(11-26-2016, 02:37 AM)Rahferu Wrote: Actually,
I'm pretty sure that nothing I said about that being a possibility due to the factors of injustice, political unrest and people having access to learn about dark arts prior to Ishgard was untrue. I think you're misinterpreting me here.
That's NOT the same as making up lore. There is a difference between using reasoning FROM THE LORE to justify/explain why your character has a tie to something--which you did, yourself.Â
The lore doesn't provide direct examples of what YOUR character did, or what many other people's characters did. You make a character and try to fit the storyline somewhere within the lore boundaries. Just because something isn't 100% proven in stone doesn't mean it isn't, or couldn't be, canon--given how SE actually gives us a lot of room to wonder and fill in the blanks.Â
You also said earlier on in this thread that we aren't sure WHERE dark knights originally came from--and I'm saying that the materials and conditions for a dark knight to function and exist in some form were very much around before Ishgard was.Â
The "true blue" lore tells us that there was suffering, access to the dark arts, and that people were victimized by severe injustice and villainy in other places pre-ishgard.
I am allowed to speculate, too--and so is everybody else, especially when I bother to research and justify my claims--which are TOTALLY based on the lore here. I'm not saying YEAH THAT WAS TOTALLY THE CASE, no questions asked....I'm saying it definitely seems likely, and here's a bunch of reasons why. This is part of RP and how people make characters. I fail to see how that's ridiculous.
Furthermore, I am NOT the only one in this thread to have suggested that it could've happened in other places and at other times. I think I've actually re-iterated what other have said and provided why my character personally has a tie to the concept of dark knights too.
I understand where your reasoning comes from, but I think it's inherently flawed. What it makes true is only that what you evoke is a possibility, not a necessity. You are speaking about the discovery of a science (magical), not about a societal change, fad, meme, or whatever.
It would have worked if the premise was instead "dark knights in the sense of champions against injustice probably have risen in most societies, aka batmans". As you say, as long as there is injustice, you will probably have people fighting it pretty much everywhere, in various proportions and scales, but you will always have at least one weirdo doing it. It's a safe assumption, also because we are not talking exactly about a hard scientific discovery.
For Dark Arts though... What makes me say it's a science? Because of the name, which is a first hint in itself. And most importantly because of the lore itself: Dark Knights didn't discover the Dark Arts until a long time after their formation. So, saying that Dark Arts is distinct from Dark Knights, even if it's their signature now, is true. Saying that Dark Arts is a possibility out of Ishgard, practiced by people other than Dark Knights, is also true. Maybe with different weapons too, since the blade seems to have very little to do with the Dark Arts themselves.
The problem comes when you assert as a fact that it's a necessity. No it's not. It would be like saying that because gunpowder in the 9th century is used by the chinese, that it's used in other parts of the world because everyone is in contact with saltpeter. Well yes, everyone can use it, but not everyone has discovered it at this time. In fact, only the chinese did, as far as we know. Not convinced? We can go with a less specific technics if you want. The wheel? You think that every man culture on the planet discovered it at some early age? Well, actually no. The Incan Empire for example, never invented it, which is quite baffling I can agree, considering the heights of their civilization.
Well of course you are free not to believe in that analogy, maybe it's clumsy, maybe I could have found better ones, but the fact remains. I just demonstrated that it's not a necessity by essence by finding two counter examples, which renders invalid the implication of a generality, but still lets valid the possibility of it.
In any case, I'm not saying you are doing it wrong or right, or passing any judgement on the matter. I'm just asserting that you are acting out of the lore, or what we know of it. You are not the first one to do so. Many players do. If it's what floats your boat, go for it.
NB: also on the fact that we are supposedly all 'making up lore', that's a bit disingenuous. I don't think I have ever been acting out of the lore myself... Possible, but I doubt it.
Balmung:Â Suen Shyu