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LiadansWhisper · **01-16-2014, 07:36 PM**

(01-16-2014, 07:12 PM)ansemaru Wrote: [*]What is the difference between an elemental and a Primal? They're both powerful entities manifested from aether, whose will does not always favor the lives and well-being of mortals. Neither of them are part of the Twelve, but they are both regarded as powerful- though the former are respected and deferred to, while the latter are violently opposed.

I typed this out and it got eaten somehow. The basic difference is that Primals require huge amounts of aether to summon, and once summoned, they consume massive amounts of aether to keep their corporeal forms. They can (and have) stripped the land of so much aether that it dies.

As far as we know, Elementals require no aether to summon, and they do not need to consume aether to remain corporeal. Now, it may simply be that Elementals consciously refuse to consume the aether, or that they simply can't (given that they are aether themselves). Also, as was pointed out in the other thread, the Elementals are nature aether given form, which seems to differentiate them from Primals (who exist outside of aether, and use aether to give themselves a corporeal form).

Quote:I admit it may be kind of obvious that I have a different perspective on the issue of elementals than a lot of the people involved in previous threads. I don't necessarily believe that they're a force for good or an all-powerful force that must needs be appeased rather than avoided or opposed.

I've never said they were a force for good.

Quote:And I admit I'm also quite sensitive to the plight of the Duskwights,

Has nothing to do with the Elementals. Â In fact, there were Duskwights involved in the initial peace between mankind and the Elementals. Â Remember, everyone was living in caves. Â Duskwights are the ones who never left the caves.

Quote:the Ala Mhigans,

We don't know what that particular Ala Mhigan did, but there are other Ala Mhigan refugees who have been accepted into Gridania. Â In particular, during the Carpentry quest you run into one that's a high-ranking officer in the Twin Adders. Â What's more, Ala Mhigo was not a sunshines and puppies place. Â They were a serous issue for Gridania prior to the coup that placed the Garleans in power. Â Also: Forestborn are xenophobic. Â We are told this repeatedly.

Quote:the Keepers of the Moon,

Okay, I get that you are referencing the poacher tribes. Â But you realize that there are quite a few Keepers of the Moon who are already in Gridania, accepted as citizens? Â They're even in the Twin Adders, and you work with several on a few quests. Â Is there static between some of them (specifically between Elezen and some Miqo'te), yes. Â That doesn't mean that the Elementals are excluding them. Â The poachers are either those who refused to live under the same rules as the rest of the Gridanians, or they are very possibly migrating tribes fleeing the situation north and east of the Shroud.

Quote:the beast tribes,

I don't even know why you are making a fuss about this with regards to Gridania/the Elementals. Â As far as we know, the Ixal were exiled because they broke their end of the pact with the Elementals. Â They weren't immediately killed, they were just kicked out. Â Gridania had a peaceful pact with them, and we have no reason to believe it was Gridania that broke the deal, given the Ixali penchant for doing such themselves. Â Gridania has a standing pact with the Sylphs - something that Ul'dah, for instance, doesn't really understand. Â There's peace between those two peoples, and Gridania hasn't broken their end of the deal, nor do they abuse or otherwise harm the Sylphs. Â The Elementals, for their part, appear to accept the Sylphs as part of the forest as well. Â There's no reason to believe either is actively mistreating the Sylphs.

Seriously, if you wanna go after someone for how they treat the beastribes, go look at Ul'dah or Limsa. Â Gridania and the Elementals come off looking like fucking saints in comparison.

Quote:and all of those cast out or alienated by traditional Gridanian thinking.

Far as I know, it isn't incumbent on Gridania to change to suit outsiders. Â Outsiders should be changing to suit Gridania.

Quote:But I want to have an open discussion about this, because it's a fascinating topic, and I think it'd be a shame if it were kept only to tangents in somewhat-related threads.

True!