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Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism


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Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism
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Nerov
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RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism |
#110
08-02-2015, 11:36 PM
(08-02-2015, 09:39 PM)Goodfellow Wrote:
(08-02-2015, 07:26 PM)Nero Wrote: But it's not just about creating conflict; it's about making conflict that is compelling and believable. The thing with racism and prejudice in Eorzea is that as far as the general population goes, creating a character who is racist for reasons that aren't superficial is rather difficult because the setting emphasizes a mingling of cultures and a certain open-mindedness that comes from being constantly exposed to different races and customs.

The emphasis above is mine, and please don't think I'm just trying to nitpick, Nero, because in your follow-up comment on the next page, I think that you make a pretty good point.  That being said, I think the bolded section is actually not true.

It can work like that, but it very often does not.  I am mixed-race and live in Texas, where being mixed-race is incredibly common.  And yet, everywhere I look, including within my own mixed-race family, the idea of "mingling cultures" and "different races and customs" is an incredibly fraught subject.  The racism of my region and, to a degree, my family works obviously and explicitly against us despite the fact that we are surrounded by and even composed of different races and customs, are constantly mingling and ever intermarrying and interbreeding, and are never and have never been in a racially or culturally homogenous environment.

I'm not arguing that anyone play a racist or not (much like Sin), and I agree that the aesthetic and much of the presentation of FFXIV belies a great deal of the racial reality presented in the quest flavor text, but I wanted to offer my two gil on the wider subject from a personal (perhaps flawed and anecdotal) perspective.

I actually agree with most of your premise: just because different cultures and races are within proximity with each other for an extended period of time doesn't mean that those cultures and races necessarily get along. In fact, it can potentially exacerbate the issue by encouraging ethnic or cultural categorization and divide a community into groups of "us" and "them". And the longer a community is divided in such a way, the easier it is to see such things as tradition and custom (see: Europe at any time before the 21st century).

However, it's worth keeping in mind the differences when drawing the parallels. Europe and the United States have extensive histories of continued prejudice, racism, and large scale ethnic conflicts. By contrast, Eorzea has had....a relatively peaceful timeline, at least as far as ethnic or cultural conflicts go.

Obviously, a fictional universe that has massive holes in its world building (thanks Square) does not exclude the idea of ethnic conflict, and the lack of evidence does not substitute actual evidence in the slightest. I fully admit this, and this is the part where my argument goes from a rebuttal into pure conjecture.

If we take the past thousand years of the Eorzean timeline from 1572 to 500, the number of notable events that may have spawned racial tension can be counted on one hand. In no particular order: the destruction of Sil'dih by Ul'dah, the Autumn War between Gridania and Ala Mhigo, the invasion of Eorzea by Garlemald, Haldrath's taking of the Eye of Nidhogg, and the great migration of Hyur to Eorzea. Note that this is only including conflicts between the spoken races, and excludes dragons, beast races, and others outside of the five (now six) races.

Again, I emphasize that the lack of evidence does not substitute actual evidence, but at the same time, in-game dialogue and interactions fail to reflect ethnic conflicts outside of those that are massively obvious (Eorzea vs. Garlemald, spoken vs. beast tribes, Ishgard vs. Dravanians, etc.) The differing races, cultures, and allegiances to different city states do show themselves as rivalries at times, but never at a level that remotely indicates widespread or deep-rooted hostility or resentment. And I'm not saying racism does not exist in Eorzea, but that it's not nearly as commonplace as some people make it out to be. As far as the six spoken races interacting with one another go, racism seems to be the exception, not the rule. Those exceptions are notable, but they're just that--exceptions.

Again, most of this is just conjecture with little to back it. But I like to think that after having spent much of recent history cooperating, the city states and by extension the races that dwell in them can get along mostly decently.
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Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Seriphyn - 08-01-2015, 03:51 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Oli! - 08-01-2015, 05:34 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Blue - 08-01-2015, 06:19 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Oli! - 08-01-2015, 06:41 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Nero - 08-01-2015, 10:08 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Blue - 08-01-2015, 10:45 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by K'nahli - 08-01-2015, 09:36 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Gharen - 08-01-2015, 10:04 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Warren Castille - 08-01-2015, 10:49 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by 13uddy - 08-01-2015, 03:53 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Seriphyn - 08-01-2015, 12:10 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Warren Castille - 08-01-2015, 03:01 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Virella - 08-01-2015, 12:58 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Unnamed Mercenary - 08-01-2015, 01:04 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Alderique - 08-01-2015, 01:56 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Virella - 08-01-2015, 02:05 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Alderique - 08-01-2015, 02:13 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Flickering Ember - 08-02-2015, 12:46 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Naunet - 08-02-2015, 01:06 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Flickering Ember - 08-02-2015, 01:38 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Shoshopu - 08-01-2015, 03:09 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Virella - 08-01-2015, 03:25 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Shoshopu - 08-01-2015, 03:33 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Unnamed Mercenary - 08-01-2015, 03:38 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Virella - 08-01-2015, 03:38 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Flashhelix - 08-01-2015, 04:13 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Shoshopu - 08-01-2015, 04:27 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Warren Castille - 08-01-2015, 04:22 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Sin - 08-01-2015, 04:29 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Enla - 08-01-2015, 05:08 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Cailean Lockwood - 08-01-2015, 04:37 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Blue - 08-01-2015, 04:50 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Warren Castille - 08-01-2015, 04:53 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Blue - 08-01-2015, 04:57 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Flashhelix - 08-01-2015, 05:32 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by McBeefâ„¢ - 08-01-2015, 05:06 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by McBeefâ„¢ - 08-01-2015, 05:08 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Cato - 08-01-2015, 05:18 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Gone. - 08-01-2015, 05:33 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Flashhelix - 08-01-2015, 05:40 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by LiadansWhisper - 08-01-2015, 06:40 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Kismet - 08-01-2015, 09:54 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by C'kayah Polaali - 08-01-2015, 06:09 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by A'kos Saiyal - 08-01-2015, 09:28 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by LiadansWhisper - 08-01-2015, 09:30 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by A'kos Saiyal - 08-02-2015, 12:03 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Enla - 08-02-2015, 01:28 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Flashhelix - 08-02-2015, 01:42 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Shoshopu - 08-02-2015, 02:07 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by LiadansWhisper - 08-02-2015, 02:30 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by C'kayah Polaali - 08-02-2015, 04:44 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Flashhelix - 08-02-2015, 02:31 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by abnormalnomad - 08-02-2015, 12:48 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Shoshopu - 08-02-2015, 02:52 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Flashhelix - 08-02-2015, 03:01 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by A'kos Saiyal - 08-02-2015, 02:59 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Fox - 08-02-2015, 03:00 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Moonlit - 08-02-2015, 03:13 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Cato - 08-02-2015, 03:14 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Flickering Ember - 08-02-2015, 01:30 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by FreelanceWizard - 08-02-2015, 01:45 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Flashhelix - 08-02-2015, 02:01 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Marisa - 08-02-2015, 03:15 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by TheLastCandle - 08-02-2015, 08:49 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Kellach Woods - 08-02-2015, 09:07 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Cato - 08-02-2015, 11:57 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Blue - 08-02-2015, 12:03 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Unnamed Mercenary - 08-02-2015, 12:15 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Caspar - 08-02-2015, 02:10 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Flickering Ember - 08-02-2015, 02:42 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Kellach Woods - 08-02-2015, 02:33 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Flickering Ember - 08-02-2015, 02:34 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Naunet - 08-02-2015, 06:16 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Yssen - 08-02-2015, 03:24 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Blue - 08-02-2015, 03:28 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Nadine Marteau - 08-02-2015, 03:28 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by UntrueCrystal - 08-02-2015, 04:18 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Cato - 08-02-2015, 04:48 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Marisa - 08-02-2015, 07:04 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Virella - 08-02-2015, 04:24 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by UntrueCrystal - 08-02-2015, 04:27 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Kellach Woods - 08-02-2015, 04:42 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by V'aleera - 08-02-2015, 06:01 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Virella - 08-02-2015, 06:09 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Kellach Woods - 08-02-2015, 05:00 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Cato - 08-02-2015, 05:06 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Edda - 08-02-2015, 06:03 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Caspar - 08-02-2015, 08:03 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Nero - 08-02-2015, 07:26 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Cato - 08-02-2015, 07:37 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Fox - 08-02-2015, 07:46 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Cato - 08-02-2015, 07:57 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Fox - 08-02-2015, 08:03 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by McBeefâ„¢ - 08-02-2015, 07:37 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by V'aleera - 08-02-2015, 07:41 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Marisa - 08-02-2015, 07:47 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Nero - 08-02-2015, 07:59 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by UntrueCrystal - 08-02-2015, 08:40 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Fox - 08-02-2015, 08:46 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Caspar - 08-02-2015, 08:49 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by LiadansWhisper - 08-02-2015, 09:47 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Goodfellow - 08-02-2015, 09:39 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Nero - 08-02-2015, 11:36 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Cato - 08-02-2015, 08:54 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by UntrueCrystal - 08-02-2015, 08:56 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Fox - 08-02-2015, 09:09 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Enla - 08-02-2015, 09:12 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Fox - 08-02-2015, 09:20 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Sin - 08-02-2015, 09:27 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Kage - 08-03-2015, 01:13 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by McBeefâ„¢ - 08-03-2015, 02:26 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Kellach Woods - 08-03-2015, 06:21 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Kage - 08-03-2015, 08:28 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Kellach Woods - 08-04-2015, 06:21 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Blue - 08-03-2015, 04:17 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Caspar - 08-03-2015, 05:04 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Ignacius - 08-03-2015, 09:05 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Verad - 08-03-2015, 10:03 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by LiadansWhisper - 08-03-2015, 01:56 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Verad - 08-03-2015, 03:51 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by LiadansWhisper - 08-03-2015, 03:54 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Verad - 08-03-2015, 04:05 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Cato - 08-04-2015, 03:31 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Cailean Lockwood - 08-04-2015, 06:16 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Cato - 08-04-2015, 06:30 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Kellach Woods - 08-04-2015, 09:10 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by LiadansWhisper - 08-04-2015, 09:26 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Flickering Ember - 08-04-2015, 11:56 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Kage - 08-04-2015, 09:53 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Flashhelix - 08-05-2015, 12:08 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Flickering Ember - 08-05-2015, 12:47 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by LiadansWhisper - 08-05-2015, 12:56 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Kage - 08-05-2015, 01:12 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by LiadansWhisper - 08-05-2015, 01:24 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Kage - 08-05-2015, 01:29 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by LiadansWhisper - 08-05-2015, 01:39 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Kage - 08-05-2015, 08:29 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Flickering Ember - 08-05-2015, 01:44 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by LiadansWhisper - 08-05-2015, 01:45 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Kellach Woods - 08-05-2015, 06:25 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Blue - 08-05-2015, 06:20 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Cato - 08-05-2015, 09:14 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Flickering Ember - 08-05-2015, 11:07 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Qhora Bajihri - 08-05-2015, 03:09 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Nadine Marteau - 08-05-2015, 03:56 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Lilia Lia - 08-05-2015, 04:13 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Nadine Marteau - 08-05-2015, 04:52 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Lilia Lia - 08-05-2015, 05:08 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Qhora Bajihri - 08-05-2015, 05:41 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Lilia Lia - 08-05-2015, 05:50 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Cato - 08-05-2015, 11:32 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Flickering Ember - 08-05-2015, 01:28 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by FreelanceWizard - 08-05-2015, 11:52 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Cato - 08-05-2015, 11:59 AM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Kage - 08-05-2015, 04:35 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Kellach Woods - 08-05-2015, 04:38 PM
RE: Avoiding contemporary liberalism in RP and embracing traditional conservatism - by Cato - 08-05-2015, 05:20 PM

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