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Kage · **05-08-2015, 02:41 PM**

So how do people use thaumaturgy in their roleplay? What aspects are played on?

Is it just, people able to manipulate their own aether into fire or ice-aspected magics?

Warren Castille · **05-08-2015, 02:44 PM**

I'm no thaumaturge, but I did make up some books for theorizing how aether works. The short of it is that a user's aether is manipulated to mimic the material components of actual elements: magical fire isn't real fire, but it emulates ignition and burning. Similarly, magical ice isn't real ice but looks like frozen water, etc.

Ever since they dropped the Astral/Umbral side of things, I've had no idea what the ACTUAL rules were.

cuideag · **05-08-2015, 02:51 PM**

My impression was always that a thaumaturge basically used a big ol' stick to focus their own aether into some big bad spells. Decidedly less elegant than, say, arcanistry and likewise decidedly more potentially catastrophic (which is not really a bad thing if you want to really rip out some really big bad spells indeed). I would wonder, though, if stones or crystals would be used in order to really boost certain elemental aspects?

Also very curious myself though cause I'm going to need to step into this stuff real soon.

Blue · **05-08-2015, 02:59 PM**

I remember little from my thaumaturge quests, but I do recall that Thaumaturges take care of embalming and burial rituals in Ul'dah. The Goldsmithing quests also reveal that scepters and staves are often made out of bones as spoils from the dead work as better receptacles for thaumaturgy's magicks.

I am just making 2+2 here and poking theories, but perhaps, inversely to conjury channeling the aether from the living forest (the Elementals), thaumaturgy does the opposite, instead receiving its aether from the caster and his ability to channel the aether from the dead (when things die in Hydaelyn, their aether is said to return to the lifestream, so it doesn't just disappear).

Then there's the void, but that stuff is purely related to black magick, which is a forbidden form of thaumaturgy.

Kage · **05-08-2015, 02:59 PM**

I'm very curious because...

Kage's history is actually supposed to be that this is what he did, essentially forced into it because he sucked at goldsmith. But... I'd only put it into practice waaay over a year ago. But it's something I think about because he spent years studying and myself.. I have no idea wtf he would really be doing in real roleplay practice >.>;

cuideag · **05-08-2015, 03:01 PM**

(05-08-2015, 02:59 PM)Kage Wrote: I'm very curious because...

Kage's history is actually supposed to be that this is what he did, essentially forced into it because he sucked at goldsmith. But... I'd only put it into practice waaay over a year ago. But it's something I think about because he spent years studying and myself.. I have no idea wtf he would really be doing in real roleplay practice >.>;

teach me Kage-senpai Sad

let's go to wizard school together.

cuideag · **05-08-2015, 03:02 PM**

(05-08-2015, 02:59 PM)Blue Wrote: I remember little from my thaumaturge quests, but I do recall that Thaumaturges take care of embalming and burial rituals in Ul'dah. The Goldsmithing quests also reveal that scepters and staves are often made out of bones as spoils from the dead work as better receptacles for thaumaturgy's magicks.

I am just making 2+2 here and poking theories, but perhaps, inversely to conjury channeling the aether from the living forest (the Elementals), thaumaturgy does the opposite, instead receiving its aether from the caster and his ability to channel the aether from the dead (when things die in Hydaelyn, their aether is said to return to the lifestream, so it doesn't just disappear).

Then there's the void, but that stuff is purely related to black magick, which is a forbidden form of thaumaturgy.

Oh dang! Kind of makes sense, doesn't it? All that aether just floating free.. might as well put it to use, right? > Smile

Melkire · **05-08-2015, 03:09 PM**

It's been posted before, elsewhere, by a number of people far more versed than I in lore, but it comes down to this:

Conjury is borrowing the power you need to cast spells from the world around you. Key word is "borrow". You essentially allow yourself to be a conduit for aether that is not yours, and you channel the energy given to you in the form of a spell. White Magic takes this a step further in that the individual accesses Succor (whether the Elementals grant/loan them access or the individual learns how to access Succor in a manner that is forbidden through Amdapori texts comes down to individual cases).

Thaumaturgy is using your own aether to power your spells, using the gems in rods/staffs as focii. Arcanima works in a similar fashion: the arcanist provides the aether, and the geometries shape the spells rather than focii.

Black Magic is forcibly stealing/ripping the aether from the land in order to fuel tremendously destructive feats that are shaped in a similar fashion to thaumaturgy. The process is the same, but the fuel source differs. This is actually harmful to Hydaelyn/the planet.

Kage · **05-08-2015, 03:42 PM**

(05-08-2015, 03:01 PM)cuideag Wrote:
(05-08-2015, 02:59 PM)Kage Wrote: I'm very curious because...

Kage's history is actually supposed to be that this is what he did, essentially forced into it because he sucked at goldsmith. But... I'd only put it into practice waaay over a year ago. But it's something I think about because he spent years studying and myself.. I have no idea wtf he would really be doing in real roleplay practice >.>;

teach me Kage-senpai let's go to wizard school together.

*wraps an arm around, nodding before reeling head back in shock* Not a senpai D:

So... use a focus, bone material and certain gem stone, manipulate own aether to do... things.

?

**Unnamed Mercenary** · **05-08-2015, 03:52 PM**

(05-08-2015, 03:42 PM)Kage Wrote:
(05-08-2015, 03:01 PM)cuideag Wrote:
(05-08-2015, 02:59 PM)Kage Wrote: I'm very curious because...

Kage's history is actually supposed to be that this is what he did, essentially forced into it because he sucked at goldsmith. But... I'd only put it into practice waaay over a year ago. But it's something I think about because he spent years studying and myself.. I have no idea wtf he would really be doing in real roleplay practice >.>;

teach me Kage-senpai let's go to wizard school together.
*wraps an arm around, nodding before reeling head back in shock* Not a senpai D:

So... use a focus, bone material and certain gem stone, manipulate own aether to do... things.

?

I see thaumaturgy scepters/staffs as kinda like an aetherial prism. Energy goes in one way, it's bent/shaped/focussed, and then the spell comes out. We know that an elemental wheel exists (not the FC thing) where certain elements cancel each other out (although not implemented) and we know aether can be aspected to different elements. By manipulating that aether with tools, we get magic.

...nothing will ever be better than the math puppy though.

Warren Castille · **05-08-2015, 04:17 PM**

* Warren Castille dons 1.0 lore hat

The quality of the stone not only indicates how powerful the channeled aether is, but it could also influence what kind of aether was most effective when passing through.

Mechanically, it meant that casting Fire spells with a red gemstone buffed them. Casting ice spells with a red gemstone caused them to outright do less damage. Back when elemental resistance was a thing, this meant that THMs had to carry multiple weapons around, because casting fire spells with a fire rod on a fire elemental meant you did... double digit damage at level 50! Yaaaaay!

* Warren Castille removes hat

EDIT: HOLY SHIT EMOTES

Blue · **05-08-2015, 04:27 PM**

(05-08-2015, 04:17 PM)Warren Castille Wrote: * Warren Castille dons 1.0 lore hat

The quality of the stone not only indicates how powerful the channeled aether is, but it could also influence what kind of aether was most effective when passing through.

Mechanically, it meant that casting Fire spells with a red gemstone buffed them. Casting ice spells with a red gemstone caused them to outright do less damage. Back when elemental resistance was a thing, this meant that THMs had to carry multiple weapons around, because casting fire spells with a fire rod on a fire elemental meant you did... double digit damage at level 50! Yaaaaay!

* Warren Castille removes hat

EDIT: HOLY SHIT EMOTES

Oh boy, the memories from FFXI ... all the elemental staves.. all the gil...

Kage · **05-08-2015, 04:42 PM**

*gives a petulant pout*

DOESN'T WORK ANYMORE *runs*

**Unnamed Mercenary** · **05-08-2015, 04:47 PM**

(05-08-2015, 04:42 PM)Kage Wrote: *gives a petulant pout*

DOESN'T WORK ANYMORE *runs*

...in game mechanics!

Why wouldn't fire for a fire elemental otherwise be relaxing for it?! We certainly see a LOT of ice elementals in Coerthas these days. (Note elemental, not Elemental.)

*remembers the good ol' "try your best flare" days*

***Maril*** · **05-08-2015, 06:31 PM**

One of the things I have applied to Nailah as she is a very newbie thraumaturge in training, is an aspect of instability. As far as I gathered, to get good at thraumaturgy the caster needs to have their emotional state in check otherwise they'll loose control of their spells.
So what I did with Nailah, because she has anger issues.. (She -is- a redhead afterall) is that whenever she gets angry she can't control her aether, and then random fireballs might happen. Currently I don't have her dependent on the active use of a staff/gem/thing to channel it through because I haven't been to certain on it. I would maybe tentatively make it so that she's carrying around a gem that aids her, if I had to put something in and I was allowed a little wiggle-room. It's caused some fun situations with friendly fire and made here more adamant not to loose her cool, and she did also once sear some of her hair off so she had to go short-haired for a while.
I don't actually remember where exactly I have it from (this is really typical of me, I read something and then I forget where I read it), if it's mentioned in any of the lore at all. It does seem like a sensible thing though.

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THM/Magic Roleplayers - How is thaumaturgy used?

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