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Lost River · **06-20-2015, 04:11 PM**

>_> Not to push my Roegadyn agenda, but yes. <_<

Flickering Ember · **06-20-2015, 04:13 PM**

As a possible suggestion, why not have a miqo'te raised by a non-hyur as the topic seems to be shifting towards now? It isn't just 'player lore' that city miqo'te are a thing. They are common in actual lore too. There isn't much to separate a city miqo'te and one raised by hyur, but there ARE notable differences with the other races.

I haven't run into very many adopted miqo'te, not as much as this thread implies. Though I imagine a lot of people RP it because it is one of the most common back stories available in fantasy RP. ( Though it is also one of my faces <3 ) From the POV of someone in the audience, I personally would be MUCH more interested in learning about a miqo'te adopted by a sea wolf than I would a miqo'te adopted by a midlander.

Leomoon · **06-20-2015, 05:18 PM**

(06-19-2015, 06:10 PM)Faye Wrote:
(06-19-2015, 05:58 PM)Kousagi Wrote: Transethnic characters?
How does the RP community fare with this? Are there other players who have characters of Miqo'te ethnicity, but brought up by Hyur families? I'm talking people who were basically infants at their time of adoption, probably having Hyur-sounding names and generally being Hyur by culture?

There are plenty of them. It's just a convenient way to play a Miqo'te while avoiding all the lore that comes along with them, so naturally a lot of people gravitate to that. They're typically pretty well-received by the community, but I would warn anyone wishing to play one that they've become a cliche and a lot of players are tired of seeing them.

As for character from "far-off lands," I'm not very far into HW yet but so far there's no evidence of any Miqo'te anywhere around Ishgard, so that one could be hard to justify. A lot of people play characters from other countries, however. Outliers exist, sure, and they typically have an understandable draw to them. The problem is then that everyone wants to play an outlier, and they stop being outliers. It's sort of... polite, I guess, to conform to lore for that reason? I don't really feel confined, though. The KISS method has its merits. A character should be interesting for their interaction with others and the depth and detail of their personalities, not for all the templates you can stack onto them, or all the twists in their backstory, or all their unique attributes.

There is a NPC you can do a post moggle side quest wit and she was raised by a female Hyur. The only difference is in her speech to none Miqo'te's she replaces words with now wit mew or no with nya. they really just do not act or do much with clans mainly because the clan themselfs see them as outsides much like a Hyur or Elazen, they will talk, trade and give you task but they won't allow you into the clan as a family member unless you are willing to strip all of your Hyur ties.

Renata Lynn · **06-20-2015, 06:54 PM**

Callie is a Midlander-raised Keeper. While she doesn't know much about being a Mi'qote, or even about being a Keeper, she's eager to learn.Â

She's spunky and sassy and while I was so reluctant to make a Mi'qote, she is SO MUCH FUN to play.

Flickering Ember · **06-20-2015, 07:23 PM**

(06-20-2015, 12:19 AM)Lilia Lia Wrote: I feel I should clarify something.

There are some people who feel personally let-down when they realize, too late, that the distinctive quality they meant to give their character is actually the opposite of distinctive.Â This is a subjective feeling that some people get towards their own characters and it's the main reason to caution someone who is considering basing a character around an idea that's a teensie bit overdone.Â

For some people, they realize only too late that their character backstory is an instance of an overdone player trope, and that bothers them because they genuinely wanted to use it as a way of making their character stand out.Â From a lore point of view, the concept of a miqo'te who was raised by hyur parents is unique, which is part of the charm of it.Â But the fact is that in the player community, it's just the opposite.Â And people wouldn't know this unless they were told ahead of time.Â That's really the only reason I see it as a courtesy to alert people to how widespread it is.Â

If it doesn't bother you that you'll be one of the many playing a very similar backstory, then that's really all that should matter.Â But there are people that would want to avoid this kind of thing for their own reasons, so knowing ahead of time can be helpful to them.

To put it another way:Â It's now a kind of fan-made lore that miqo'tes tend to be adopted and raised in cities.Â It's so commonplace, in fact, that it's almost the norm.Â Many characters you meet will not be surprised to learn this about you.Â You may find this to be disappointing.Â And for that reason it won't really be a distinctive feature of your character like you may have intended for it to be.

This only really matters if you intend for the city-raised tribe-ignorant backstory to be anomalous or to be going against the grain.Â I think a lot of players do intend this because they write that story with the official lore in mind, without taking into account what you might call the "player-made lore" which is in reality going to form a significant part of the actual RP experience.Â Does that make sense?

Also, as a disclaimer, I don't mean to offend any of the many adopted miqo'te who are certainly replying to this thread.Â I'm only saying that there are some people who would decide against making this a major part of their character if they knew how common it was.Â And there are players in the community who find it refreshing when they meet a miqo'te who actually does have a tribal background, so that alone makes it an attractive option when considering the kind of character you want to RP.Â You COULD be the first tribal miqo'te that a lot of people meet, and firsts like that are always interesting.

This entire post is really great for anyone considering a new character. I wanted to quote this post to basically say I agree with everything written here. I even bolded a few sentences that I find to be especially important. I don't know if I could even do this post justice by paraphrasing it in my own written voice.

Though I think it would be helpful to note some of what Faye said in her posts. I, for the most part agree with her posts as well. Your character's personality and how they interact with other characters will be the most important feature about your character. Your back story will help dictate what kind of personality they could of developed and as well as open up future storylines. But back story won't always come into play with every RP scene like personality does.

So, regardless of your back story, having a strong personality can help your character out.

I know for me personally, I do appreciate uniqueness and the ability to stand out. It does bug me when RPers or other players say that this isn't something that should be a factor. For some people it is. And I know that not only do I look for uniqueness in my own characters but I look for them in other people's characters as well. Now, I think 'uniqueness' is less dictated by how 'uncommon' your back story is and more about how your character is portrayed.

And on the topic of uniqueness, I'm going to have to disagree with some of you. I have met plenty of miqo'te who are completely unique characters from the rest of the miqo'te playerbase. I know a lot of strongly written characters of this race. They are pretty much proof that it doesn't matter how highly populated your character's race is-- you still can write something unique.

Renata Lynn · **06-20-2015, 08:03 PM**

Callie's upbringing explains some of her values, but that aspect of her was not what was intended to set her apart. I'd like her to stand out on her own merits, not because of her upbringing.

WorstRPerEver · **06-20-2015, 08:50 PM**

This thread worries me a bit. I've got a Miqo'te with an unconventional name (didn't know if I'd be RPing or sticking around when I got the 14-day trial) and when I found out that there were actual naming conventions for all the races I was like "oh crap what if people are really strict about names on here?"

No one will string me up over a campfire and grill me for my character's name, I hope. ._.

Qhora Bajihri · **06-20-2015, 08:55 PM**

(06-20-2015, 08:50 PM)WorstRPerEver Wrote: This thread worries me a bit. ._.

I've got a Miqo'te with an unconventional name (didn't know if I'd be RPing or sticking around when I got the 14-day trial) and when I found out that there were actual naming conventions for all the races I was like "oh crap what if people are really strict about names on here?"

They're not, mostly. I think a lot of people are in some kind of boat like that, either the conventions didn't exist when they thought up the name or they didn't initially intend to roleplay. It's a fun reason to come up with an interesting excuse why your name doesn't fit the conventions or to ask people to call you something that isn't what shows up over your head.

Your name's reeeally familiar. *suspicious eyes*

D'aito Kuji · **06-21-2015, 01:09 AM**

(i messed up the quote thing - sorry)

@FAYE Totally agree with what you said. Â It's doesn't bug me when players develop stories and background for themselves that might be contrary to some part of the Lore. Â It's a very natural thing. Â But what I find fun is finding my creativity within the box I'm given. Â So many people "think outside the box" now that I think a lot of people are missing the value of what's actually in it. Â I love the Miqo'te lore as it is and try to stay within it as much as possible because I like the challenge of developing a character within those limits.

For me (and my interpretation of the Lore) the Miqo'te do not generally have a human-like, real world nuclear family (mother, father, sister, brother, etc). Â The naming conventions pretty much spell out how things are for the Miqo'te. Â No one has to stick to that but it seems to me like most people want to diverge. Â We want our characters to be special or specifically unspecial in some way that makes them exotic because it helps explain why they are different than the NPCs and other characters around them. Â There has to be a hero's journey and that can't happen to just anyone.

And so many stories about adventures feature protagonists who weren't raised by their family from Moses to Superman to Conan the Barbarian to Luke Skywalker. Â That this story trope is so common it has to have some meaning and I think it's novelty. Â Novelty is why we so enjoy stories about how donkey and goat were friends and were sad when they were separated and filled with joy when reunited. Â It's unusual. Â In our everyday life, adoption is rather uncommon (though my father was adopted). Â That novelty is attractive that we don't always recognize that adopted characters in fiction are as common as they are.

None of this means I'm in any way opposed to people playing what they want and I don't want to cause any offense at all.

For me though, I want to play a traditional Miqo'te who was taught to read by a knowledgeable Tia, who then read books about adventure and became intoxicated with the idea of "chasing the horizon." Â She leaves her tribe to fulfill her dream and has varying degrees of success, mostly humorous but sometimes serious. Â When asked about her past, she talks about traditional life, expresses confusion over eternal bonding, has little use for Tias or Nuhns (and most other races), side eyes Keepers, and finds herself inexplicably attracted to Huyr (that's my own fanciful thing). Â Some part of her is guilty about leaving her tribe and she knows that she should return for breeding at some point.

But that's my take. Â No one has to be Lore compliant but I guess I'd like to see more people give it a shot. Â Limitations are sometimes the best inspiration for creativity.

Magellan · **06-21-2015, 01:27 AM**

@Daitokuji:

But... in order to actually rp with people, you have to be the trope: 'adventurer dissatisfied with home, seeks new horizons'.

It's 6 in one, half dozen in the other.

Traditional Seekers are reclusive, keeping to their tribes, generally not making contact with the outside world. There are small pockets of Miqo that engage in tribal rp exclusively with each other and that's awesome. But any Miqo who has entered the wider world has embraced a vastly overused trope. Whether it be 'the exile' 'seeks new horizons' Â or 'adopted' most rpers.... actually want their characters to rp with other people. So they used the trope that best suits them as to why their character is no longer in the tribe.

Faye · **06-21-2015, 01:36 AM**

(06-21-2015, 01:27 AM)Magellan Wrote: @Daitokuji:

But... in order to actually rp with people, you have to be the trope: 'adventurer dissatisfied with home, seeks new horizons'.

It's 6 in one, half dozen in the other.

Traditional Seekers are reclusive, keeping to their tribes, generally not making contact with the outside world. There are small pockets of Miqo that engage in tribal rp exclusively with each other and that's awesome. But any Miqo who has entered the wider world has embraced a vastly overused trope. Whether it be 'the exile' 'seeks new horizons' Â or 'adopted' most rpers.... actually want their characters to rp with other people. So they used the trope that best suits them as to why their character is no longer in the tribe.

Miqo'te lore screwed over Seeker role-players in that regard BUT! there are ways to spin it other than "adventurer" or "adopted." For example, I have a Seeker who was sort of the runt of the tribe, a wimp, who spent more time at home reading and daydreaming than doing anything productive for the tribe, which led to some resentment from her tribe. She read a lot of romance novels and books about other places and cultures, and romanticized them in her mind. She preferred the allure of them rather than the feral tribal life that she just didn't fit in with, so she left after her mother died.

I have another Seeker who was kicked from her tribe when her interest in technology and all things Magitek and Allagan was feared to be traitorous or sympathetic to Garleans. I have another Seeker whose tribe disbanded due to internal power struggle, betrayal, and its leader being murdered by one of their own. Another alternative: my RP partner plays a Nunh who was exiled from his tribe when he began abusing his position and mistreating the women in his tribe. There are plenty of alternatives for anyone wanting their own twist on things!

Magellan · **06-21-2015, 01:46 AM**

(06-21-2015, 01:36 AM)Faye Wrote:
(06-21-2015, 01:27 AM)Magellan Wrote: @Daitokuji:

But... in order to actually rp with people, you have to be the trope: 'adventurer dissatisfied with home, seeks new horizons'.

It's 6 in one, half dozen in the other.

Traditional Seekers are reclusive, keeping to their tribes, generally not making contact with the outside world. There are small pockets of Miqo that engage in tribal rp exclusively with each other and that's awesome. But any Miqo who has entered the wider world has embraced a vastly overused trope. Whether it be 'the exile' 'seeks new horizons' Â or 'adopted' most rpers.... actually want their characters to rp with other people. So they used the trope that best suits them as to why their character is no longer in the tribe.

Miqo'te lore screwed over Seeker role-players in that regard BUT! there are ways to spin it other than "adventurer" or "adopted." For example, I have a Seeker who was sort of the runt of the tribe, a wimp, who spent more time at home reading and daydreaming than doing anything productive for the tribe, which led to some resentment from her tribe. She read a lot of romance novels and books about other places and cultures, and romanticized them in her mind. She preferred the allure of them rather than the feral tribal life that she just didn't fit in with, so she left after her mother died.

I have another Seeker who was kicked from her tribe when her interest in technology and all things Magitek and Allagan was feared to be traitorous or sympathetic to Garleans. I have another Seeker whose tribe disbanded due to internal power struggle, betrayal, and its leader being murdered by one of their own. Another alternative: my RP partner plays a Nunh who was exiled from his tribe when he began abusing his position and mistreating the women in his tribe. There are plenty of alternatives for anyone wanting their own twist on things!

I have actually met a lot more 'outsider' and 'exile' Miqo (especially amongst Tias and Nuhns) then I have adopted Miqo.

And yet, despite the fact that this trope is heavily overused, all the characters you described sound interesting to me. A trope doesn't define a character, who they are in the here and now does.

D'aito Kuji · **06-21-2015, 01:48 AM**

(06-21-2015, 01:27 AM)Magellan Wrote: @Daitokuji:

But... in order to actually rp with people, you have to be the trope: 'adventurer dissatisfied with home, seeks new horizons'.

It's 6 in one, half dozen in the other.

Traditional Seekers are reclusive, keeping to their tribes, generally not making contact with the outside world. There are small pockets of Miqo that engage in tribal rp exclusively with each other and that's awesome. But any Miqo who has entered the wider world has embraced a vastly overused trope. Whether it be 'the exile' 'seeks new horizons' Â or 'adopted' most rpers.... actually want their characters to rp with other people. So they used the trope that best suits them as to why their character is no longer in the tribe.

I'm not sure that leaving necessarily qualifies as a trope. Â Something has to happen for there to be a story at all. Â No one writes stories about the mundane everyday stuff. Â A lot (most?) of the adopted protagonists also strike out on their own. Â That simply has to be done for there to be adventure - at least according to the hero's journey. Â That can be someone who was cast to the fates unwillingly or voluntarily or merely a victim of circumstance. Â Less common are stories that come to the protagonist from the outside.

There's absolutely no way to avoid tropes. Â There are literally (literally) no completely new ideas. Â All stories are just variations on a theme. Â But sometimes the theme is super common and shows up too many times, like a song you can't get out of your head. Â "Seeking adventure" is a cliche and a trope, but it's one that most of us do. Â We grow up, leave the home, and strike out on our own. Â I'm going away to college this fall so I'm feeling like I can really relate to the thrill and fear of leaving behind everything.

Like I said, I'm not against biracial characters or adopted characters or whatever else. Â But there are themes and backgrounds that are a little too common for my tastes. Â Like - the tribe was wiped out, for instance. Â Or their parents were killed. How many comic book heroes lost one or more parent? Â So many that it feels like a revolution when a comic book hero has parents they actually like and are good people. Â In reality, most of us have parents we actually like and are good people.

But that's boring to talk about or write stories about. Â But it doesn't always have to be boring. Â There is novelty in deliberately trying to resist novelty.

The story does have to start somewhere and go somewhere and no matter what you try, there's going to be a trope for it. Â But I can honestly say, I've not yet run into a Miqo'te who wasn't adopted, born in the city, or had a tragic origin story. These things don't make them bad characters or bad role players. Â It's merely something I've noticed and tried to deliberately avoid doing myself.

My idea is no better or worse than anyone else's but it feels less common based on my interaction and observations. Â For all I know, there's a vast ocean of Miqo'te without tragedy and I've just never been in the right place at the right time.

D'aito Kuji · **06-21-2015, 01:50 AM**

(06-21-2015, 01:36 AM)Faye Wrote:
(06-21-2015, 01:27 AM)Magellan Wrote: @Daitokuji:

But... in order to actually rp with people, you have to be the trope: 'adventurer dissatisfied with home, seeks new horizons'.

It's 6 in one, half dozen in the other.

Traditional Seekers are reclusive, keeping to their tribes, generally not making contact with the outside world. There are small pockets of Miqo that engage in tribal rp exclusively with each other and that's awesome. But any Miqo who has entered the wider world has embraced a vastly overused trope. Whether it be 'the exile' 'seeks new horizons' Â or 'adopted' most rpers.... actually want their characters to rp with other people. So they used the trope that best suits them as to why their character is no longer in the tribe.

Miqo'te lore screwed over Seeker role-players in that regard BUT! there are ways to spin it other than "adventurer" or "adopted." For example, I have a Seeker who was sort of the runt of the tribe, a wimp, who spent more time at home reading and daydreaming than doing anything productive for the tribe, which led to some resentment from her tribe. She read a lot of romance novels and books about other places and cultures, and romanticized them in her mind. She preferred the allure of them rather than the feral tribal life that she just didn't fit in with, so she left after her mother died.

I have another Seeker who was kicked from her tribe when her interest in technology and all things Magitek and Allagan was feared to be traitorous or sympathetic to Garleans. I have another Seeker whose tribe disbanded due to internal power struggle, betrayal, and its leader being murdered by one of their own. Another alternative: my RP partner plays a Nunh who was exiled from his tribe when he began abusing his position and mistreating the women in his tribe. There are plenty of alternatives for anyone wanting their own twist on things!

Wow. Â These are all really good.

Sin · **06-21-2015, 03:40 AM**

Not all tropes are born equal.

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Miqo'te raised by Hyur families? Also, discussing: characters from "far off lands?"

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