(06-23-2015, 06:06 PM)Zyrusticae Wrote: Japanese and English in particular have so many enormous grammatical, stylistic, and cultural differences between the two that a literal translation is barely even comprehensible to native English speakers.

(06-29-2015, 04:32 PM)Kaniko Niko Wrote: But I do know enough that every time I see people hark and place "the Japanese version" of anything on a pedestal I immediately get the referee to raise the yellow card.

I'm going to say it: It stinks of weeaboo.

(06-30-2015, 10:22 AM)Sylentmana Wrote:  And don't even get me started on the rogues in Limsa.  I can't even understand half of what comes out of their mouths.

(06-29-2015, 05:52 PM)allgivenover Wrote:

(06-23-2015, 06:06 PM)Zyrusticae Wrote: Japanese and English in particular have so many enormous grammatical, stylistic, and cultural differences between the two that a literal translation is barely even comprehensible to native English speakers.

This.

(06-30-2015, 10:39 AM)Aya Wrote: That said, I find it pretty silly that "thee" is being used to try to make the language sound more polite.  The plural "you" was the more polite and formal way of saying the singular "thou", and that's why it eventually ate "thou" and replaced it!  That it now sounds more formal to some ears.. is a precious irony! ^_^

(06-30-2015, 04:09 PM)Tabris Wrote: hmmm, I believe the localization team has been doing its damnedest to make the English script as meaningful and intelligible as possible, yes. but I really feel there is some nuance lost at times.

Show Content

patch 2.5 content spoilers!!I just finished the Chrysalis and the part where Nabriales is destroyed, well. I feel the Japanese dialogue feels better with regards to tone. when Moenbryda sacrifices herself to contribute more aether to the Blade of Light, Nabriales cries out in protest something to the effect of, 'No! I am immortal! I am eternal...!' but the Japanese audio is literally more like, 'No! I'm fading! I'm fading, I'm fading, I'm fading...!' and I don't know, it lends more desperation to the whole situation. it shows us, rather than tells us, how incredible and unprecedented the extinguishing of an Ascian soul really is.

as someone who dabbles in JP -> ENG translation, I get the fact that literal translations sometimes make little sense, but I agree with the OP's point. translation is more than just converting words to another language because there aren't always equivalent words and concepts, and a good translator understands that and adapts to their audience. but still, it does feel as if little bits and pieces of the dialogue are lost in translation.

(06-30-2015, 05:16 PM)ZacharyVolfire Wrote: -raises hand- I can attempt to translate any old Kanji and Katakana you may need.

My grandma didn't teach me Hiragana so no luck there though.

(06-30-2015, 09:26 PM)SM Nick Wrote: Exactly. I only wish to convey what is actually supposed to be represented. I want to regain that which was lost in translation.

(06-30-2015, 12:07 PM)Lilia Lia Wrote:

(06-29-2015, 04:32 PM)Kaniko Niko Wrote: But I do know enough that every time I see people hark and place "the Japanese version" of anything on a pedestal I immediately get the referee to raise the yellow card.

I'm going to say it: It stinks of weeaboo.

I think you're making an adverse assumption here that's a little unfair.  The OP was asking if there was a translation of the original Japanese anywhere that didn't have everyone "sounding British" like we see in the English script.  Nobody has said that the Japanese script is "better."  It's just that the English script is eye-rollingly bloated at times and it gives you a feeling like the grass might possibly be greener on the other side of the fence.

I'm glad that you highlighted the untranslatable nuance with your very helpful example though because it gives a lot of perspective.  It's just that the overly formal tone of the English script tends to make the characters' lines feel artificial or belaboured when they ought to be more spontaneous.  "Is aught amiss?" is hardly something you'd hear a person saying frantically after seeing something shocking happen.  It sounds more like something a person would say to another over a cup of tea and with general disinterest as to whether aught actually was amiss. 

Regardless of whether it's intended to "evoke an older time and place," it does the script a disservice by making it come off as less genuine. 

(06-30-2015, 09:45 PM)Unnamed Mercenary Wrote:

(06-30-2015, 09:26 PM)SM Nick Wrote: Exactly. I only wish to convey what is actually supposed to be represented. I want to regain that which was lost in translation.

I would only want to further remind that there isn't "translating" being done with this game. Unless you mean from plain English to the modified English that the NPCs speak. FFXIV doesn't have a Japanese script that is then translated into English and then localized. All of the scripts are written together. I wouldn't doubt that each localization/lore team probably gets a different task and then they share notes.

It's a very different process than say, translating anime or manga from Japanese and trying to keep the same feeling/jokes. When translation goes from Language A -> Language B, there's going to be loss. But when Languages A, B, C, D are working on the same thing together, there isn't really a "source" or "original" language a script would originate from. ...so one could say the English script of the game is as much source material (it's been confirmed that the English team in particular writes a lot of the non-MSQ lore, levequests, etc) as the Japanese, French and German versions. ...they just really go all out on our script because English is very flexible to include older/archaic terms.

(06-30-2015, 09:46 PM)Kaniko Niko Wrote:

(06-30-2015, 12:07 PM)Lilia Lia Wrote:

(06-29-2015, 04:32 PM)Kaniko Niko Wrote: But I do know enough that every time I see people hark and place "the Japanese version" of anything on a pedestal I immediately get the referee to raise the yellow card.

I'm going to say it: It stinks of weeaboo.

I think you're making an adverse assumption here that's a little unfair.  The OP was asking if there was a translation of the original Japanese anywhere that didn't have everyone "sounding British" like we see in the English script.  Nobody has said that the Japanese script is "better."  It's just that the English script is eye-rollingly bloated at times and it gives you a feeling like the grass might possibly be greener on the other side of the fence.

I'm glad that you highlighted the untranslatable nuance with your very helpful example though because it gives a lot of perspective.  It's just that the overly formal tone of the English script tends to make the characters' lines feel artificial or belaboured when they ought to be more spontaneous.  "Is aught amiss?" is hardly something you'd hear a person saying frantically after seeing something shocking happen.  It sounds more like something a person would say to another over a cup of tea and with general disinterest as to whether aught actually was amiss. 

Regardless of whether it's intended to "evoke an older time and place," it does the script a disservice by making it come off as less genuine. 

I'll freely admit that even after editing my post to seem less barbarous, it was still rather caustic. While I apologize if there has been some friction, I stand firm by my words and shan't take them back.

However, there's another thing I'd much like to point out about the examples I've given since you've brought up a very good point about "how people really speak". Out of those five examples I've given you, only two of them are actually used in anything resembling modern Japanese—the first two. The other three of them, while grammatically correct, simply aren't used in the Japanese lexicon outside of fiction or someone attempting to be ironic. It's pretty much the Flowery Elizabethan English of Japanese. You may hear the Kansai dialect used in the last example, but mostly to stoke the fires of Osakan pride during Hanshin Tigers games.

While I cannot rightly deny that the overall recording and voice acting of the Japanese version tends to be more polished in spots than the English version, to disregard the scope of effort that went into capturing the very essence of what the narrative calls for in the English version: the accents, the startlingly correct period-English, the transliteration of tropes into their Occidental counterparts...

I'll say it again. It stinks of weeaboo.

(06-30-2015, 09:46 PM)Kaniko Niko Wrote:

(06-30-2015, 12:07 PM)Lilia Lia Wrote:

(06-29-2015, 04:32 PM)Kaniko Niko Wrote: But I do know enough that every time I see people hark and place "the Japanese version" of anything on a pedestal I immediately get the referee to raise the yellow card.

I'm going to say it: It stinks of weeaboo.

I think you're making an adverse assumption here that's a little unfair.  The OP was asking if there was a translation of the original Japanese anywhere that didn't have everyone "sounding British" like we see in the English script.  Nobody has said that the Japanese script is "better."  It's just that the English script is eye-rollingly bloated at times and it gives you a feeling like the grass might possibly be greener on the other side of the fence.

I'm glad that you highlighted the untranslatable nuance with your very helpful example though because it gives a lot of perspective.  It's just that the overly formal tone of the English script tends to make the characters' lines feel artificial or belaboured when they ought to be more spontaneous.  "Is aught amiss?" is hardly something you'd hear a person saying frantically after seeing something shocking happen.  It sounds more like something a person would say to another over a cup of tea and with general disinterest as to whether aught actually was amiss. 

Regardless of whether it's intended to "evoke an older time and place," it does the script a disservice by making it come off as less genuine. 

I'll freely admit that even after editing my post to seem less barbarous, it was still rather caustic. While I apologize if there has been some friction, I stand firm by my words and shan't take them back.

However, there's another thing I'd much like to point out about the examples I've given since you've brought up a very good point about "how people really speak". Out of those five examples I've given you, only two of them are actually used in anything resembling modern Japanese—the first two. The other three of them, while grammatically correct, simply aren't used in the Japanese lexicon outside of fiction or someone attempting to be ironic. It's pretty much the Flowery Elizabethan English of Japanese. You may hear the Kansai dialect used in the last example, but mostly to stoke the fires of Osakan pride during Hanshin Tigers games.

While I cannot rightly deny that the overall recording and voice acting of the Japanese version tends to be more polished in spots than the English version, to disregard the scope of effort that went into capturing the very essence of what the narrative calls for in the English version: the accents, the startlingly correct period-English, the transliteration of tropes into their Occidental counterparts...

I'll say it again. It stinks of weeaboo.