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Xaela RP & Racism


Mi Ming

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I played a Dotharl since HW and fell in love with the tribe even more in StormBlood. I no longer play the character but that's in part to me moving servers and the character no longer icly viable due to various reasons. Ultimately I made a new Dotharl but I haven't had time to really play her much. This aside; I saw this sort of behavior OP has described quite a bit. My character never really dealt with it to this extent because she really didn't make it known she was Dotharl.

However; as you've said (The OP I mean) people are metagaming and knowing your character's Dotharl without your character making it known. That's where my problems ran into, and subsequently ended as I started blocking metagamers. At first I didn't really click as to why people would just try to start shit, and I've been rping for well over 15 years. Then I realized people were just ripping the information about the character from her nametag and I largely ignored it.

Thankfully I have a friend who plays a hyur and is physically more imposing than my Xaela, who would often run the individuals off before my character would snap and defend herself. This being said, she was quite the surly person so it DID save me a lot of conflict to have someone who would mediate quickly when needed. I'm not adverse to conflict, but rather conflict that comes from metagaming I do have a problem with.

With this said; I HAVE seen (not recently since drop of SB and my server move) a lot of Dotharl that would outright start fights in the middle of a tavern with no provocation. And with little information during HW concerning Dotharl, I can see why people would be frustrated with Dotharl roleplayers constantly running amok because it did happen quite often. I didn't personally participate in it, and my character was quite the bitch when provoked. She didn't go out of her way to constantly start bar fights. I always sort of treated her as a "it's a waste of my time, best to save my energy for a real battle" type mentality. 

However now that SB has dropped I haven't personally seen this behavior on Mateus, so I can't speak for my current server. But I do echo what the others, like Sounsyy have said, ignore metagamers and godmoders. There's nothing good that will come of these types of players, they're usually aggressive OOCly as they are ICly and usually can't split from the two. You don't have to obligate yourself to instruct these people; while education is fine you aren't their Roleplay Mentor or Teacher. If someone is genuinely unpleasant and harassing you, the best thing is just to dismiss them rather than giving them the benefit of attention. 

Edited by Fox
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I wouldn't let the pressure of other people make you bin a character. That way you'd prove that their griefing campaign works.

 

Be proud of what you are. Even those that are somewhat detached from their Dotharl culture should not be -made- to hide from themselves. 

 

My character always says she's a Dotharl when presenting herself. It's what she is and if people aren't okay with it, it's their problem. Not hers to 'fix'.

 

That isn't to say that the Dotharls didn't do what they did, but you are your own person. Your tribe is just an early influence from which you can branch out or rebel against! So y'all don't get discouraged from some metagamer that shoots you on sight upon noticing your nameplate.

 

If you aren't the kind of person that likes confrontation, just walk off and block them if they send hate mail. You really do not want to deal with such red flags anyway.

Edited by Koro Dotharl
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26 minutes ago, Koro Dotharl said:

I wouldn't let the pressure of other people make you bin a character. That way you'd prove that their griefing campaign works.

 

Be proud of what you are. Even those that are somewhat detached from their Dotharl culture should not be -made- to hide from themselves. 

 

My character always says she's a Dotharl when presenting herself. It's what she is and if people aren't okay with it, it's their problem. Not hers to 'fix'.

 

That isn't to say that the Dotharls didn't do what they did, but you are your own person. Your tribe is just an early influence from which you can branch out or rebel against! So y'all don't get discouraged from some metagamer that shoots you on sight upon noticing your nameplate.

 

If you aren't the kind of person that likes confrontation, just walk off and block them if they send hate mail. You really do not want to deal with such red flags anyway.


Nah I binned (retired) my character for lore reasons and I didn't want to do a massive retcon on the character, mostly in part to how I had written the character in Heavensward; particularly the significance of names for the tribe which came with Stormblood as well as other aspects. I did a lot of writing for her and I just felt it was better placed retiring her and I made Khad to whom I feel works better for Dotharl. I don't regret the time I played Dusk, nor do I really regret retiring her. No one forced me to do what I did and I didn't feel pressured to retire the character by other people. :) 

Khad is very much a brash character who does inform people very proudly of who she is and where she's from. I wish that we had gotten a bit more information with Heavensward concerning Xaela or they had waited till Stormblood to drop the race. But it is what it is I suppose and I'm very happy with my current snarly little Dotharl.

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9 hours ago, Gegenji said:

This may be a long shot random suggestion I just came up with but...

If people are going to look at your name and character and metagame that stuff... along with just ignoring the folks that do that if they won't listen to reason - maybe put something in your Character Info block that points some of this out?

 

Like...

"Nicer Than Your Average Dotharl" or "Dotharl Dreaming of Being a Maid" or something that implies that your character, while a Dotharl, is still a unique entity separate from all the stereotypes and preconceived notions. Obviously that should be an assumed thing, but every little bit could help, right?

 

Frankly, I feel like this is giving way too much leeway to people who are blatantly metagaming.  The only thing they deserve is a spot on your Blacklist, imo.

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In the aftermath of the MSQ, Dotharl seem less inclined to fight anything that moves and more inclined to fight anything that gives them prestige. There is a huuuuuge difference between "fight that guy in the bar who looked at you in a way you deemed offensive" and "Fight Brock Lesnar because he's fucking terrifying."

 

Anyone playing the middle ground of knowing Au Ra tribes? Probably meta-gaming; If you dwell in Eorzea 1) what the FUCK is an Au Ra and 2) What the FUCK is with their last names?

 

Roleplayers suck. Don't mind them.

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5 hours ago, Warren Castille said:

In the aftermath of the MSQ, Dotharl seem less inclined to fight anything that moves and more inclined to fight anything that gives them prestige. There is a huuuuuge difference between "fight that guy in the bar who looked at you in a way you deemed offensive" and "Fight Brock Lesnar because he's fucking terrifying."

 

Anyone playing the middle ground of knowing Au Ra tribes? Probably meta-gaming; If you dwell in Eorzea 1) what the FUCK is an Au Ra and 2) What the FUCK is with their last names?

 

Roleplayers suck. Don't mind them.

 

I haaate when I play a character who isn't the Warrior of Light and is like: "what the hell is a Dotharl? That's a Raen. They're all over Kugane." And like 10 people will fall over themselves rushing to ICly correct you and demonstrate their knowledge of the Steppe demographics. And it's like: how do you know that? You're from ISHGARD.

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It is particularly frustrating when a character explores a zone for the first time yet everyone around them seems to have all the answers as if they read wikipedia. There is a sense of development in slowly working a character out of ignorance through research and exploration please don't ruin it to make your character look smart.

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3 hours ago, Koro Dotharl said:

It is particularly frustrating when a character explores a zone for the first time yet everyone around them seems to have all the answers as if they read wikipedia. There is a sense of development in slowly working a character out of ignorance through research and exploration please don't ruin it to make your character look smart.

Yessss, that's frustrating and it makes your character feel stupid. 

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6 hours ago, Aegir said:

 

I haaate when I play a character who isn't the Warrior of Light and is like: "what the hell is a Dotharl? That's a Raen. They're all over Kugane." And like 10 people will fall over themselves rushing to ICly correct you and demonstrate their knowledge of the Steppe demographics. And it's like: how do you know that? You're from ISHGARD.

 

The group I run with had a series of RP events in Othard and it was really fun to play ignorant to the world around me even though I've done my research out of character. First off they use chopsticks! My character fumbled, felt confused and really was wondering why he was being asked to use sticks to eat his food. Also the first time he saw a Au'ra (Being raised in Ishgard before the Calamity) he thought they were 'Dragon People' and had a great deal of reservations about them and their origins which I know OOCLY they aren't but it was fun to play up the ignorance as my character should be ignorant. Ishgard was cut off from Eorzea for over a century and had very little interactions with the outside world. Plus its fun to play up other ignorance's too. My character is also a Priest and Naive.

So I understand the frustrations of people running to correct you immediately and the frustrations of having to explain that you DO know that OOCLY but my character would.. I've had to do that myself on more then one occasion. 

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13 hours ago, Warren Castille said:

Anyone playing the middle ground of knowing Au Ra tribes? Probably meta-gaming; If you dwell in Eorzea 1) what the FUCK is an Au Ra and 2) What the FUCK is with their last names?

 

7 hours ago, Aegir said:

I haaate when I play a character who isn't the Warrior of Light and is like: "what the hell is a Dotharl? That's a Raen. They're all over Kugane." And like 10 people will fall over themselves rushing to ICly correct you and demonstrate their knowledge of the Steppe demographics. And it's like: how do you know that? You're from ISHGARD.

 

That is a very important point. There are 51 known tribes. FIFTY-ONE, plus an unknown number of smaller tribes. That is a LOT for someone who has not grown up or studied the region to keep track of. And I do mean STUDIED, an Eorzean who's only traveled to the region recently (since SB was released) isn't likely to know more than a handful of tribes by name unless they've spent the time to learn them all.

 

Again, not saying someone's character should or should not have prejudices against Au Ra... just saying we should be realistic about it.

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I think it's telling that compared to the scenario mentioned, my character comes off as culturally sensitive, and she both cannot tell different tribes apart other than the obvious, and is still convinced the Au Ra are bipedal Scalekin. (Much as she wrongly thinks dragons are nothing but huge, intelligent scalekin.) Naturally there's no malice in her, she is merely ignorant.

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28 minutes ago, Warren Castille said:

In the aftermath of the MSQ, Dotharl seem less inclined to fight anything that moves and more inclined to fight anything that gives them prestige. There is a huuuuuge difference between "fight that guy in the bar who looked at you in a way you deemed offensive" and "Fight Brock Lesnar because he's fucking terrifying."

 

Anyone playing the middle ground of knowing Au Ra tribes? Probably meta-gaming; If you dwell in Eorzea 1) what the FUCK is an Au Ra and 2) What the FUCK is with their last names?

 

Roleplayers suck. Don't mind them.

Yeah this is how I saw Dotharl and how the "sisters" of my character also saw them. Not mindless killers but people who will do so without fear for prestige and if given just cause. Sure they might find great enjoyment in killing but they're only going to do so if challenged and to a warrior they deem worthy so their soul can burn. Something like that, merited a lot of Dotharl I've seen mostly RP murderers for kicks and do start fights with random people so I get the stereotyping but it definitely sucks. I'm glad you kind of see what I saw in Dotharl.

As for this situation, I'm really torn, I'm realizing that in opening my character up to Ul'dah and what they've gone through there I kind of lost touch with said character.

Someone gave really interesting advice (Sorry a lot of posts and I don't understand multi-quoting yet) and that advice was not to take everything in Ul'dah in or your characters perception will be ruined. I take everything in from everyone and roll with whatever comes my way. This always lead to some amazing plots but on my current character I feel it really damaged them.

In the end I did a plot (lore bendy as hell) that saw my character fight a witch and have all her aether absorbed by said witch only for her consciouse to take over so now she's in a Miqo'te body. It's kind of 'eh' and I know probably a lot here hate race change plots in fact I usually do too but I really love this character and I also really don't want to deal with all the IC hate because I'm an anxious baby. 

I'm renaming her and having her start a new life semi-secretly. Like I said- kind of lore bendy. I could argue the Syrcus Tower plot with the Allagan who inhabits a girl's body but still : S 

I would have killed the character and made a new one but given she's one of 3 sisters my killing this character would have severely screwed up the RP of others so I deemed this the best option. 

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If you just roll with whatever randoms force on your character you will find yourself in very awkward, terrible situations. I advice that you protect your character's concepts more next time or you might end up like this again in the future.

 

It's not a bad thing to say no sometimes. People are different and so are their tastes and what they're after. Don't feel bad for protecting your own fun cause the person that changed your race sure doesn't care about that.

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6 minutes ago, Koro Dotharl said:

If you just roll with whatever randoms force on your character you will find yourself in very awkward, terrible situations. I advice that you protect your character's concepts more next time or you might end up like this again in the future.

 

It's not a bad thing to say no sometimes. People are different and so are their tastes and what they're after. Don't feel bad for protecting your own fun cause the person that changed your race sure doesn't care about that.

Yeah I'm going to take that to heart. I always thought if I didn't incorporate someone it would be seen as rude but with the very large ammount of advice saying to do what you are mentioning I think I will try to be better at this.

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14 minutes ago, Pumpkin said:

Yeah I'm going to take that to heart. I always thought if I didn't incorporate someone it would be seen as rude but with the very large ammount of advice saying to do what you are mentioning I think I will try to be better at this.

It's not about being "better" it's just experience. For better or for worse, you will never be able to satisfy everyone's expectations. Play your character the way you like, be prepared (or even expect) people to tell you how you "should" be playing it, and carry on.

 

As soon as you begin writing your character to satisfy other people... They're not you. Don't do that.

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Unfortunately, I think it does somewhat come with the territory of playing Xaela, especially Dotharl. Not to get too redundant with what's already been said here, but Dotharl are known as violent warmongers who have feuds with other tribes and also look down on all other tribes, races, and non-Dotharl people in general. And that's just the in game lore. Since the addition of Au Ra into the game, many role-players have been playing their Au Ra, and Dotharl in particular, as "savages," "ignorant," consumed with tribal feuds, and a whole slew of things that I think are potentially, uh, tied in to a different kind of "Au Ra racism." Therefore, people have plenty of reason to give their characters a stigma against the Dotharl... and also plenty of reasons to have their own OOC stigmas against the "tropes" they feel Dotharl RPers often employ. Having a single interaction with two Dotharl who appear to be "different" isn't exactly going to change the hearts and minds of most characters.

But that doesn't mean you have to endure it. I'd keep it on the lowdown IC that your character is a Dotharl, because that is a pretty fair point of IC conflict in public RP if other characters find out. If people still somehow magically seem to know your character's tribe IC? Call them out politely correct them OOC that your character has not alluded to being a Dotharl, and if they argue (or if you want to skip that step and cut right to the chase), ignore them. Remove your character from the situation, or just do not respond to their emotes in any way. As Tiergan mentioned on the second page, IC problems should be dealt with IC and OOC problems should be dealt with OOC. Someone's character being rude to yours is typically an IC problem. However, if you are feeling unfairly targeted, unable to enjoy your RP, and think it may be rooted in someone's OOC dislike of certain character concepts? That is an OOC issue for certain, and you should respond to it OOC, either by voicing your concerns to the other party, or just refusing to RP with them.

Edited by Faye
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I ended up doing a plot (Since a lot of people are tied to my character) where said Dotharl is no longer Dotharl or Xaela. It's a bit wonky but it's similar to the idea of the girl who's body was taken over by an Allagan in Syrcus tower quests. It's a bit lore bendy to say the least but killing the character would have really screwed over a lot of people so I'm just having her changed and letting it known only to a few.

While I won't for a second argue there's not plenty of IC reason to hate Dotharl especially with how they were RP'd in HW that makes it no more fun to RP then and doesn't really change the fact that trying to have a drink and socializing being met with random people coming up and harassing your character is really unpleasant. 

 

I actually had a friend go into Ul'dah yesterday who plays a Xaela not from a tribe and they messaged us and expressed how surprised they were with how bad the Xaela racism RP is because they even experienced it their first time going to Ul'dah in forever and they play a barmaid and dancer who is a Xaela. 

I'm a really anxious person and I want to have fun RPing so- I'm pretty fine going Miqo'te if it means not dealing with rampant IC Xaela racism. Even if IC it's very unpleasant to deal with every time you go to RP publicly. 

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4 hours ago, Pumpkin said:

I'm a really anxious person and I want to have fun RPing so- I'm pretty fine going Miqo'te if it means not dealing with rampant IC Xaela racism. Even if IC it's very unpleasant to deal with every time you go to RP publicly. 


I've rped miqo'te since 1.0. You are going to run into IC racism regardless. Before Xaela came out miqo'te received a lot of racism and trolling. It still exists, not nearly as much I've seen. But at the start of ARR it was pretty common to see a lot of people ICly harassing them. This is in part to various npcs through Ul'dah and their tribal background. Honestly; you're going to run into racism regardless of what race you play. I've seen it against hyur and lala as well, however not nearly as much for those two. But during 2.0 launch Duskwights and Miqo'te caught a lot of flack. 

This said I would highly suggest not letting it dictate to you what you play, like others echoed. But if it's become unbearable then I suppose you do you, and do what you feel will make you the most happy. But I still very much do see miqo'te racism relatively commonly.

Edited by Fox
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48 minutes ago, Fox said:


I've rped miqo'te since 1.0. You are going to run into IC racism regardless. Before Xaela came out miqo'te received a lot of racism and trolling. It still exists, not nearly as much I've seen. But at the start of ARR it was pretty common to see a lot of people ICly harassing them. This is in part to various npcs through Ul'dah and their tribal background. Honestly; you're going to run into racism regardless of what race you play. I've seen it against hyur and lala as well, however not nearly as much for those two. But during 2.0 launch Duskwights and Miqo'te caught a lot of flack. 

This said I would highly suggest not letting it dictate to you what you play, like others echoed. But if it's become unbearable then I suppose you do you, and do what you feel will make you the most happy. But I still very much do see miqo'te racism relatively commonly.

11

 

I've not been around since 1.0 but since 2.0 and all through Heavensward I RP'd a Miqo'te and while she got some racism about "You're probably a slut" it was easy to deal with. It's way easier to prove you're not a slut by just not having sex or by laughing etc. People are way more willing to listen to a Miqo'te. The difference with Xaela is that the racism they face (ICly) is super aggressive and there's little you can do to mitigate it. You can't prove you're not a savage because if your character even gets slightly upset that's proof, if your character walks away they're called a coward and ridiculed that way. In my experience, the racism Miqo'te face is super lowkey compared to what Xaela since Stormblood are facing. Merited I can only speak from my experience. 

I personally can way easier handle the Miqo'te racism and while one can say "Don't change your RP for others" I'm changing it for myself because I haven't been enjoying RP for weeks as a result of all this, this change is very much for me to be able to enjoy RP again. Ideally one would endure and not back down but it's RP and a hobby- I want to have fun.

This isn't to say your advice is bad mind you- just I think for me this is the best option. It's a shame that it came to this but I'm very excited about the plot that I have going now and am trying to stay positive- even if that plot is going to be weird to RP at first.

 

To add to this- I think this is specifically a Balmung problem as a result of how most 'players' RP Dotharl as bloodthirsty murderers and the massive influx of Xaela the server has. I just realized you're on Mateus, it's really heavy on Balmung for Xaela. 

Edited by Pumpkin
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I've RPed Miqo'te, Hyur, Roegadyn, Raen--and none of them had face this much racism as the Xaela. Literally you just go walk to the back alley in Ul'dah and wait and somehow, somewhere--Someone will diss at you for existing or you'll hear people call you names and then wish that you'd go back to your side of the world to fight there and so on xD

 

Hell, the racism for the other tribes are mostly seen as a joke OOCwise but as what I've noticed in this discussion--The racism for Xaela is mostly really intense and serious since everyone kept explaining that it's normal.

 

IDK--I guess it's hard to see it unless you guys have been in our shoes? All I know is that we're gonna incorporate what has been suggested and we'll see how it'll go. Hopefully just more fun and less conflict RP daily! Crossing our fingers!

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6 minutes ago, Pumpkin said:

 

I've not been around since 1.0 but since 2.0 and all through Heavensward I RP'd a Miqo'te and while she got some racism about "You're probably a slut" it was easy to deal with. It's way easier to prove you're not a slut by just not having sex or by laughing etc. People are way more willing to listen to a Miqo'te. The difference with Xaela is that the racism they face (ICly) is super aggressive and there's little you can do to mitigate it. You can't prove you're not a savage because if your character even gets slightly upset that's proof, if your character walks away they're called a coward and ridiculed that way. In my experience, the racism Miqo'te face is super lowkey compared to what Xaela since Stormblood are facing. Merited I can only speak from my experience. 

I personally can way easier handle the Miqo'te racism and while one can say "Don't change your RP for others" I'm changing it for myself because I haven't been enjoying RP for weeks as a result of all this, this change is very much for me to be able to enjoy RP again. Ideally one would endure and not back down but it's RP and a hobby- I want to have fun.

This isn't to say your advice is bad mind you- just I think for me this is the best option. It's a shame that it came to this but I'm very excited about the plot that I have going now and am trying to stay positive- even if that plot is going to be weird to RP at first.

 

To add to this- I think this is specifically a Balmung problem as a result of how most 'players' RP Dotharl as bloodthirsty murderers and the massive influx of Xaela the server has. I just realized you're on Mateus, it's really heavy on Balmung for Xaela. 


Yes I am on Mateus, and I originated on Besaid aka Balmung and was on Balmung up until halfway through the Stormblood expac to which, as I stated in my first post I had moved servers. I'm not sure it's conducive to say that it's because of the server. Because these sorts of things still happen on any roleplay server on the game, and personally I'd rather not get into Server vs. Server issues, as it doesn't really help matters and honestly tends to start upsetting people. I'm really not sure what else I can say on the matter that I already haven't said in my first post (at the top of this page) and my second. I wish you luck in your roleplay.

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3 minutes ago, Ayaka said:

IDK--I guess it's hard to see it unless you guys have been in our shoes? 


Please read my first post. I have seen and dealt with it, not nearly as severe.
There have also been other people in this thread who have also said they have dealt with the behaviors as well.

Edited by Fox
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3 minutes ago, Fox said:


Please read my first post. I have seen and dealt with it, not nearly as severe.
There have also been other people in this thread who have also said they have dealt with the behaviors as well.

 

I'm not saying you haven't experienced it but like you said--It's not as severe as our experience so yeah.

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I have with playing characters who have dealt with constant harassment and racism in SWTOR where it became incredibly uncomfortable to play the character. Other people have mentioned they've seen it and dealt with it as well in this forum. I'm rather certain other people in this thread have dealt with pretty heavy IC racism and weren't sure how to deal with it as well at first. Most of the people who have posted here, I've known in some form or fashion since I joined the RPC some odd years ago; and I know they've dealt with griefers before so they're speaking on experience. And from their experience the best advice they can give is to give the things they have in this thread. People like Sounssy and Faye both have given really sound advice off the top of my head. You might not have meant to come off as dismissive but admittedly it's frustrating to give advice when asked then to receive responses like above.  I've tried to write this several times with a number of failures as I am trying very hard not to be frustrated or flippant at this point so I'm going to just stop here before I ramble off more. I actually do wish you a good evening and good luck in the future with your rps. 

Edited by Fox
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