(06-08-2015, 05:08 PM)Zyrusticae Wrote: I think where you're getting confused is that I am referring to outright refusing to play a game - not even attempting to try it out - because the given classes don't appeal to you immediately as being 'narrowminded', NOT simply having a preference for one role or one class or the other.

(06-08-2015, 08:36 PM)Oswin Wrote: Given the nature of cross skill abilities and the ease of switching to the new jobs once you meet the requirements, I see no reason why people wouldn't want to level an off class first. Truth of the matter is that people are going to have to level that cross skill class at some point, why not just do it right away?

Maybe a PSA post needs to get made for new players going into Heavensward. Hrm.

(06-08-2015, 08:46 PM)BroodingFicus Wrote:

(06-08-2015, 08:36 PM)Oswin Wrote: Given the nature of cross skill abilities and the ease of switching to the new jobs once you meet the requirements, I see no reason why people wouldn't want to level an off class first. Truth of the matter is that people are going to have to level that cross skill class at some point, why not just do it right away?

Maybe a PSA post needs to get made for new players going into Heavensward. Hrm.

Cross class is important and many people would, I think, go back and level up to a certain point in certain classes to get any abilities that might be valid (not sure if we know which classes will cross yet or not but still). However generally this is something you would be able to do on your own time. Level your main job then go back and work on cross classes while technically already being fully capable of doing content. It also seems logical to learn your actual job /then/ mix in other bits rather than the reverse where you learn how to play a WHM per say, switch to AST and suddenly lose most of those abilities for completely  new ones. 

That said they also are locking it behind story which means unlocking the new jobs also forces you to do all the MSQ content past 50. Why not do it right away? Because unless you have a love for your class, leveling 1-50 (60? Not sure if there will be cross class skills added higher) and doing the whole MSQ to 2.55 is not likely to be an enjoyable ride. However, if you can enjoy the class you want, you have motivation to slowly work on getting extra little skills through cross classes that make you and your parties life easier. At least that's how I would see it and how I felt when I had to level Paladin for my Warrior. I hated Paladin but I did it because after playing Warrior I could see the benefit and I would work on it until I got frustrated and switched back over to overpower things in the face instead.

(06-08-2015, 08:18 PM)Kellach Woods Wrote: I've done pettier than that.

I refuse to play Skullgirls 'cause I hate Alex Ahab's character designs.

(06-08-2015, 08:34 PM)LiadansWhisper Wrote: Considering that White Mage and Scholar share pre-requisite classes, and considering that both Jobs pull cross-class skills from each other, I would be extremely surprised if the person in question has never tried out the other job.  What's more, a good White Mage is going to have a few more cross class skills from other classes, meaning that you end up trying other classes out.

Doesn't mean you'll like them.  It's perfectly sane and reasonable to say, "I don't like this because I tried it out and it sucked."

BTW, it's also perfectly reasonable to say, "I don't like this because I looked into this class - though I didn't try it out -and nothing about it appeals to me."  That's completely reasonable, even if you think it's "narrowminded."

(06-08-2015, 09:27 PM)Zyrusticae Wrote: all of the major niches WILL be covered from the start

(06-08-2015, 10:02 PM)Intaki Wrote:

(06-08-2015, 09:27 PM)Zyrusticae Wrote: all of the major niches WILL be covered from the start

I want to DPS with a sword. What class do I pick?

(06-08-2015, 10:04 PM)Oswin Wrote:

(06-08-2015, 10:02 PM)Intaki Wrote:

(06-08-2015, 09:27 PM)Zyrusticae Wrote: all of the major niches WILL be covered from the start

I want to DPS with a sword. What class do I pick?

None of them.

(06-08-2015, 08:36 PM)Oswin Wrote: Given the nature of cross skill abilities and the ease of switching to the new jobs once you meet the requirements, I see no reason why people wouldn't want to level an off class first. Truth of the matter is that people are going to have to level that cross skill class at some point, why not just do it right away?

(06-09-2015, 12:36 AM)Naunet Wrote:

(06-08-2015, 08:36 PM)Oswin Wrote: Given the nature of cross skill abilities and the ease of switching to the new jobs once you meet the requirements, I see no reason why people wouldn't want to level an off class first. Truth of the matter is that people are going to have to level that cross skill class at some point, why not just do it right away?

Not all the way to 50 they won't.

(06-09-2015, 12:36 AM)Naunet Wrote:

(06-08-2015, 08:36 PM)Oswin Wrote: Given the nature of cross skill abilities and the ease of switching to the new jobs once you meet the requirements, I see no reason why people wouldn't want to level an off class first. Truth of the matter is that people are going to have to level that cross skill class at some point, why not just do it right away?

Not all the way to 50 they won't.

(06-06-2015, 12:18 AM)LiadansWhisper Wrote:

(06-05-2015, 11:20 PM)hauntmedoitagain Wrote:

(06-05-2015, 10:57 PM)Nako Wrote: The thing is, the game is designed to not need alts. The only downside to that is the inventory space. The entire game is built around the fact that you can do everything on one character. I don't see that changing as it is a core feature of the game.

You forgot tome caps, cross-class skills, gear lockouts, etc.

FFXIV punishes you for doing everything on one character to begin with, contrary to how it's advertised. Either have one or the other, you know?

I honestly don't agree with you on this one.  It's not "punishment."  It's a way of extending the content, and it's practiced in one form or another by every successful MMO.

(06-05-2015, 11:36 PM)hauntmedoitagain Wrote: Staples in some MMOs. Not that it changes anything just because another game is guilty of the same flaws. It's punishment via tedium, plain and simple.

Either make multi-classing viable on one character outside of the magic classes or give those eight character slots some incentive. It's really not that hard either way.

Staples in every successful, raiding-focused MMO.  WoW does it.  SWTOR does it.  Rift does it.  Wildstar does it.  Name me a wildly successful MMO with a serious raiding endgame that doesn't engage in content gating via tomes, raid lockouts, etc?

(06-05-2015, 11:46 PM)Cedric Wrote: That still does not explain why they chose to give us 8 character slots. And if we choose to use up all of those other slots, we're punished by having to go through the MSQ's again. (I wouldn't mind having to level them, I actually like leveling.)

By all intents and purposes, they should have just charged us the price of the game, the $14.95 a month sub, and only give us 1 character slot. Period.

But I get that this is how they made their game. So... /shrug

There are some people who will play enough to fill those slots up and actually level the characters in all the classes.  I personally think it's insane, but they do it.

I don't really care if I have 8 character slots or not.  I'm very content with my one character.

(06-05-2015, 11:56 PM)hauntmedoitagain Wrote: Not exactly. Say you pick up BRD, but you've been a mage at heart. Well, guess what? Now you have to pick up 34 levels of LNC just so you won't run out of TP and have a reasonable burst, all skills you won't be able to use on anything but those two classes. That is hardly an incentive, especially with all the gear nonsense; only soldiery gear is able to be acquired on a reasonable time frame. Everything else is either luck and/or a grind.

And I'm sorry, but if you have to artificially elongate progress in a video game to keep people in it, then the problem lies not with the pacing, but with the core design itself. Ironically, FFXIV doesn't have this problem, so why does SQX bother? Cosmetics and housing are the only real end-game, not a hackneyed treadmill that only a minority will enjoy for a few months before picking up the next new shiny MMO.

That's a personal opinion.  There are many people very devoted to the PvE endgame, and you have no right to denigrate their focus.

What's more, you were complaining earlier that SE won't let us grind Tomes and gear all day erry day, but now you're complaining about having to grind classes to get cross-classes.  I'm entirely confused as to how you are working this out logically.

(06-09-2015, 01:43 AM)Oswin Wrote:

(06-09-2015, 12:36 AM)Naunet Wrote:

(06-08-2015, 08:36 PM)Oswin Wrote: Given the nature of cross skill abilities and the ease of switching to the new jobs once you meet the requirements, I see no reason why people wouldn't want to level an off class first. Truth of the matter is that people are going to have to level that cross skill class at some point, why not just do it right away?

Not all the way to 50 they won't.

I don't know if you understand what I'm trying to say. The truth of the matter is that new classes are locked in Ishgard. New players can't play them and must play another class. Why not play a class that will benefit your future main class?

(06-09-2015, 02:17 AM)Tyndles Wrote: I think he means that you don't need to play the class to 50 to get all the benefits out of it, and if they find the class dreadful, why stick with it to 50?  It would be faster (because it'd be more fun, and you'd play more often this way) to get paladin to..whatever you need for provoke then start over with something that MIGHT be more entertaining.   

I really wish they'd just open up the gates to everyone and let people mad dash at level 30 to get to Ishgard for the new classes.  That would be funny.