I, personally, don't pay them any attention in Steel's RP. She earns her training the ol' fashioned way. That said, I'm not such a twerp as to deny someone who does acknowledge them in their RP. I think the thoughts on how a soulstone can work IC'ly here are pretty damned good and wish I had thought of them myself.
(10-21-2015, 01:03 PM)Gwen - Dinah Wrote: [ -> ]Depends on a class, some are just a key that unlocks your potential, some are needed for focusing the power.
i.e. DRK Soul Crystals just unlock your Dark Side, where BLM are needed to use the magic or you combust.
I think Soul Crystals can be basically divided into three categories:
1) No actual powers aside from the teachings carved into it by previous wielders (like Monk).
2) It's needed to unlock that job's powers or at least to learn them, but it's not actually required to use those powers (like DRK).
3) It's needed to even use that job's powers, otherwise you can't/you die (like BLM).
I'm not fond of some of the implications of soul crystals, but the lore is the lore and it must be respected. While I don't ever see myself using them, anyone who does is entirely within the established parameters of the setting to do so.
I love seeing all the lore abiding citizens (pfffft that was punny) throw this piece of lore out the window for the sake of...I guess convenience? Some of the jobs really do 100% rely on their soul crystal/stones though...(A lot of Japanese bloggers call it é‚石...and the text is soul crystal so I get confused sometimes >.<).Â
Anywho.
Yeah, this was really interesting!
(10-21-2015, 02:56 PM)Ashe Wrote: [ -> ]I love seeing all the lore abiding citizens (pfffft that was punny) throw this piece of lore out the window for the sake of...I guess convenience? Some of the jobs really do 100% rely on their soul crystal/stones though...(A lot of Japanese bloggers call it é‚石...and the text is soul crystal so I get confused sometimes >.<).Â
Anywho.
Yeah, this was really interesting!
It really depends on the job. The game doesn't do a very good job of showcasing how prevalent (or not) these items are, or even if they're mandatory given the special circumstances of the Warrior of Light. A lot of us are figuring it out as we go (because the soulstones are an afterthought for the most part in 2.x, given that they were a huge asspull in 1.x) and the new cutscenes for 50-60 don't always point out how vital these things could be.
It's less about throwing lore out of a window and more about trying to figure out how to undo two years of established assumption in a setting where the details are held very close to the chest. I mean, if you've got SE-approved definite lore that everyone missed, feel free to link and source it.
You of all people should be aware that sometimes we learn things later and need to retool them after details come out. How's your wiki?
I've - thankfully - never had to acknowledge them. They may technically exist within the game's lore but as with many things related to the Warrior of Light I tend to shy away from them if at all possible.
I won't lie - I'm not particularly interested in interacting with characters that suddenly gain access to a bunch of knowledge just because they happen to tie obtaining a soul crystal into one of their personal events. I much prefer interacting with characters that train and better themselves through shedding blood, sweat and tears. It's just a lot more engaging for me.
A character that can do pretty much everything tends to hog the spotlight anyway. A character that is specialised in one or two specific roles, however, leaves plenty of room for other characters to shine - which is the key to telling a good story as far as I'm concerned.
(10-21-2015, 03:03 PM)Graeham Wrote: [ -> ]I've - thankfully - never had to acknowledge them. They may technically exist within the game's lore but as with many things related to the Warrior of Light I tend to shy away from them if at all possible.
I won't lie - I'm not particularly interested in interacting with characters that suddenly gain access to a bunch of knowledge just because they happen to tie obtaining a soul crystal into one of their personal events. I much prefer interacting with characters that train and better themselves through shedding blood, sweat and tears. It's just a lot more engaging for me.
A character that can do pretty much everything tends to hog the spotlight anyway. A character that is specialised in one or two specific roles, however, leaves plenty of room for other characters to shine - which is the key to telling a good story as far as I'm concerned.
But what if they -do- get a soulstone but don't suddenly learn everything? I mean, look at Isaulde. She has a Soul of the Dark Knight, yeah.
But she's been training for 12 years, 15 if we count pre-DRK training, and she's not done with it yet.
She has a Soul Crystal, yes, but it's to avoid the lore about DRKs backlashing and saying that no Crystal = no Dark Knight. Just like what happened with BLM.
Also, having a Soul Crystal doesn't necessarily mean that character is good at everything.
I usually play them as though they are any other kind of attractive crystal that one may find on a journey. Â Every so often, one of them turns out to be a magical object that seems to result in her waking up on the ground, but other than that, they are just crystals.
(10-21-2015, 03:00 PM)Warren Castille Wrote: [ -> ] (10-21-2015, 02:56 PM)Ashe Wrote: [ -> ]I love seeing all the lore abiding citizens (pfffft that was punny) throw this piece of lore out the window for the sake of...I guess convenience? Some of the jobs really do 100% rely on their soul crystal/stones though...(A lot of Japanese bloggers call it é‚石...and the text is soul crystal so I get confused sometimes >.<
.Â
Anywho.
Yeah, this was really interesting!
It really depends on the job. The game doesn't do a very good job of showcasing how prevalent (or not) these items are, or even if they're mandatory given the special circumstances of the Warrior of Light. A lot of us are figuring it out as we go (because the soulstones are an afterthought for the most part in 2.x, given that they were a huge asspull in 1.x) and the new cutscenes for 50-60 don't always point out how vital these things could be.
It's less about throwing lore out of a window and more about trying to figure out how to undo two years of established assumption in a setting where the details are held very close to the chest. I mean, if you've got SE-approved definite lore that everyone missed, feel free to link and source it.
You of all people should be aware that sometimes we learn things later and need to retool them after details come out. How's your wiki?
Been lazy as fuck changing it.
I don't really expand my RP pool so everyone I RP with knows what's up so my brain is like, "I'll do it later."
Edit:
AH! I should extend his history portion since a lot of shit recently happened really fast...
I'll do that tonight after work...
I keep seeing that 'soul crystals' tend to allow people to skip over things without much thought. It /doesn't/ work that way at all. Soul Crystals allow for people to learn the proper methods from those that carried it before hand but they still /HAVE/ to train in using the techniques. It's basically a giant book of knowledge just implanted in your mind. WAR/DK quests prove this viewpoint because you still HAD to train before you can even tap into the soul crystal. It is certainly not a get out of jail free card and it doesn't allow people to be the best of their class in a matter of just touching the rock.
(10-21-2015, 01:17 PM)Unnamed Mercenary Wrote: [ -> ]The Black Mage Soul Crystal is literally called the Gem of Shattoto. By Shattoto, the person who one could argue "invented" Black Magic because she couldn't be a Thaumaturge. It's basically her "here's how I did this" memory in a rock. Could someone else rediscover her methods? Maybekinda. The 3.0 scenes seem to imply that people tried and got burned for it.
The thing is that the Gem of Shattoto is a very specific item. Whether or not there are other BLM soulstones is not touched upon.
Depending on how you interpret the lore that we have, it's likely that there are others, because you can't have a Wizarding War without multiple Wizards, but your mileage may vary.
(10-21-2015, 05:52 PM)Oli! Wrote: [ -> ] (10-21-2015, 01:17 PM)Unnamed Mercenary Wrote: [ -> ]The Black Mage Soul Crystal is literally called the Gem of Shattoto. By Shattoto, the person who one could argue "invented" Black Magic because she couldn't be a Thaumaturge. It's basically her "here's how I did this" memory in a rock. Could someone else rediscover her methods? Maybekinda. The 3.0 scenes seem to imply that people tried and got burned for it.
The thing is that the Gem of Shattoto is a very specific item. Whether or not there are other BLM soulstones is not touched upon.
Depending on how you interpret the lore that we have, it's likely that there are others, because you can't have a Wizarding War without multiple Wizards, but your mileage may vary.
This definitely.
I think that someone theoretically could have the soul stone of a different black mage from that time.
You'd prolly have to make up some stuff/lore bend a bit but it's not impossible.Â
Unlikely. But not impossible.
Yeah that's a good perspective, and it's changing my mind a bit on the soul gem. I prefer it that way. Perhaps the soul stone is like a Fate mage seal. It has the entire body of work a family has worked on in their many generations of occult resrarch, but it is up to the inheritor to learn how to utilize it, unless they're properly tutored.
(10-21-2015, 05:57 PM)Ashe Wrote: [ -> ] (10-21-2015, 05:52 PM)Oli! Wrote: [ -> ] (10-21-2015, 01:17 PM)Unnamed Mercenary Wrote: [ -> ]The Black Mage Soul Crystal is literally called the Gem of Shattoto. By Shattoto, the person who one could argue "invented" Black Magic because she couldn't be a Thaumaturge. It's basically her "here's how I did this" memory in a rock. Could someone else rediscover her methods? Maybekinda. The 3.0 scenes seem to imply that people tried and got burned for it.
The thing is that the Gem of Shattoto is a very specific item. Whether or not there are other BLM soulstones is not touched upon.
Depending on how you interpret the lore that we have, it's likely that there are others, because you can't have a Wizarding War without multiple Wizards, but your mileage may vary.
This definitely.
I think that someone theoretically could have the soul stone of a different black mage from that time.
You'd prolly have to make up some stuff/lore bend a bit but it's not impossible.Â
Unlikely. But not impossible.
Make stuff up? Bend lore? Oh my gosh, that's... that's... Reasonable.
(10-21-2015, 06:08 PM)Garalona Wrote: [ -> ] (10-21-2015, 05:57 PM)Ashe Wrote: [ -> ] (10-21-2015, 05:52 PM)Oli! Wrote: [ -> ] (10-21-2015, 01:17 PM)Unnamed Mercenary Wrote: [ -> ]The Black Mage Soul Crystal is literally called the Gem of Shattoto. By Shattoto, the person who one could argue "invented" Black Magic because she couldn't be a Thaumaturge. It's basically her "here's how I did this" memory in a rock. Could someone else rediscover her methods? Maybekinda. The 3.0 scenes seem to imply that people tried and got burned for it.
The thing is that the Gem of Shattoto is a very specific item. Whether or not there are other BLM soulstones is not touched upon.
Depending on how you interpret the lore that we have, it's likely that there are others, because you can't have a Wizarding War without multiple Wizards, but your mileage may vary.
This definitely.
I think that someone theoretically could have the soul stone of a different black mage from that time.
You'd prolly have to make up some stuff/lore bend a bit but it's not impossible.Â
Unlikely. But not impossible.
Make stuff up? Bend lore? Oh my gosh, that's... that's... Reasonable.
Well, there's a difference between bending it reasonably and ignoring it completely.