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Lilia Lia · **07-11-2015, 07:01 PM**

(07-11-2015, 06:46 PM)Shoshopu Wrote: To anyone who argues "if it exists why don't we see it being weaponized/used more often" etc, that's why, I would say. It's very rare, expensive, difficult to make, etc. Just not efficient to use at all except for very specific or special cases (such as, as someone pointed out, transgender characters? which is what my friends had used it for in their RP).

My main problem with this is... how wealthy are these characters who are using the "rare extremely expensive potion" explanation? How do they justify spending such a great deal of wealth on something that is essentially cosmetic? It would take a very wealthy, very extravagant person who is extremely vain to spend a small fortune changing their appearance on a whim.

Also... 2.0 spoilers --

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I'm only saying this for posterity and food for thought, of course.Â People can RP however they want, but they should know when their "explanations" aren't persuasive.

FreelanceWizard · **07-11-2015, 07:13 PM**

In fairness, Fernehalwes's statement regarding Fantasia and how it works at London Fan Fest means that you couldn't use it for that purpose:

"Fantasia works in a unique way. I canâ€™t simply turn you into whoever you want, or people could get away with anything. Crime would be out of control. Even on Earth, people have the opportunity to change who they are â€“ cut their hair, get a facelift, find a new career or a different spouse â€“ but we often arenâ€™t willing to make those drastic life changes. Fantasia gives you the courage to make the changes youâ€™ve always wanted to make. Maybe you are Lalafell trapped in a Roegadynâ€™s body, itâ€™s time to break out! And all you needed was that courage in a phial!" (reference)

EDIT: Yes, I know this is a... unique dev statement here. Smile

I'm not saying this specifies anything about fantasia one way or another, just that the devs are aware of what rampant "plastic surgery in a bottle" could do.

Shoshopu · **07-11-2015, 07:43 PM**

(07-11-2015, 07:01 PM)Lilia Lia Wrote: I find this explanation wholly unsatisfactory.Â 2.0 spoilers --

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Before the Fall spoilersThe Main Story Quest involves a complex deception plot by some of the wealthiest people in the realm - who presumably would have been able to afford this rare, expensive potion for their own purposes.Â And yet you never see it anywhere, it's never spoken of.

My second and main problem with this is... how wealthy are these characters who are using the "rare extremely expensive potion" explanation?Â How do they justify spending such a great deal of wealth on something that is essentially cosmetic?Â It would take a very wealthy, very extravagant person who is extremely vain to spend a small fortune changing their appearance on a whim.

I'm only saying this for posterity and food for thought, of course.Â People can RP however they want, but they should know when their "explanations" aren't persuasive.

I don't know if you're responding like, in general or to the specific situation I presented of my friends using it, but I was trying to make it very clear I wouldn't suggest should using it to "change their appearance on a whim", and what they were using for was very much not "essentially cosmetic". I think the reason my friends (and people who use the Fantasia for similar purposes) used it for was completely valid and justified! I too kinda frown on it being taken lightly, just because that's not, like, super compelling to me, storytelling-wise? But only just kinda frown.

Also it's possible those super rich characters in question just weren't interested in it? Or possible side-effects? Who knows?

(07-11-2015, 07:13 PM)FreelanceWizard Wrote: In fairness, Fernehalwes's statement regarding Fantasia and how it works at London Fan Fest means that you couldn't use it for that purpose:

"Fantasia works in a unique way. I canâ€™t simply turn you into whoever you want, or people could get away with anything. Crime would be out of control. Even on Earth, people have the opportunity to change who they are â€“ cut their hair, get a facelift, find a new career or a different spouse â€“ but we often arenâ€™t willing to make those drastic life changes. Fantasia gives you the courage to make the changes youâ€™ve always wanted to make. Maybe you are Lalafell trapped in a Roegadynâ€™s body, itâ€™s time to break out! And all you needed was that courage in a phial!" (reference)

EDIT: Yes, I know this is a... unique dev statement here. I'm not saying this specifies anything about fantasia one way or another, just that the devs are aware of what rampant "plastic surgery in a bottle" could do.

Ah, I gladly stand corrected! I forgot Fernehalwes had said something on it, too. Thanks for that!

Lilia Lia · **07-11-2015, 07:47 PM**

(07-11-2015, 07:43 PM)Shoshopu Wrote: I don't know if you're responding like, in general or to the specific situation I presented of my friends using it, but I was trying to make it very clear I wouldn't suggest should using it to "change their appearance on a whim", and what they were using for was very much not "essentially cosmetic".Â

I was responding in general.Â It's a really commonly used explanation for Fantasia and I've seen it used in connection with the "Glamour" justification a lot recently, too.Â People from tribal backgrounds having enough wealth to purchase an extremely luxurious commodity for the purpose of changing their appearance.Â People should just be aware that it raises more questions than it answers... where did the money come from?Â Why did the character feel so strongly about changing their race that they expended such a great deal of wealth on it?Â And so on.Â Sadly people have a tendency to leave these unanswered and treat the Fantasia issue as something they wish would just go away.

Shoshopu · **07-11-2015, 09:37 PM**

(07-11-2015, 07:47 PM)Lilia Lia Wrote:
(07-11-2015, 07:43 PM)Shoshopu Wrote: I don't know if you're responding like, in general or to the specific situation I presented of my friends using it, but I was trying to make it very clear I wouldn't suggest should using it to "change their appearance on a whim", and what they were using for was very much not "essentially cosmetic".Â

I was responding in general.Â It's a really commonly used explanation for Fantasia and I've seen it used in connection with the "Glamour" justification a lot recently, too.Â People from tribal backgrounds having enough wealth to purchase an extremely luxurious commodity for the purpose of changing their appearance.Â People should just be aware that it raises more questions than it answers... where did the money come from?Â Why did the character feel so strongly about changing their race that they expended such a great deal of wealth on it?Â And so on.Â Sadly people have a tendency to leave these unanswered and treat the Fantasia issue as something they wish would just go away.

Ah, we're basically of the same mind then. I just feel like I'm probably more lax/forgiving than a lot of people in this thread (at least in the first few pages or so). That kind of stuff falls into the "as long as the storytelling/writing around it is good and it's fun for the people involved" thing.

Every situation's different, depending on the characters, which/how many characters around them that it's going to effect, etc.... it's something a lot of thought should be put into on a situational basis for sure, and the mileage may vary. But for now I'm going to say it should be possible because I'd rather have more storytelling options than less.

JaadIsiil · **07-12-2015, 10:59 PM**

My character was involved in an aetheric reaction (explosion) due to an investigation of high aetheric activity outside of Mor Dhona. He randomly changes appearances and goes on as if that was his (or her) body from birth. His memories are in tact, but all past events were as the current body with no recollection or knowledge that a change has even occurred. The same with the name change; one day hes "Jaad" the next he could be Aeylin (the same applies, after a random change has occurred, that is who he is, you can address him as the former, but he'd stare at you confused or think you were addressing someone else)

Mercurias · **07-19-2015, 05:42 PM**

(06-26-2014, 07:22 AM)Yangh Wrote: I've just come back after a about two months of RL getting in the way and I see that Fantasia's are buyable now?

What is the consensus of using one ICly to change race / sex ect...?

Please let me know!

Also, Hello to anyone who knows / cared enough to miss me. xD

Hi I didn't know you to miss you but welcome back.

According the the FFXIV dev team during one of the fanfests, the Fantasia potion 'gives you the courage to be who you always were on the inside' rather than actually changing you.Â

In other words, that's their cute way of saying it is not actually in lore...Or that it's some truly epic booze.

The ONLY time that I would personally go with a Fantasia IC is if the character never actually changed how they looked and it was all in their head, and that would be played for laughs.

So official lore says Fantasia isn't a thing. Feel free to take that information as you will. It's your RP and you can play it how you want. I personally go by official game lore as much as possible, but that's me and you're you.

Sin · **07-19-2015, 07:40 PM**

Check time stamps!

Uther · **07-19-2015, 07:49 PM**

(06-26-2014, 07:26 AM)Warren Castille Wrote: I'm going to be in the minority I suspect, but I don't much care for it. Just hanging out in the Quicksand has let me overhear probably a dozen "I drank it by accident / it spilled on me / someone baked it into cookies" and while there's nothing inherently wrong with that...

It makes me wonder why we're not just weaponizing it and turning every enemy we find into someone else. RIP Dravanian horde, you are now all lalafell.

(I only read to this comment, so I'm not going to respond to all of you. Sorry.)

This is exactly how I feel about it. While there is lore behind Fantasia (sort of...?) and you can't be called out for it by anyone who has the slightest patience for other people, I've always kind of seen it as a "Really? That's how you wanted to handle this?" situation.

You can IC it if you want, but it'd be a lot more refreshing if you just didn't. Because while there's lore within the Fantasia tooltip, it doesn't really specify how that works. I doubt you're ICly brought to a character creation screen. We don't really know if it turns you into something random or something you want or something the person who gave it to you wants. It's more messy and goofy than just a retcon.

If that's how you want to play it, fine, go for it. I'm not trying to stop anyone from playing the game how they want, but personally I try to avoid it.

Ftr, I started my main (Uther) as a Hyur Midlander, but once I started questing in Coerthas early in ARR I decided he'd fit better as an Elezen. I just retconned him to have always been Elezen, but his father gave all of his children Midlander given names to teach them some humility from birth, since the Midlanders are generally less fortunate overall than Elezen in Ishgard, but just as brave/righteous/cool/whatever.

This is a bit rambly, but my point is there are better ways to go about it than IC race changes, although that isÂ an option.

Uther · **07-19-2015, 07:53 PM**

(07-19-2015, 07:40 PM)Sin Wrote: Check time stamps!

And yeah, this is way older than I thought. You all can just ignore everything I said.

Seriphyn · **07-19-2015, 09:21 PM**

Was it already mentioned that someone from the lore team explicitly stated Fantasia is a metaitem and not canonical?

Kage · **07-19-2015, 11:51 PM**

(07-19-2015, 09:21 PM)Seriphyn Wrote: Was it already mentioned that someone from the lore team explicitly stated Fantasia is a metaitem and not canonical?

"explicitly" stated, as in a paraphrased account of someone on tumblr talking to some people in the team out on a lunch/dinner meeting.

Yep.

Kasumi Gakunin · **07-20-2015, 01:28 AM**

(07-19-2015, 11:51 PM)Kage Wrote:
(07-19-2015, 09:21 PM)Seriphyn Wrote: Was it already mentioned that someone from the lore team explicitly stated Fantasia is a metaitem and not canonical?
"explicitly" stated, as in a paraphrased account of someone on tumblr talking to some people in the team out on a lunch/dinner meeting.

Yep.

-Basically- an informal interview posted on tumblr with someone from the translation team is now an excuse for people to actively refuse to rp with people who use fantasia ic. Our fc gained three new members after they left another fc because of such rudeness. Until I see an official statement sanctioned by SE from someone who actually works for the lore development/story telling part of FFXIV saying fantasia doesn't exist in Eorzea I'm not going to have an issue with role players using fantasia IC.

Saefinn · **07-20-2015, 03:14 AM**

The alternate method I prefer to Fantasia is glamours. Because we see reference to them within lore...plus avoids a certain number of issues.

Saefinn got really drunk once, then woke up as a Lalafell and couldn't remember what happened...He was glamoured for a practical joke. So I got to play as a Lala for a few weeks.

But if a person uses Fantasia, I won't make an issue of it.

Virella · **07-20-2015, 06:10 AM**

Glamours are the way to go instead Smile

In the AST questline you see a heap of people glamoured, to the point you have to pick the right person by speech and not by looks; to avoid further spoilers I will leave it with that!

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