(10-15-2013, 08:27 PM)Nimarhie Wrote: Some of the things in the Sociology part I didn't know about, very interesting.

(10-15-2013, 08:35 PM)LiadansWhisper Wrote: I'm curious...why communes?  Is that a word from the wiki that I missed, or something you came up with?  If the latter, why that word?  I dunno why, but it bugs me.  xD

(10-15-2013, 08:49 PM)ShayRei Wrote:

(10-15-2013, 08:35 PM)LiadansWhisper Wrote: I'm curious...why communes?  Is that a word from the wiki that I missed, or something you came up with?  If the latter, why that word?  I dunno why, but it bugs me.  xD

Communes is just something I came up with. A play on community which is used in the wiki. 

I thought it fit the bill for tribe, but not a tribe.. community.. but a closed one?  Haha

(10-15-2013, 09:07 PM)LiadansWhisper Wrote:

(10-15-2013, 08:49 PM)ShayRei Wrote:

(10-15-2013, 08:35 PM)LiadansWhisper Wrote: I'm curious...why communes?  Is that a word from the wiki that I missed, or something you came up with?  If the latter, why that word?  I dunno why, but it bugs me.  xD

Communes is just something I came up with. A play on community which is used in the wiki. 

I thought it fit the bill for tribe, but not a tribe.. community.. but a closed one?  Haha

Well, uh, because Communes is normally associated with Communism, and your society doesn't fit that at all, it was just confusing is all!

Thanks for the clarification!

Quote:Each member within the community is expected to hold a skill-set vital to the success of the commune. While difficult, the climb can and has been made from the bottom of the social ranking toward the top and into a house of influence. 

(10-15-2013, 09:24 PM)Nako Vesh Wrote: I like the ideas and creativity you have going here, and I was thinking we might have to have a player-made Keeper compendium sooner or later if SE didn't provide more lore. 

I do question a few points however. As brought up in this thread, we don't have a whole lot of real life matriarchal societies to draw upon when imagining the Keepers, but there are a few. I was personally quite taken with the idea that, like the Mosuo, Miqote might take mating/coupling/relationships in a far less formal tone than you have suggested here.

It makes sense to me that a society that highly values physicality in the form of hunting and sport, would put less emphasis on social status or class through other means. I personally see them as gaining status almost entirely through prowess in battle, while some reverence is based bloodlines. I personally don't see "class" playing a part much at all.

Quote:Each member within the community is expected to hold a skill-set vital to the success of the commune. While difficult, the climb can and has been made from the bottom of the social ranking toward the top and into a house of influence. 

I don't really think Keepers should veer into the area of family houses personally. I like the idea of small tribes better.

(10-15-2013, 09:24 PM)Nako Vesh Wrote: I like the ideas and creativity you have going here, and I was thinking we might have to have a player-made Keeper compendium sooner or later if SE didn't provide more lore. 

I do question a few points however. As brought up in this thread, we don't have a whole lot of real life matriarchal societies to draw upon when imagining the Keepers, but there are a few. I was personally quite taken with the idea that, like the Mosuo, Miqote might take mating/coupling/relationships in a far less formal tone than you have suggested here.

It makes sense to me that a society that highly values physicality in the form of hunting and sport, would put less emphasis on social status or class through other means. I personally see them as gaining status almost entirely through prowess in battle, while some reverence is based bloodlines. I personally don't see "class" playing a part much at all.

Quote:Each member within the community is expected to hold a skill-set vital to the success of the commune. While difficult, the climb can and has been made from the bottom of the social ranking toward the top and into a house of influence. 

I don't really think Keepers should veer into the area of family houses personally. I like the idea of small tribes better.

Quote:This topic has been poked at to death many times in the past, my favorite post on the subject can be found herehttp://ffxiv-roleplayers.com/showthread.php?tid=2961). I'm not saying you have to accept it, but it does make reasonable conclusions regarding what a fantastical culture with these features would be like.

(10-15-2013, 10:28 PM)ShayRei Wrote: Keepers have stepped beyond that towards a world of industry and trade (something I think, from examples of the U tribe in game, that some Seekers struggle with). ..

...With that would come a shift in value that's placed on physicality and battle prowess(seekers) and lean it in toward wealth and status... 

...I understand the Keepers to lean more toward to monogamy. The structure of the higher class's "courtship" seemed to fit with a matriarchy as well as still cling to some sort of tribal ancestry.  Freedom would be found in the majority of the population within the normal/lower castes... 

...As to the house phrasing, I think I just worded it incorrectly. I didn't mean they had literal houses.. although it does fit with my structure, I suppose. There, though, I merely meant they would gain affluence.

(10-15-2013, 10:42 PM)allgivenover Wrote:

(10-15-2013, 10:28 PM)ShayRei Wrote: Keepers have stepped beyond that towards a world of industry and trade (something I think, from examples of the U tribe in game, that some Seekers struggle with). ..

...With that would come a shift in value that's placed on physicality and battle prowess(seekers) and lean it in toward wealth and status... 

...I understand the Keepers to lean more toward to monogamy. The structure of the higher class's "courtship" seemed to fit with a matriarchy as well as still cling to some sort of tribal ancestry.  Freedom would be found in the majority of the population within the normal/lower castes... 

...As to the house phrasing, I think I just worded it incorrectly. I didn't mean they had literal houses.. although it does fit with my structure, I suppose. There, though, I merely meant they would gain affluence.

Some of this makes for some nteresting places that Keeper culture could go as a whole in light of the calamity, but it has absolutely no basis in lore whatsoever. I know it's frustrating that we don't details on such an atypical culture that many RPers are keen on being a part of, but that doesn't give us the right to just make it up and form a "player made compendium".

(10-15-2013, 10:16 PM)allgivenover Wrote: Keepers do not pair up monogamously. They have breeding males ala the Seekers of the Sun. Unfortunately we have no details beyond that.

From a level 25 Quarry Mill levequest that states explicitly that Keepers have breeding males as well (I forget the name at the moment)







Or its a way of saying age. "3 young women and 1 adult male" just that Keepers consider sexual activity to be a part of adult quality. This does not mean they use the Seeker method and could easily hold more closely to monogomous relationships.


Secondly, this topic needs a disclaimer that a lot of this is your invention, isn't canon, and relies on a large number of assumptions. We don't get to decide the lore or the direction that Keepers should take, SE does. Unfortunately SE only gave us scraps and scarce details that begged even more questions. In the case of Keepers, all we ever got regarding sexuality and mating was the description that they are matriarchal and that males are rare. Few conclusions can be drawn from so little canon info, Keepers being monogamous isn't one of them.

Consider this, Miqo'te males are born very rarely (there is ONE that we get to see in game), if they paired monogamously with females there wouldn't be enough males to pair with, and as a result the Keepers would have passed into obscurity long ago.

(10-15-2013, 10:54 PM)Nimarhie Wrote: I think part of the trouble we might be having is that we are trying to stuff cat-people into a human cultural view. Among humans its considered bad for people to be promiscuous, at least in most cultures. Cats however do not share that view point. They go into heat and they go off and find a likely bed-buddy for a few minutes to half an hour.