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ArmachiA · **07-14-2010, 08:27 PM**

Hence the argument. What they believe is right is not societies belief of right, therefore is wrong. However they STILL believe they're doing right. That's the whole point.

Shamadconde · **07-14-2010, 08:28 PM**

DAISHI Wrote:What one believes to be righ does not necessary make it right in a ethical code that rests on objective morality. When one subscribes to a subjective code then all things can be right.

OW! OWWWWWW!!! MY BRAIN! MY BRAIN!!!

ArmachiA · **07-14-2010, 08:30 PM**

He's talking about the general ethical code of all people and society. There's a general ethical code of all man that may differ and then there a general society code of what is wrong and what is right. Even then, that varies from culture to culture.

Ellion Goto · **07-14-2010, 08:33 PM**

So wait... let me get this straight. You're basically stating that if society believes it to be right, then if you think differently you're wrong? So when the Mayans considered a sacrifice as an ethical need to get things done that was the absolute right? When slavery was the most popular method of cheap labor that was the correct way? These concepts either don't exist anymore or are no longer tolerated for a reason. I'm sorry but Society is not always right, thus the reason for change.... Hell the United States was founded based on that exact concept... that society is not always right.

However, just to be fair, each and everyone of the scenarios listed above had a justifiable reason for their existence... it just doesn't make it right by my viewpoint... and now society's viewpoint. Now you seem to basically be arguing in favor of what Armi's point is... that everything is subjective but you don't realize it.

ArmachiA · **07-14-2010, 08:40 PM**

In other news, may be the first time in history me and Ellion are arguing for the same side Tongue

Shamadconde · **07-14-2010, 08:41 PM**

The world, as we know it, is about to end.

DAISHI · **07-14-2010, 08:43 PM**

Actually somewhere along the way we've gotten entirely confused because I would never purposely make that argument. We will do this over when I get back from seaworld.

Shamadconde · **07-14-2010, 08:44 PM**

Goody!

ArmachiA · **07-14-2010, 08:50 PM**

It's not really an issue, we're supposed to be helping a dood out with his villainy and I'm not sure we're helping by arguing XD

so grr argh villainy!

Trizzip · **07-14-2010, 09:13 PM**

Meh....a human being is a subjective creature by nature. Whether we like it or not, we all see the world through different eyes. Hence, it is impossible (in my opinion) to have an objective view on morality. Morality itself is in the eyes of the beholder. If it wasn't, all philosophers would be on the same page instead of having constant discussions since the beginning of time on what is right and what is wrong. There are no facts when it comes to ethics (like 2+2=4), it all just feelings and usually a lot more complicated then you think. The only good thing from arguing ethical behavior is that you can learn something new from the perspective of another. However, if you argue for the sake that "you're wrong and I'm right" sort of attitude, then it's kind of a waste of time.

Good and evil is an interpretation, not by a society, but by an individual. At least, in a society such as ours which is not interdependent. We have strayed from the 'community' type role and (in my opinion) most americans seem to prefer an independent state of mind with his/her own view points on the world. Where in other countries, interdependence sort of dictates an overall (this is how you should act) type society.

I don't think someone is evil, good, selfish, selfless, vain, pitiful, great, etc. based on what society dictates. I do so based on my own interpretation. A lot of folks get angry at me cause they can't stand that I disagree with them when they have that (2+2=4) mindset. I just tell 'em that they probably shouldn't waste their emotional energy in trying to change me, because I am who I am and if I want to interpret something in my own way, there is nothing anyone can do to stop. For the record, I never considered Sephiroth to be evil. There world isn't black and white.

Shamadconde · **07-14-2010, 09:16 PM**

What did you consider him? I lean towards mentally hilarious.

ArmachiA · **07-14-2010, 09:18 PM**

A Mama's boy.

Trizzip · **07-14-2010, 09:25 PM**

Shamad Conde Wrote:What did you consider him? I lean towards mentally hilarious.

lol, I'm gonna have to use that for future referance, that is outstanding! I'd say a combination of both of ya'll's post. Mentally broken with mommy issues. I actually felt bad for what he went through and would have liked to have seen some peace of mind go his way to calm his soul. The true antangonist IMO was Jenovoa....but even 'it' wasn't what I would consider evil. The alien was just doing what it was created to do I'm sure.

When I eat cows, birds, pigs, and other various animals, I don't consider what I'm doing evil. I'm just doing what I was created to do. Eat meat!

Shamadconde · **07-14-2010, 09:33 PM**

Now that I think about it, was there any FF villains who weren't mentally hilarious?

DAISHI · **07-14-2010, 09:44 PM**

Brin Ahlrine Wrote:Meh....a human being is a subjective creature by nature. Whether we like it or not, we all see the world through different eyes. Hence, it is impossible (in my opinion) to have an objective view on morality. Morality itself is in the eyes of the beholder. If it wasn't, all philosophers would be on the same page instead of having constant discussions since the beginning of time on what is right and what is wrong. There are no facts when it comes to ethics (like 2+2=4), it all just feelings and usually a lot more complicated then you think. The only good thing from arguing ethical behavior is that you can learn something new from the perspective of another. However, if you argue for the sake that "you're wrong and I'm right" sort of attitude, then it's kind of a waste of time.

Good and evil is an interpretation, not by a society, but by an individual. At least, in a society such as ours which is not interdependent. We have strayed from the 'community' type role and (in my opinion) most americans seem to prefer an independent state of mind with his/her own view points on the world. Where in other countries, interdependence sort of dictates an overall (this is how you should act) type society.

I don't think someone is evil, good, selfish, selfless, vain, pitiful, great, etc. based on what society dictates. I do so based on my own interpretation. A lot of folks get angry at me cause they can't stand that I disagree with them when they have that (2+2=4) mindset. I just tell 'em that they probably shouldn't waste their emotional energy in trying to change me, because I am who I am and if I want to interpret something in my own way, there is nothing anyone can do to stop. For the record, I never considered Sephiroth to be evil. There world isn't black and white.

My contention was that if one believes in a divine component of morality to set an objective standard, that while there are fluctuations in what is tolerated between individuals or societies, that there are also hard limits on what can be considered right or wrong.

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RPC has moved! These pages have been kept for historical purposes