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DoomsdayClock · **10-13-2014, 07:01 PM**

(10-13-2014, 06:57 PM)Aya Wrote:
(10-13-2014, 06:49 PM)Mamushi Wrote: Instead of making a public announcement on a board frequented by people who do not know, care or share the same server as the individuals involved, the matter could be handled privately within the circle of people it affects. This comes across as deliberate attention-seeking.
Not... at all.

This event touches a significant proportion of the users of this site. This is the appropriate forum.

^ I agree. The topic is also relevant beyond this single situation.

Parvacake · **10-13-2014, 07:01 PM**

(10-13-2014, 06:57 PM)Aya Wrote:
(10-13-2014, 06:49 PM)Mamushi Wrote: Instead of making a public announcement on a board frequented by people who do not know, care or share the same server as the individuals involved, the matter could be handled privately within the circle of people it affects. This comes across as deliberate attention-seeking.
Not... at all.

This event touches a significant proportion of the users of this site. This is the appropriate forum.

I believe this is more then appropriate since it also highlights a very real thing in the RP community: IC death. Does it happen very often? Not always, no, but it does happen.

FreelanceWizard · **10-13-2014, 07:05 PM**

For what it's worth, there's not a really good place on the RPC for this; RP Discussion is probably the best spot of the available choices, to be honest (if it were the consequences of an event, it could go on that event thread, I suppose). It can be a bit of a big deal when a character known by a lot of people dies in a public way, and so I don't necessarily see anything wrong with this post or where it is. The overarching topic ("how does one deal with character death by another PC") also has relevance to the overall community.

So, that said, carry on.

#magicAdminHat

Aya · **10-13-2014, 07:07 PM**

On the matter of the topic at hand, I do hope that the one whose hand was responsible either is alright with what happened, or has some way to get out of it (going as far as retconning).

I understand both points of view on this: that a player should know that his character may kill another character in a certain situation, and that knowingly employing a lethal weapon is inherently a recognition of that possibility.Â Nonetheless, because of the ramifications involved, I would certainly hope that the player actually wishes this upon his character rather than feeling it forced upon him, because that seems like it would serve no one.

On the flip side, everyone's characters should be free to have the IC response that they wish.Â If that includes seeking vengeance, so be it, why should the meta-game be brought in to forswear what may be an entirely appropriate in-character response?

Obviously I don't think that there should be any OOC animosity involved, but its a pretty serious situation for the characters to have one person they know, killed by another.

Val · **10-13-2014, 07:17 PM**

(10-13-2014, 07:07 PM)Aya Wrote: Obviously I don't think that there should be any OOC animosity involved, but its a pretty serious situation for the characters to have one person they know, killed by another.

And that's the incrediblyÂ wonderful thing about these opportunities. Friendships are forged and enemies are made. People get to interact on a level they never would have before. It's a very deepÂ topic that can bring characters closer together under a banner or alienate them otherwise. This is how a lot of unexpected, server-wide and incredibly fun, spontaneous events get started. The potential is huge for those involved, and really shouldn't be shunned or swept under the rug or retconned. I suppose if that's something the player wants to somehow do, whatever. But officers/upholders of the law/whatever should know that they have a chance to kill someone when they shoot at them or try to stop him, just as soldiers know that going to war inevitably means someone is going to die by their hands.

He may not have meant to kill the person, but people avoid going to hospitals for wound treatment due to various reasons and die. It's not necessarily the person's fault, and some may sympathize with them while others may wish them dead for what they did. I just personally feel that the RP community as a whole has a lot of interaction that they can gain with this, and to stifle it just feels.. wrong.

Gaspard · **10-13-2014, 07:18 PM**

Let's take a quick recap.

As mentioned here, Nat trespassed on some grounds, character B shot 'at' her, the shot landed.

Yeah, if you fire a gun at a living thing there's no retconning. The person made the conscious choice to have his character attack another character with lethal force. This is also part of roleplaying, and part of consequence, and honestly, I love it that Nat did this.

Also, just as a reminder towards the whole 'trespassing' Idea. The use of deadly force to protect your property is 'mostly' an american thing (mind you, mostly). In most European countries if you kill somebody it doesn't matter if it was your home, the street, or under the kitchen table; If he did not assault you with the intend to kill you you have no right to use lethal force.

But I guess that'd have to be filed under 'What is Eorzean Law' trivia

McBeefâ„¢ · **10-13-2014, 07:19 PM**

Aya you are probably right. For the record I have no issue with retconning it so she took a bullet from a generic maelstrom person.

While I do like to RP that violence is serious business, I don't want to put someones character through that if they are not willing.

I would rather leave it as is of course, but just giving the person an out.

allgivenover · **10-13-2014, 07:21 PM**

...lol

Edit: Not sure how the rest of my post was lost. I'd have to say there's something seriously wrong if people were actually angry OOC at you killing your character off or the player behind the character that did it. Our own characters kill other members of the five races all the time in the game story. It's not a big deal.

Gaspard · **10-13-2014, 07:22 PM**

I don't know, I understand that people shouldn't be 'forced' to do things against their personal prefference in regards to their character, but at the same time, if my character makes use of lethal force (I.e a Gun), he can't expect the world to love him or to be painted in the light of a hero. That just sounds like..shying away from negatives in your rp.

Aysun · **10-13-2014, 07:27 PM**

(10-13-2014, 07:21 PM)allgivenover Wrote: ...lol

Most poignant post in the thread (though it was apparently glitched). XDD

I think it's kind of weird to announce this OOCly like this, when it's something that happened ICly. Seems to me a better course of action would have been that the players involved directly can talk to their friends about it in private if they need to, and allow characters to find out ICly as they come across the news in RP. But to each their own!

cuideag · **10-13-2014, 07:28 PM**

(10-13-2014, 07:22 PM)Gaspard Wrote: I don't know, I understand that people shouldn't be 'forced' to do things against their personal prefference in regards to their character, but at the same time, if my character makes use of lethal force (I.e a Gun), he can't expect the world to love him or to be painted in the light of a hero. That just sounds like..shying away from negatives in your rp.

Nailed it.

Aya · **10-13-2014, 07:40 PM**

(10-13-2014, 07:22 PM)Gaspard Wrote: I don't know, I understand that people shouldn't be 'forced' to do things against their personal prefference in regards to their character, but at the same time, if my character makes use of lethal force (I.e a Gun), he can't expect the world to love him or to be painted in the light of a hero. That just sounds like..shying away from negatives in your rp.

There are a lot of different ways that people RP combat in MMO RPGs.Â I've been witness to cases where death was simply off the table, bad guys are beat up, and knocked unconscious, rather than killed, and the same for the protagonists.Â Yes, its not as "gritty", its not as "dark", its not as "believable" but its still perfectly valid RP that people do for enjoyment and story-building.

That's why its easy to see why someone might pull that trigger in the moment, IC-ly, without really connecting the dots on the possible ramifications.Â Such as former friends now unwilling to even meet your gaze, let alone talk to you.Â Becoming a pariah within the social circles that you used to frequent, or perhaps even being hunted, or hounded by those with whom you once broke bread.Â Ultimately this is a game, played for fun, and if that is something that would ruin the fun, rather than contributing to it, than that should be the player's decision to willingly make.

Perhaps there is value in trying to enforce "realistic" ramifications to every action that occurs within a scenario.Â But no one should ever feel railroaded into an unwanted situation, period.

Now, we've gone on quite a while about this particular bit, and I have no ideas whatosever what the person in question here actually wants or wishes, instead my point is:

Serious RP actions should have serious RP consequences.Â If a player does not wish for his or her character to have to deal with said consequences, then the character ought not carry out the serious RP action.Â Better to claim that the action did not actually take place (or in this case took place at the hands of another), than to try to draw a meta-game shield around the character to prevent the consequences.

McBeefâ„¢ · **10-13-2014, 08:01 PM**

I think a lot of good points are being raised here. At the crux of it all is that violence is violence. It tends to get played off in a world where everyone always survives everything. But a gun is a gun, a sword is a sword. There are plenty of ways to RP where you will never conflict physically with other players. However if you do, you can't really expect if they take you seriously.

I believe the character's words were something like, "Make one move and this bullet will go straight through your armor and kill you."

Welp, Nat made a move, he was right.

allgivenover · **10-13-2014, 08:09 PM**

I have to give you some kudos for actually killing your character off. It's something that's rarely done in roleplay permanently. I had full intentions of pulling it in another game, but my friends managed to convince me not to go through it.

Should have though, that would've been a better way for her story to end instead of what ended up happening.

GloryRhodes · **10-13-2014, 08:28 PM**

I personally think this whole thing is super interesting, makes for great RP and is cool beanso.

Spahro is even happier about it, but she's awful.

Before things devolve...

RPC has moved! These pages have been kept for historical purposes