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LadyRochester · **06-24-2015, 09:36 AM**

1. There's a lot of OOC saltiness based on IC interactions (and vice-versa):Â While most people claim they "would never take IC OOC!" claims like this should be taken with a grain of salt. I play a manipulative character that often deceives people, and more than once I had to deal with unnecessary OOC drama because someone took offense to my IC actions, despite my warnings about her personality and tendencies. If it fits the character, don't get angry at the player. I understand being all "Aw, I didn't expect that..", I even understand pouting for a bit! But becoming bitter and treating the player as your sworn enemy over RP is hurtful and silly, which leads me to the next thing...

2. People do a lot of OOCÂ gossiping: Shock and awe. This is probably old news to everyone, but still something that should be brought to light. I don't know why, but people talk a lot of shit OOC. I can't say I am completely innocent myself, but I've seen people literally obsessed over other players. And many of the people who spread these rumors are hardly ever questioned, while the subject of the topic is almost never spoken to for the sake of knowing the truth.Â

3. There are a lot of (hypocritical) Social Justice Warriors: Many people try to fight for "justice" and go on witch-hunts against players they consider "so meeen!" when told a story without given proper context. This has led to endless harassment towards people that truly don't deserve it based on loose "proof" and false stories. And yet again, nobody ever questions the source or bothers to contact the subject of the topic.Â

In conclusion, people in the RP community seem to be absolutely obsessed with OOC drama. And when confronted about it, they will flail their arms and give some bullshit excuse like "BUT I THOUGHT WHAT I DID WAS RIGHT!"

You don't counter harassment with more harassment, you don't counter the truth with lies (or even "half-truths"), and you certainly don't fix a problem between two (or more) players by spreading the word and attempting to get the whole community involved. Those who claim that this "helps" the community are lying to others and themselves.

I have never encountered a community that soÂ successfully managed to harass and harm people while deluding themselves into thinking they are innocent and doing it for "the better".Â HarassmentÂ is notÂ cool, and regardless of your issues with other players, talking shit and bending the truth to make yourself look better DOES NOT make you a better person. You have a problem? Keep it between you and the player, spreading the fire is not only counter-productive, but it makes you look like shit. This isn't high school.

Disclaimer: This does not apply to all RPers, but to a rather important fraction of them. So please, do not take offense to an observation.

***Maril*** · **06-24-2015, 09:55 AM**

Just about all RP communities I've ever been in have been filled with a certain degree of these issues. I frequently hear rumors about myself, and try to shrug them off. Sometimes I get angry and upset/sad, mostly if I find out that it's caused other people not to approach me - but at the end of the day, if they would rather take a rumor as truth then.. Well. People don't understand that gossip reaches around and hurts people behind the screen, causes their day to go awry, and in some cases drives them away from playing the game. There aren't very many people who experience these things that ever deserved it, if it is even something you can ever deserve.Â
I do agree that drama shouldn't ever be spread. It's bad enough as it is, you do not need to involve twenty more people - it won't aid. Most roleplayers I know hate getting involved with OOC drama. It sucks the fun out of everything. Especially since most drama is just down to communication errors anyways, someone misunderstanding an intended joke or reading a word in a different meaning. Some of the worst drama's I have ever seen all were resolved when things got explained properly.

Aaron · **06-24-2015, 10:01 AM**

I don't talk trash about people lol there's plenty rpers around that can confirm this.

But if someone has something negative to say about me, all I ask is you man (or woman) up and tell me lol what am I gonna do reach through the screen and choke you?

If we still can't resolve the problem then I just go "Well, you CAN Blist you know?" Luckily I've never had a serious issue with anyone yet at least to my knowledge. Every one I talk to in game seems welcoming to me (flex).

But if people hate me for something rp relationship or something I wont be mad! Ill just cast "Salted Earth" over you every time I see you and move along.

Spethah · **06-24-2015, 10:08 AM**

(06-24-2015, 09:36 AM)LadyRochester Wrote: I have never encountered a community that soÂ successfully managed to harass and harm people while deluding themselves into thinking they are innocent and doing it for "the better".Â HarassmentÂ is notÂ cool, and regardless of your issues with other players, talking shit and bending the truth to make yourself look better DOES NOT make you a better person. You have a problem? Keep it between you and the player, spreading the fire is not only counter-productive, but it makes you look like shit. This isn't high school.

This. So much this.Â

A few friends of mine from an FC, one that I will not state, has received a lot of slander from the leader because of something small and very much justified. Just because they left under minor disagreement and wishing to join another FC that better suits their wishes does not give you the right to suddenly go passive aggressive and send absolute lies to that FC the poor person wants to join.Â

Talking shit and bending the truth really does not make you look good at all, especially when people find out you're doing that or worse they find out you're flat out lying. I'm no innocent person myself, I've shit talked a few people myself and with pretty good reason. Still doesn't make me any better than them though, even if it's a rare moment for me. The key phrase in all of this would be this:

If you have nothing good to say, say nothing at all.Â

Now why, you ask, did I put that in larger font as well as bold and italic? Because it's a very important phrase that tends to be ignored. Yes I'm a hypocrite for saying it when I just said that I also shit talk, but it is a worthwhile message.

Lilia Lia · **06-24-2015, 10:19 AM**

One thing that I've found is that some people don't enjoy RP that contains a lot of surprises.Â For myself personally, and for you also I'd imagine, good RP contains a lot of unexpected twists and turns and forces me to react spontaneously to something I may not have expected.Â

But what I'm starting to learn is that there are some players who don't feel this way and who don't appreciate unexpected twists and turns being thrown into their roleplay.Â There's not much you can do about this except try to remember who they are and try to get a feel for whether or not this kind of RP is going to be considered okay.Â For me, I don't enjoy RPing something where the outcome is expected at the outset, because that's kind of like spoiling the surprise of the story.Â But I think there are some people who are genuinely upset when their RP takes an unexpected twist, maybe because they feel like it causes them to lose control over what's happening.

You'd better believe I've been there before.Â I was in a situation once where Lilia got someone angry (it happens) and that person took it OOC'ly personally, and then started trying to "get me in trouble" with my FC.Â I sure got called a lot of really nasty things right while I was there, and I can only imagine how bad it was when I wasn't around.Â And the most hurtful of all those things was when she said, "and I'm not the only one who feels this way about you."Â That just made me want to quit the whole game and never look back.Â It's really, really miserable and it's a rotten thing to do to someone.

The best you can do is not let it get to you, Sasha.Â People will be the way they are, but you can take every opportunity to prove them wrong in their misconceptions, and I'm sure you will do that.Â When it comes to people who don't like surprises, well... I guess that's just one of those things you have to accept as a sad reality of roleplay.Â The alternative is to forecast every event in your RP but that would completely ruin the experience for most people, I'd think.

Sigil.9054 · **06-24-2015, 10:29 AM**

If it makes you feel any better, the RP community I just came from (for a different game), has some pretty massive issues, and basically the same things you just mentioned. Â The community I was poking around before that was much the same, and so-on and so-forth. Â

I'm starting to suspect it's the price of admission for MMO RP, to such a degree that I was about to start taking bets on how long it was before I saw a thread like this.

(19 hrs, 56 min)

Nebbs · **06-24-2015, 10:39 AM**

I don't think that it can be boiled down to an answer, it is a feature that we have to with with. Â "If it is raining, don't complain about the rain, get an umbrella"Â

People = drama, that is just the basics. RP does not avoid this or create it, it simply give yet another context to have it.

Drama will happen, what really matters is what you do about it. If you give it any air time it will only grow (bad), the only answer is to push/focus on harmony and avoid those who can not put aside their differences or attitude. Create and grow the reasons to be together and many will accept that and let the drama diminish.

Now on the issue of IC, the player control the actions of the character. So there will always be some responsibility for how that is perceived, even if people let it bleed into OOC. You chose to play a character that pushes things, there are consequences.

On the flip of this I see people playing abrasive/challenging types and expecting either an easy ride, or not actually getting IC push back and ostracised.Â

However, some of my best RP friendships have been over playing IC characters that dislike and hate each other.

Absolutely we should understand that behind the character is a RL person, and all that comes with that. *hugs*

[edit] I have been involved in and probably caused drama. If any think they are drama free, they are probably in denial.

Magellan · **06-24-2015, 11:22 AM**

@Lilla: I'm one of those people who doesn't enjoy surprises. This isn't a personal attack on anyone, but I simply do not trust the basic rpers story telling skills. I've had someone try to eat one of my chars, and they didn't have an out. I've had chars I've poured countless hours into become broken to the point of no longer fun to play by surprises. While I try not to stir up any ooc drama, it does leave me ooc upset to lose my joy over a character

The solution I've come up with iS extensive ooc communication. Â Especially initially. Â I have people I've rpd years with who can surprise me all they want because that lvl of trust is there. But new people? That trust has to be built first. Usually by engaging in safer rp and feeling each other out.

Aduu Avagnar · **06-24-2015, 11:28 AM**

I haven't actually encountered much in the way of that concerning myself. There was one incident which lasted a while, but again, all I heard from that was that I was apparently a metagamer and a godmodder.

But I will admit that I do sometimes make a joke at someones expense if I find it funny. But I'm a bad person.

Lilia Lia · **06-24-2015, 02:46 PM**

(06-24-2015, 11:22 AM)Magellan Wrote: @Lilla: I'm one of those people who doesn't enjoy surprises. This isn't a personal attack on anyone, but I simply do not trust the basic rpers story telling skills. I've had someone try to eat one of my chars, and they didn't have an out. I've had chars I've poured countless hours into become broken to the point of no longer fun to play by surprises. While I try not to stir up any ooc drama, it does leave me ooc upset to lose my joy over a character

The solution I've come up with iS extensive ooc communication. Â Especially initially. Â I have people I've rpd years with who can surprise me all they want because that lvl of trust is there. But new people? That trust has to be built first. Usually by engaging in safer rp and feeling each other out.

I hope you'll believe me that I'm not judging anyone for having this attitude towards RP.Â When I said "sad reality" I meant that it's unfortunate that RPers always run the risk of giving rise to hard feelings when they try to create unexpected situations.Â

I've also been struggling with how to react to other people's RP choices that I think are implausible or asking too much of me.Â The whole glamour thing is a good example.Â I've found it a little disruptive that so much of my RP over the next few weeks is going to be me playing different instances of the same "reacting to sudden race change" interaction, and that it's going to so significantly alter my storyline with other characters.Â But there are a lot of concessions that we have to make as RPers in the interest of keeping everyone happy.Â

Of course there are times when it's simply inappropriate, but I also think that Sasha is right that the proper response is not to gossip about people and make false assumptions about their OOC character on the basis of IC interactions.

Verad · **06-24-2015, 03:09 PM**

I'd like to know what triggered this relevant and useful PSA full of information that people didn't know.

Cato · **06-24-2015, 03:14 PM**

One thing I've noticed is that a lot of role-players desperately try to portray themselves as friendly, welcoming, supportive and nice. They're usually backed up by their buddies who agree with them...and yet in reality they're some of the most manipulative and spiteful individuals I've ever encountered.

Sadly this isn't anything new. I hold the - perhaps unpopular - belief that many role-players are addicted to drama or are afflicted with various issues in the real world that leads them to use online interaction as a way of 'acting out' and therefore anything that inconveniences them is taken as a horrific personal attack that is usually countered with disproportionate retribution.

I'll admit, some days I wonder why I bother with the role-playing community. Luckily there's quite a few shining gems that are well worth the effort to invest in. Plus I love the game itself so that certainly gives me a reason to stick around.

Lilia Lia · **06-24-2015, 03:15 PM**

(06-24-2015, 03:09 PM)Verad Wrote: I'd like to know what triggered this relevant and useful PSA full of information that people didn't know.

The point of a "rant" is not to be relevant or useful.Â It's to get your feelings out in the open and possibly get the support of like-minded people.

Verad · **06-24-2015, 03:17 PM**

(06-24-2015, 03:15 PM)Lilia Lia Wrote:
(06-24-2015, 03:09 PM)Verad Wrote: I'd like to know what triggered this relevant and useful PSA full of information that people didn't know.

The point of a "rant" is not to be relevant or useful.Â It's to get your feelings out in the open and possibly get the support of like-minded people.

And I'd like to know what triggered that.

Blue · **06-24-2015, 03:22 PM**

Ouch, now this is something I hadn't realized of the community. I never hear anyone talk about me... but maybe that's because in two years I have barely RPd with anyone on these boards. I suppose shyness/introversion has its advantages sometimes.

Though, I'll admit, I like to complain talk about people with my close friends a lot, usually about PUGs, or people that irritate me in general. I do it as a way to vent and steam off quickly so to avoid holding grudges in the future, and I know that I'm doing it with people that will keep the stuff I say between ourselves and not spread it causing unnecessary drama. I don't agree with "if you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all", but more with "If you have something not nice to say, say it in a way that will not hurt anyone". Holding stuff in ends up boiling under your skin and make things worse, on my experience.

BUT! Before you start flaming me, no, I haven't spoken "trash" about anyone here because, again, in these two years I haven't known more than a handful of people, and that handful has been pretty nice and also pretty short interactions that really couldn't cause any complaint on my part. Which is a big compliment, cause us Italians tend to find stuff to complain about easily. I should probably work as a trade unionist!

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OOC drama and the RP community. (A rant)

RPC has moved! These pages have been kept for historical purposes