoever. They see them as entirely incapable of strength and would look down upon anyone - especially Xaela - that would be as shameless to so much as associate with them.

Though more of a religious variety, K'nahli occasionally leans toward believing in omens, both bad and good, that betray Azeyma's current favour with her tribe and the lands.

Biscuit_Egi · **11-03-2016, 08:21 AM**

Up until recently Mikh'al genuinely believe that these 'Au Ra' were in fact Miqo'te. Possibly seen at a distance or in armour, maybe even a lost clan of some kind.

Then he met one up close for the first time... Surprise

Another thing he was told once is that Lalafells are not actually 'born' like the other races. They in fact grow out of the ground, like Gysahl Greens. Mikh'al has not yet worked up the courage to ask whether this is true or not, as he fears for his shins should it turn out to be false.

***Maril*** · **11-03-2016, 09:29 AM**

Nailah has always been iffy about magitek - She sees it as a great evil that helped Ala Mhigo's undoing come along, to such an end that she genuinely thinks that if magitek did not exist, then Ala Mhigo would have remained free. She isn't entirely oblivious to the political troubles, the king of ruin and all the chaos that already existed, but I think she has grown to put that as a minor factor because she so desperately wants to believe in the highlanders and the plans to set Ala Mhigo free again. That dream of rebuilding a shattered people, and to feel like she belongs. So because of that she has been if not out right dismissive of then at least very tense in the presence of people that e.g have magitek limbs, use magitek weaponry and otherwise tries to mess with it to invent something new (even if it is "harmless"), with very very few exceptions (and even then, it's more tolerance than acknowledgement). To her, nothing good can come of it.Â How wrong that is, is obviously subjective - it depends a lot on other characters world view. She's met a few people who have tried to convince her, but it has been without success.Â

As for if people bring it up oocly, I simply explain it's an IC opinion and not something that is necessarily factually correct. It'll be interesting to see how the expansion and their fusion of magitek and old architecture is going to pan out, and how it might influence her if/when I take her out of her hiatus.Â

As for my other characters, there's some level of ignorance-based wrongs, such as my au ra not being entirely convinced that all ishgardians aren't still thinking he is part dragon and would want to kill him. He's also not entirely sure about this whole "twelve" business. Things like that tend to either evolve or get smoothed out as my characters meet more people and gain more experiences.

Leggerless · **11-03-2016, 10:22 AM**

Every single chocobo has one name, regardless of their size, color, stature, condition, and etc. That name... is Bird. On top of that, trying to give special names to pets as if they were sentient races is folly and should not be done.

She also thinks all pirates are bad until proven otherwise. Works similarly to "guilty until proven innocent." Main exception is the Maelstrom (and only a few select pirates). Pretty tough to think positively about the people who hunted you down, chased you out of your home, and took away your family. Garleans are also in this boat as well, but to a lesser degree; they're a faction recognized as enemies of the state.

Gegenji · **11-03-2016, 10:33 AM**

If I'm willing to be cynical, Chachan's outlook on life in general could be considered pretty wrong. He thinks everyone has the potential to be good and nice, and that you don't need to kill people ever. You might have to fight, but if you let them live then they'll eventually come around. And not, you know, swear vengeance on you and come after you and your loved ones.

His fighting style currently is also about trying to get people to give up by breaking their weapons and armor and stuff, since he thinks that'll make them want to stop fighting. Instead of, like, continue fighting with impromptu or broken weapons or even barehanded. He's already had to concede that his techniques aren't quite as good against fistfighters, but still holds the belief that his idea will work. Which, so far, hasn't.

Gogon has plenty of things he believes that are wrong - though most of it is due to either his sociopathy or paranoia. All Garleans are scum, basically everyone are either brutes or idiots or both, no one but a select few can be trusted, it's better to hoard and manipulate information than to actually share it willingly. Not to mention his own ego makes him think of himself far more highly than he actually is.

Judge likes to believe he's not actually yelling. But he is still pretty loud and should probably tone it down. Less comically, he's an old man who sees everything in black and white and based on his own stilted views of the world. There's a whole wealth of things he's wrong about but refuses to admit it because that's how he learned it or that's how it was when he was younger.

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[Discussion] Things Your Character Believes That Are Wrong

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