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TheLastCandle · **02-14-2014, 02:51 PM**

(02-14-2014, 11:39 AM)Ami Wrote: I agree with Artorias in this matter. ICly, my character can perform the standard Jump, Elusive Jump, and Spineshatter Dive moves. Dragonfire Dive, the ultimate jump, I believe is an Azure only move (though I will use it OOCly!!). Although, Kiana is able to pull these moves off due to years and years of training and honing herself. Is it completely natural? No. Normal people can't pull those off. Butt his is a world of magic, where aether flows, and aether can enhance (yes, mental justification for dragoons having an MP pool when we do not cast spells at all).

I've never been keen on the idea of everyone having a small gem that grants these powers. Makes it all feel cheap and Caracker Jack box-like.

Agree with all of this, including the Soul Gem bit.

Yvelont has little concept of magick (he'll never ICly be a Conjurer/Arcanist/Thaumaturge) and doesn't attribute the Dragoon abilities to Aetheric manipulation at all - though OOC I absolutely think this is the case. In training Kiht, he puts this into terms he understands, explaining how to "focus" and so on to successfully perform the Jump.

FreelanceWizard · **02-14-2014, 04:29 PM**

The whole "innate manipulation of Aether" thing (like Charms, for those who're familiar with Exalted Smile

) is an interpretation I like a great deal, personally. It explains how adventurers can stand toe to toe with Garleans and their highly advanced equipment, how they can fell dragons with swords, and how they can do all the insane moves you see Archers and Marauders pulling off.

The really intriguing part of that to me is how it opens up a lot of doors for RP. Can magic be used to alter, enhance, or serve the place of those sorts of "innate" powers? How do they interact with magical force? Is a highly trained mage better or worse at picking those skills up? Is there a way to merge the effects of spell magic with this intuitive magic? Quite a few conversations can be had on the topic, with characters theorizing over snifters of Ul'dahn brandy. Smile

Cato · **02-14-2014, 04:41 PM**

I decided to play it safe and tried to avoid defining my character as an actual class to allow for a lot more flexibility. He wields a lance as his weapon of choice but that doesn't automatically make him a dragoon. He doesn't leap through the air or cause fire to rain down upon his foes.Â

A lot of people criticise the core classes as being rigid but there's really nothing forcing your character to follow the main story or job quests when creating one's character. There's Garleans, mercenaries, pirates, bandits and even cultists that fight with a lance. I think the game does an excellent job of providing the tools for role-players to use to reflect those particular roles if they so wish.

So with that in mind if people do decide to have their character be a dragoon IC then I expect them to do it well. It's meant to be rather unusual, rare and prestigious.

TheLastCandle · **02-14-2014, 07:07 PM**

(02-14-2014, 04:29 PM)FreelanceWizard Wrote: The whole "innate manipulation of Aether" thing (like Charms, for those who're familiar with Exalted ) is an interpretation I like a great deal, personally. It explains how adventurers can stand toe to toe with Garleans and their highly advanced equipment, how they can fell dragons with swords, and how they can do all the insane moves you see Archers and Marauders pulling off.

The really intriguing part of that to me is how it opens up a lot of doors for RP. Can magic be used to alter, enhance, or serve the place of those sorts of "innate" powers? How do they interact with magical force? Is a highly trained mage better or worse at picking those skills up? Is there a way to merge the effects of spell magic with this intuitive magic? Quite a few conversations can be had on the topic, with characters theorizing over snifters of Ul'dahn brandy.

Yvelont would be intrigued by the posit, and it might open doors to further aetheric study - which could be interesting. But I prefer to do my theorizing over drams of Sea Wolf whiskey. Big Grin

Aya · **02-14-2014, 07:27 PM**

I know how to wield a lance, how to dance with it, and how to make jump attacks.Â Sometimes I unconsciously mimic the Dragoons I watched practicing when I was a child.

I don't think I am a dragoon, but I don't think there's any particular reason I cannot fight like one Smile

Knight Kat · **02-14-2014, 08:14 PM**

I see no reason why aether manipulation can't be used to explain a "standard" Dragoon's abilities. If that is a sort of consensus then I am fine with it, and will even have my character learn those abilities too.

However, I do not think the lore should be ignored altogether. Like Theodric said:

Quote:So with that in mind if people do decide to have their character be a dragoon IC then I expect them to do it well. It's meant to be rather unusual, rare and prestigious.

I agree with that, but the problem is, "doing it well" is a highly subjective term. That is why the lore is there; it sets boundaries (god help me I sound like a lore hound).

It is said time and again in countless NPC dialogues that the Azure Dragoon has the power of a DRAGON. The Azure Dragoon can leap into the sky and fight amongst the clouds. Should any other Dragoon really be able to do that? If someone were to ICly leap high into the sky (like Superman) in front of me I just don't think I could take them seriously. Jumping from rooftop to rooftop, jumping onto a high boulder, leaping over a foes head to land on the other side of them, leaping into a foe and kicking off of them into a back-flip to land in a previous spot, sounds fine to me. With the previously mentioned aether manipulation and training, I can see that being possible. But if anyone did "ima jump this mountain in a single leap!"; sorry, I just can't bring myself to ICly acknowledge that.

TheWizard · **02-14-2014, 09:13 PM**

(02-14-2014, 08:14 PM)Knight Kat Wrote: I see no reason why aether manipulation can't be used to explain a "standard" Dragoon's abilities. If that is a sort of consensus then I am fine with it, and will even have my character learn those abilities too.

However, I do not think the lore should be ignored altogether. Like Theodric said:

Quote:So with that in mind if people do decide to have their character be a dragoon IC then I expect them to do it well. It's meant to be rather unusual, rare and prestigious.

I agree with that, but the problem is, "doing it well" is a highly subjective term. That is why the lore is there; it sets boundaries (god help me I sound like a lore hound).

It is said time and again in countless NPC dialogues that the Azure Dragoon has the power of a DRAGON. The Azure Dragoon can leap into the sky and fight amongst the clouds. Should any other Dragoon really be able to do that? If someone were to ICly leap high into the sky (like Superman) in front of me I just don't think I could take them seriously. Jumping from rooftop to rooftop, jumping onto a high boulder, leaping over a foes head to land on the other side of them, leaping into a foe and kicking off of them into a back-flip to land in a previous spot, sounds fine to me. With the previously mentioned aether manipulation and training, I can see that being possible. But if anyone did "ima jump this mountain in a single leap!"; sorry, I just can't bring myself to ICly acknowledge that.

Yeah I can buy into the idea of aether manipulation coupled with intense endurance and acrobatic training to allow for impressive combat feats that dragoons are known for, and certainly this kind of training wouldn't be offered to 'normal' people so it would make the dragoon combat style impressive to watch.

And in regards to the Dragoon Soul Crystal, it is likely a manifestation or link to the Eye of Nidhogg which chooses an Azure Dragoon. Its obvious they are linked because both the Eye AND the Soul Crystal react to you in the quest line which proves they are linked so why would EVERY dragoon have one of them then? They wouldn't do anything for a normal person so unlike the soul stones for Scholars and Summoners I don't feel that other Ishgardian dragoons would have soul stones and are reserved for the 'special snowflake' quality of the Azure Dragoon.

Steel Wolf · **02-16-2014, 08:30 AM**

When it comes to VERY specific jobs like the Dragoon, I always liked to treat the combat animations as mere representations of other attacks.Â A jump or any number of jump moves could be re-interpreted IC'ly as a very powerful leaping attack that doesn't have the user dropping down on an enemy's head in a ball of hellfire.

Most of Steel's moves are ignored IC'ly--or, at least, the majority of the effects are.Â Some, like Flash, are generated by aether and her training with the Sultansworn, but other moves like Spirits Within and Savage Blade don't have the level of flashiness in my mind's eye.

Perhaps that could be another way to look at things?

...although, now reading that, that doesn't particularly help the IC Dragoons as referenced in the thread title, does it? <.<;;

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