(08-06-2017, 03:34 PM)Valic Wrote: I feel like you both linked the video I referenced in my comment
I mean, you said "in the ARR they had shown them in the trailer like the adventurer's guild gives them to people looking for gil" so I wasn't sure if the video we linked, which was from 1.0, was what you were talking about?
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(08-06-2017, 03:34 PM)Valic Wrote: And while I have Sounssy >3>, while I hate to dig this back up from a couple pages ago but I'm truly not sure how to explain what exactly determines polarities in spells. Rather what "source" or what depicts your spells to be astral/umbral.
I'll try answering this as best as I am able. Relinking all of the background polarity and elemental wheel lore first:
- Aether and Magic Lore Compilation Index
- Essences & Permutations: A Treatise of the Six Elements
- Manipulating the Polarities Two, Astral versus Umbral
Essences and Permutations - A Treatise of the Six Elements Wrote:Chapter IV - Dynamic Opposites & the Bifurcation of Polarity
The six elements are manifest in all things great and small, and their polarity deriveth from the Astral heavens above and the Umbral depths below.
![[Image: jHVmB15.jpg]](http://i.imgur.com/jHVmB15.jpg)
Ignore the black and white triangles. Those are the three Conquers and three Submissions, respectively.
The three elements on the top half of the elemental wheel are: Wind, Lightning, Fire. These are the three elements that are most strongly polarized towards the Astral "heavens above." While the three elements on the bottom half of the wheel (Water, Ice, Earth) are most strongly polarized towards the Umbral "depths below." Why? Because that's how ancient scholars determined it to be, I guess.
Lorecast 9 Wrote:Gamer Escape: This one slipped through the cracks of our last chat, so let’s start here. The properties of aetherial energies have gotten a bit confusing.
Once upon a time, the only binary in the game was [astral & umbral]. These polarities existed in all things, and seemed to be part of the six elements rather than independent forces. Since A Realm Reborn, a second binary exists: [Light & Darkness]. As one might expect, NPCs don’t seem very well informed about these concepts, using phrases like “void energy†and “umbral energy†and “Dark energyâ€. As time went on, we even started to see Dark and Light sprites! Can you help us understand the boundaries for these concepts? Are they in any way related?
Koji Fox: So, you have the elements—and it’s still six elements, there are no newly-discovered ones. Those elements have charges—umbral and astral. If something has “umbral energyâ€, it is one or more of those elements, individual or combined. So if elements have an umbral charge, it can be said that they are “umbral energiesâ€. That’s where those terms come from, “astral energies†and “umbral energies†are not individual things, it’s a blanket term. Light and Dark are not elements, but they are energies…in a different sense. They are not elements, they are not of the elements, and they are not astral or umbral. It’s a different type of energy. You might see a Light and Dark sprite and think, oh, they must be elemetals, but those are made of an entirely different form of energy.
In 1.0, Thaumaturges didn't use elemental magic like they do in ARR. The full elemental wheel belonged to the Conjurers and Thaumaturges focused primarily upon spells woven directly from the polarities two: Astral and Umbral. While the Thaumaturges of ARR now teach one to manipulate the Astral and Umbral polarities within oneself, the Thaumaturges in 1.0 actually also influenced the Astral and Umbral polarities within others as well, making them weaker to certain types of magicks. Because back in 1.0, elemental magic resistances were still a thing. You couldn't use dragonfire dive or flaming arrow on Ifrit because Ifrit was fire-based and so were those two abilities.
So how does Astral and Umbral magic play into this? Well, each Astral-aspected spell dealt the damage of the three Astrally-aspected elements and the same applied to Umbral-aspected spells. For example:
![[Image: KuFZkPA.png]](http://i.imgur.com/KuFZkPA.png)
Astral = Wind, Lightning, Fire
![[Image: BGtkGF6.png]](http://i.imgur.com/BGtkGF6.png)
Umbral = Water, Ice, Earth
So if you were fighting, say, a Fire Elemental, you would not use Astral-aspected spells such as Banish or Dia because you would then only be dealing 66% of the spell's damage. Fire elementals being immune to fire-aspected damage at that point. As a Thaumaturge you would elect to weaken said fire elemental to Umbral magick, which would deal the full 100%. After casting Scourge, you could then follow up with a spell whose elemental aspect fell Umbrally upon the wheel, such as Damnation or Poison:
![[Image: 0H8bmjZ.png]](http://i.imgur.com/0H8bmjZ.png)
![[Image: GXl4bcB.png]](http://i.imgur.com/GXl4bcB.png)
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(08-06-2017, 03:34 PM)Valic Wrote: I get that being in an area like Thanalan is more umbral being hot and dry but what in that determines why it's hot/dry/umbral heat? Just it's destination on the planet in reference to something or are the polarities not based on position or anything in particular?
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Is the area umbrally-polarized because it's hot and dry, or is the area hot and dry because it's umbrally-polarized? The Thanalan wastes were once lush grasslands and forests, until (what the scholars hypothesize was) the 3rd Umbral Era. But the 3rd Umbral Era was aspected as Fire, which is more Astrally-aspected. Does that have any bearing? I'm afraid I really just don't have an answer for you. Some things are just not yet known in absolutes.
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You also asked me at one point about the girl, Arya, from the RDM questline citing she had difficulties healing due to her aether being more umbrally aligned. I was unable to find such a statement. Nor was I able to find the similarly mentioned statement about Alisaie's aether. Yes, both Arya and Alisaie were cited as being less adept at performing curative magicks, but the reasonings given for this were not in reference to the polarity of their aether. At least not that I could find?
Even so, not all restorative magicks are Astrally aligned (though many are, such as Esuna, Protect, and Raise). Remember that Conjurers could pull from both sides of the elemental wheel. Stoneskin, being earth-aspected, is more polarized towards Umbral. And cure spells from both conjurers and thaumaturges are elementally neutral:
![[Image: A0mh5rO.png]](http://i.imgur.com/A0mh5rO.png)
![[Image: aaXGtQv.png]](http://i.imgur.com/aaXGtQv.png)
Hope that helps answer your questions!
(edit: added a more appropriate spell example)
