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**Unnamed Mercenary** · **11-03-2015, 01:27 PM**

(11-03-2015, 01:24 PM)Madda Wrote: Wish Madda could get the Artifact gear, but it's 50 > o>

Hmm? No. All but the chest piece is from the lvel 45 quests. So you can get headpiece, hands, legs and boots.

Kage · **11-03-2015, 01:32 PM**

(11-03-2015, 01:23 PM)Zekikikikiki Wrote:
(11-03-2015, 01:17 PM)Kage Wrote:
(11-03-2015, 01:13 PM)Zekikikikiki Wrote:
(11-03-2015, 01:05 PM)Kage Wrote: Defiance is like 25% HP increase as well improving HP recovery via curing magic by 20% and reduces damage by like 25%.

Defiance doesn't offer any reduced damage like Grit or Shield Oath does. Which is why most people stay in Deliverance anyway for the damage except in some fights when you have to switch.
It reduces outgoing damage. However most warriors do a piss poor job of using their defensive cooldowns which means they do a piss poor job at tanking with Deliverance. Along with hate issues. Just because Defiance does not reduce damage taken by the warrior does not mean you should be staying in Deliverance.

I misread. At any rate, I didn't have much if any problems holding aggro as a WAR while leveling. I'd say I'm a halfway decent tank. I only stay in Defiance long enough to build 5 stacks of Wrath then I switch to Deliverance for the rest of the fight. WARs have the easiest time holding aggro in my opinion at least.

I edited the post to better reflect where the reduction is at. I would agree that Deliverance is good with a decent Warrior. I have sadly met far too many Warrior who should not be using Deliverance.

I can only imagine that the issues in vault (along with just the high damage spike being put out by the mobs) are from broken gear, old gear, or poor cooldown management (either in what and where they are used or when).

Nothing beats a Paladin using all of their cooldowns before a shield lob (Yes. Hallowed, Bullwark, Foresight, Fight or Flight, Rampart, Sentinel, Awareness, Tempered Will, Bloodbath, and Convalescence. All at once. Before the boss was pulled.)

(11-03-2015, 01:27 PM)Unnamed Mercenary Wrote:
(11-03-2015, 01:24 PM)Madda Wrote: Wish Madda could get the Artifact gear, but it's 50 > o>

Hmm? No. All but the chest piece is from the lvel 45 quests. So you can get headpiece, hands, legs and boots.

I've heard some jobs had things changed. I think some award the pieces differently what with the HW equipment thingamajigs. However I think for most jobs you should still only be missing the chest piece at lvl 45. You should be able to get a lvl 44 chest piece however. I think the Marketboard has one that I think you can get from Darkhold if you can't run it forever. or get HQ crafted.

Definitely make sure your accessories and main hand are decent too!!
I've met a WHM doing Fates in Northern Thanalan, sorta new. They had lvl 20 accessories and their main hand was lvl 30 etc. They had kept getting kicked out of dungeons because their healing was just not good because of the poor equipment.

Edda · **11-03-2015, 01:34 PM**

(11-03-2015, 01:22 PM)Warren Castille Wrote:
(11-03-2015, 01:14 PM)Edda Wrote: I've not leveled a tank class past 50 yet, so I'm no expert, but from my own experiences in The Vault, the best tanks stagger their CDs. That does not mean one is always up at every moment, but they are present enough to make a difference, believe me. A good tank that uses their CDS properly is far more than just a tank that takes less damage, as well, at least for me.
Â When I do not have to baby a tank, I get to DPS instead, which allows trash pulls to drop much faster, thus lessening the importance of the duration of tank CDs.

Not all healers do this, however, and I'm not willing to give up my damage in order to see what that's like, so... No comment there. The Vault is the only HW dungeon where I've had to give up most of my damage to baby crappy tanks, though, since the damage can be pretty unreal. I just wanted my exp.

Perhaps I'm undervaluing how far they go, then; How you describe them is how I've always hit cooldowns through dungeons. I haven't had a problem in any of the new dungeons that weren't related to mechanics specifically, so I'll just check my tank privilege at the door and back out of the conversation.

:cactuar:

Yeah you know me, biggest privilege checker on this side of the Internet. Seriously you'd think tanks staggering CDs would be basic knowledge, but some tanks just don't use them... ever! At all! Then again one tank that I had that never used CDs in The Vault I also had to ask to stop spinning the mobs with a monk and ninja in the group... And no, he wasn't dodging anything, just... spinning. It's a doggy dog world out there in DF... Keep staggering your CDs and godspeed.

Warren Castille · **11-03-2015, 01:42 PM**

(11-03-2015, 01:34 PM)Edda Wrote:
(11-03-2015, 01:22 PM)Warren Castille Wrote:
(11-03-2015, 01:14 PM)Edda Wrote: I've not leveled a tank class past 50 yet, so I'm no expert, but from my own experiences in The Vault, the best tanks stagger their CDs. That does not mean one is always up at every moment, but they are present enough to make a difference, believe me. A good tank that uses their CDS properly is far more than just a tank that takes less damage, as well, at least for me.
Â When I do not have to baby a tank, I get to DPS instead, which allows trash pulls to drop much faster, thus lessening the importance of the duration of tank CDs.

Not all healers do this, however, and I'm not willing to give up my damage in order to see what that's like, so... No comment there. The Vault is the only HW dungeon where I've had to give up most of my damage to baby crappy tanks, though, since the damage can be pretty unreal. I just wanted my exp.

Perhaps I'm undervaluing how far they go, then; How you describe them is how I've always hit cooldowns through dungeons. I haven't had a problem in any of the new dungeons that weren't related to mechanics specifically, so I'll just check my tank privilege at the door and back out of the conversation.

Yeah you know me, biggest privilege checker on this side of the Internet. Seriously you'd think tanks staggering CDs would be basic knowledge, but some tanks just don't use them... ever! At all! Then again one tank that I had that never used CDs in The Vault I also had to ask to stop spinning the mobs with a monk and ninja in the group... And no, he wasn't dodging anything, just... spinning. It's a doggy dog world out there in DF... Keep staggering your CDs and godspeed.

Yeah, I wasn't able to phrase that without sounding like an asshole. I think the train of thought goes like this: "I should save this for a boss, or in case I really need it!" Then they sit on CDs like they're items in an actual FF game and only hit them if shit has already hit the fan.

I just like using the phrase "tank privilege." It explains so many conveniences in the game!

Kage · **11-03-2015, 01:45 PM**

(11-03-2015, 01:42 PM)Warren Castille Wrote: Yeah, I wasn't able to phrase that without sounding like an asshole. I think the train of thought goes like this: "I should save this for a boss, or in case I really need it!" Then they sit on CDs like they're items in an actual FF game and only hit them if shit has already hit the fan.

I apologize to Madda for the thread derailment that has come out.

But honestly I've met many tanks who say this (even in the RP community or more casual RP etc) "if you need to use cooldowns in trash you're not good" or that the healers are not good. Or "no you don't need to use cooldowns in trash ever."

My opinion of said people is not good.

Nebbs · **11-03-2015, 01:48 PM**

(11-03-2015, 02:01 AM)Madda Wrote: Within 30 minutes, all of Madda's equipment was broken. What a horrible trial. Pic related

I recently did this onÂ sastasha as healer, had to swap in junk items to finish the dungeon.

This being your first time, I bet Garuda was alsoÂ

"When will people learn to mechanics?"

[Image: tumblr_n8jc0dX2KT1racgo0o1_r4_500.gif]

[Image: tumblr_n8jc0dX2KT1racgo0o1_r4_500.gif]

Swashbuckler · **11-03-2015, 01:49 PM**

(11-03-2015, 01:45 PM)Kage Wrote: But honestly I've met many tanks who say this (even in the RP community or more casual RP etc) "if you need to use cooldowns in trash you're not good" or that the healers are not good. Or "no you don't need to use cooldowns in trash ever."

My opinion of said people is not good.

So that means I'm a trash WAR for these people because I don't like sitting on 5 stacks of Wrath for too long and use Inner Beast and Steel Cyclone, and I also use Foresight...

-no longer matters- · **11-03-2015, 01:52 PM**

(11-03-2015, 01:49 PM)Swashbuckler Wrote:
(11-03-2015, 01:45 PM)Kage Wrote: But honestly I've met many tanks who say this (even in the RP community or more casual RP etc) "if you need to use cooldowns in trash you're not good" or that the healers are not good. Or "no you don't need to use cooldowns in trash ever."

My opinion of said people is not good.

So that means I'm a trash WAR for these people because I don't like sitting on 5 stacks of Wrath for too long and use Inner Beast and Steel Cyclone, and I also use Foresight...

I also used CDs on every pull as a DRK. I forgot actually playing your class makes you bad somehow. I usually counter those people by sayin.. I'm sorry I'm not lazy?

Madda · **11-03-2015, 02:03 PM**

(11-03-2015, 01:27 PM)Unnamed Mercenary Wrote:
(11-03-2015, 01:24 PM)Madda Wrote: Wish Madda could get the Artifact gear, but it's 50 > o>

Hmm? No. All but the chest piece is from the lvel 45 quests. So you can get headpiece, hands, legs and boots.

According to the WHM quest, the quest rewards of gear is all Level 50.

SO even if Madda did get them, it'd be useless.

Swashbuckler · **11-03-2015, 02:07 PM**

(11-03-2015, 02:03 PM)Madda Wrote:
(11-03-2015, 01:27 PM)Unnamed Mercenary Wrote:
(11-03-2015, 01:24 PM)Madda Wrote: Wish Madda could get the Artifact gear, but it's 50 > o>

Hmm? No. All but the chest piece is from the lvel 45 quests. So you can get headpiece, hands, legs and boots.
According to the WHM quest, the quest rewards of gear is all Level 50.

SO even if Madda did get them, it'd be useless.

Perhaps you are confused..? Huh

The item level of the artifact gear that you get at lv 45 is 50 for the the head, gloves, pants, and shoes/boots.

The item level of the artifact gear that you get at lv 50 is 55 for the chest.

-no longer matters- · **11-03-2015, 02:07 PM**

(11-03-2015, 02:03 PM)Madda Wrote:
(11-03-2015, 01:27 PM)Unnamed Mercenary Wrote:
(11-03-2015, 01:24 PM)Madda Wrote: Wish Madda could get the Artifact gear, but it's 50 > o>

Hmm? No. All but the chest piece is from the lvel 45 quests. So you can get headpiece, hands, legs and boots.
According to the WHM quest, the quest rewards of gear is all Level 50.

SO even if Madda did get them, it'd be useless.

You get level 45 versions and 50 versions (since 3.0) Madda of everything except chest.

**Unnamed Mercenary** · **11-03-2015, 02:09 PM**

(11-03-2015, 02:03 PM)Madda Wrote:
(11-03-2015, 01:27 PM)Unnamed Mercenary Wrote:
(11-03-2015, 01:24 PM)Madda Wrote: Wish Madda could get the Artifact gear, but it's 50 > o>

Hmm? No. All but the chest piece is from the lvel 45 quests. So you can get headpiece, hands, legs and boots.
According to the WHM quest, the quest rewards of gear is all Level 50.

SO even if Madda did get them, it'd be useless.

AF gear is some of the first stuff where you have equip level and item level.

So while the gear is item level 50, you can equip it at 45. The chest piece is equip level 50, item level 55, I think.

All of 2.1-2.55 content will be equip level 50 of some sort, followed by a higher item level. It's how SE did gear progression. Smile

McBeefâ„¢ · **11-03-2015, 02:10 PM**

(11-03-2015, 02:09 PM)Unnamed Mercenary Wrote:
(11-03-2015, 02:03 PM)Madda Wrote:
(11-03-2015, 01:27 PM)Unnamed Mercenary Wrote:
(11-03-2015, 01:24 PM)Madda Wrote: Wish Madda could get the Artifact gear, but it's 50 > o>

Hmm? No. All but the chest piece is from the lvel 45 quests. So you can get headpiece, hands, legs and boots.
According to the WHM quest, the quest rewards of gear is all Level 50.

SO even if Madda did get them, it'd be useless.

AF gear is some of the first stuff where you have equip level and item level.

So while the gear is item level 50, you can equip it at 45. The chest piece is equip level 50, item level 55, I think.

All of 2.1-2.55 content will be equip level 50 of some sort, followed by a higher item level. It's how SE did gear progression.

Nah, all green gear has higher item level than equip level.

The lvl 15 stuff from Satasha is ilvl17 for example. All Blue and Purple gear too.

Kage · **11-03-2015, 02:18 PM**

(11-03-2015, 02:07 PM)Gwen - Dinah Wrote:
(11-03-2015, 02:03 PM)Madda Wrote:
(11-03-2015, 01:27 PM)Unnamed Mercenary Wrote:
(11-03-2015, 01:24 PM)Madda Wrote: Wish Madda could get the Artifact gear, but it's 50 > o>

Hmm? No. All but the chest piece is from the lvel 45 quests. So you can get headpiece, hands, legs and boots.
According to the WHM quest, the quest rewards of gear is all Level 50.

SO even if Madda did get them, it'd be useless.
You get level 45 versions and 50 versions (since 3.0) Madda of everything except chest.

Yes, so according to gamerescape, the 3.0 update changes to the Job quest gear is this:

Previously:
Lvl 45 Job quest will give you Head, Wrist, Pants, Boots gear that you can wear at lvl 45. (ilvl 50). Lvl 50 Job quest would give you lvl 50 (ilvl 55) Chest Piece.

Now:
Lvl 45 Job quest gives you lvl 45 and lvl 50 Head, Wrist, Pants, boots (lvl 50 gear is ilvl 90). (8 pieces total)
Lvl 50 Job quest gives you lvl 50 Chest Pieces (ilvl 55, ilvl 90) (2 pieces total)

Zezeki · **11-03-2015, 02:18 PM**

I got distracted with the mention of tanks. Bad tanks just make me sad.

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